Manic Typist

Re: Paladin help

Also, I just had a sudden thought.

What exactly is this deity like?

Do they want trade for the sake of enhancing cultures, increasing communication, and bettering the lives of all parties?

Or is it all about the almight dollar?

In which case, their agendas and actions would have very subtle but very important differences.

Even powers, such as the "No Liars Allowed" spell, would be exhibited differently. If the goddess is more benevolent, it would most likely cause any person attempting to lie to cough and splutter, or even just say the truth.

If they are more........ harsh, it might inflict agony upon them everytime they tell a direct lie, but they can still mislead you and use ambiguous phrases. This is representative of cut-throat wheelings and dealings, in which the goddess gives you an edge..... but if you aren't smart enough to look out for loopholes and the like..... well, she is a harsh mistress.

AmadanNaBriona: I love your sig. I've done some research online, but I have not been able to find anything that explains overall what the "Fool of Forth" is. I've only found excerpts of legends talking about it, not actually explaining what it represented etc. Can you offer any insights?

Re: Role-Playing Exercise #1

I'm not a playboy! I'm an enterprenur!

I want to supply your weapons for your next war!

Basically.

But......... I still might chase the skirts too hehe.

Re: Knockback on the moon?

To keep things simple and straight forward, I might recommend this that you divide Earth normal gravity by the Moon's (in this case .16), then take that number you get and use it to multiply all knockback distances.

I think that would be sexy. Just handwave everything else.

Re: Paladin help

Wow. This sounds like a really sexy character concept actually.

First, you would want to give powers reflecting the nature of his god. So, rather than "Turn Undead," perhaps a "Turn Liar?" That is, a spell that allows no false words to be spoken in its area, etc.

Maybe a spell like a "Universal Translator."

I'm sure you could work all that out.

Now, depending on his rank and his particular history, this character is going to have some interesting outlooks.

For instance, seeing as how he is apparently from a very sea-trade heavy society, he will most likely prefer either the open ocean or large ports. He will be very muticultural, and always looking for new ideas and experiences, so that he can help interconnect everything in trade.

He would have to be literate, and fairly intelligent.

Would he trade in slaves? I don't know.

He would need knowledge skills concerning governments, bureacracy, trade minutia, area, region, or world, as well as cultures and a few cities.

Numerous contacts in numerous fields. Suppliers, merchants, other traveling traders, ship captains, militia commanders, maybe even a pirate: all people he would most likely have to deal with on multiple occasions, especially if there is a lot of danger involved in trading.

How's that?

Re: Role-Playing Exercise #1

Zeke Burchenoff, of Burchenoff Weapons Industries (Problem Solving through Powered Armor!), a member of the Burchenoff family, who are a major arms producer for most of the Confederation. He is high level contract bidder and salesmen, always looking to make a deal with the military, private organizations, and even seedier things at times............

This ride could be quite lucrative, with many very rich people about who want to protect their very valuable things.

Re: Star Wars - Balancing Jedi with everyone else and heroic vs. superheroic

Sorry' date=' MT, but I don't think your argument makes the least bit of sense. You're essentially arguing that a laser sword capable of cutting through anything is worthless at close range. Of course you don't see the Jedi throwing a lot of joint locks and finger strikes: why go for the 6d6N attack when you're carrying a 6d6[u']K[/u] attack?

 

 

 

 

bigdamnhero

“Aren’t you a little short for a stormtrooper?”

No, but I do believe that a lightsaber would only MAYBE be marginally more useful than a regular sword.

Now, remember, I am talking CLOSE range. At this distance, the combatant could completely negate the lighsaber by merely continually pushing the hilt and hands to the outside of the fight. Remember, the blade has to actually be brought to bear. The lightsaber suffers from the same "Don't let them inside your arm reach" disadvantage that all swords suffer.

Now, a lightsaber is lighter (haha) and therefore can be moved more quickly, so the commando would have to be on top of things, and you can't block the edge like you might with a normal sword, so he would have to continually attack the Jedi's weapon arm.

Inu- Basically, all my posts were trying to get at is that I do not fully approve of the on screen representation of Jedi, because from the concept stuff I have been exposed to, the screen either falls completely short of them or is even directly misleading.

And, I do not think the weapons should make the character. But the Jedi are completely dependent upon the Force and their lightsabers. This is in direct contradiction with both their philosophy and good sense.

Re: Star Wars - Balancing Jedi with everyone else and heroic vs. superheroic

The Jedi destroyed themselves with their flawed beliefs, or their failure to hold true to aspects of those beliefs when they really should have.

Kind of tragic, but also just really irksome. It wasn't made to be tragic, it was just completely ignored, thus making them hypocrites to me.

Re: Star Wars - Balancing Jedi with everyone else and heroic vs. superheroic

Yes, but these "few basic attempts" do indicate the presence of some sort of training. Anybody can throw a kick or attempt a sweep maneuver, but these were all remniscent of actual martial arts. Admittedly, I'm no black belt, but I have taken some martial arts here and there.

 

In regards to the deflecting an open palm strike, you are correct and in turn, a Jedi could come up with something else.

 

 

If the movies are purely where you draw your information from, then the Commando units we have seen, specifically clone warriors and the ice troopers on Hoth, never indicated the ability to fight unarmed. They ran around with blaster rifles and some sort of polymer armor. Mind you they are very good at using those blasters and I certainly wouldn't want to be on the receiving end of a "fire for effect" maneuver.

 

Chances are, and please correct me if I am wrong, you are drawing on knowledge concerning commando units that are outside the scope of observable behavior from the movies. That's okay, but expect that others will also do so.

 

I would never expect you to do so on my behalf. I think your position is an arguable one and I have chosen to argue the opposite side.

 

And this is where we agree. If the commando can dictate the terms of battle, then he stands a huge chance of succeeding. A much larger chance than, say, the two of them meeting in an alley and starting a fist fight.

 

 

 

 

 

True.

Agreed.

Point.

No, you are exactly right, and this is a huge flaw in my reasoning which I will try to clarify.

If I'm wrong, I'm gonna tell ya I'm wrong. At least, if you convince me that I am wrong. Anything else and I would be a prick.

Ok, that is hilarious. "So a Jedi and commando meet in an alley and..." Repped.

I guess my whole point is that I was using real life perceptions of commandos, and conceptions of what possible advancements in training would be made by the time of the Star Wars universe, to argue the viewpoint that although Jedi are indubitably not something to be trifled with, I think commandos are better trained.

Now, as I have only really seen the movies when it comes to Star Wars... that is all I have to operate on.

See, I believe that Jedi are amazingly sexy as a concept (Note: I have a habit of using the word sexy to mean "cool." Unless it is actually sensual, in which case it is SEXY, and it is also automaticaly sexy as well. ), I think that their typical representation on screen really doesn't live up to what I believe it could be, nor what I have been lead to believe by talking to some truly hardcore Star Wars fans (who have read most of the books etc).

Thus, I think that as presented on screen, a commando's training (from something more real life based) is far more grueling, comprehensive, and balanced than a Jedi's.

And that just don't sound right to me.

Re: Star Wars - Balancing Jedi with everyone else and heroic vs. superheroic

Yes! Because we never saw it in the films, that means it didn't exist!

 

The characters also do not need to eat... well, Anakin does, but Obi-Wan apparently doesn't. Nor do any of them excrete any substance.

 

Therefore, all SW characters should buy 'need not eat'. And possibly reduced sleeping, because how often did we see that happen?

 

Seriously, if you have the choice between 'lightsabre' and 'punch', 9 out of 10 Jedi choose 'lightsabre'. It's a better choice. In the duels, we see them throwing punches and the like as secondary attacks. Often, force-enhanced punches (see Darth Maul vs Obi-Wan). The jedi clearly have more training than just 'use the force' - I mean, they start using lightsabres at age, what, six? To assume that they get by purely on force knowledge is nonsensical.

 

With lightsabre, 99% chance, jedi wins. We saw a 12-14 year old jedi apprentice fight off a half-dozen commandos for several seconds, even deflecting bolts back against a few. Add on ten or more years of experience, and there you have your basic jedi.

 

Yes, a commando vs unarmed Jedi would be able to put up a fight. As much because of their armour as anything else. But they're goin' down. And if the Jedi has their lightsabre, I'd like to see the commando try to get in that close.

Um, wow, you sarcasm is cute, but since I stated that I was running strictly by movies........ at the very get go........ well, it's just completely nontopical.

Because, see, I'm sure in the books, there's plenty of reasons justifying why the Jedi in fact are NOT completely overrated.

Because, they are supposed to be well-rounded. They aren't. They arrogant. They are heavily trained in one area, not in another.

I never stated that if a commando faced a Jedi with a saber, starting at range, that they would win.

This is because a saber, though amazingly sexy, are completely cheap weapons. They are gankers. Whatever.

I only said that once within the saber reach, the commando would be in his turf.

My point is this: Jedi are not nearly as hardcore as they appear because: A) They rely too much upon the Force and They rely too much upon their lightsabers.

Two-trick ponies.

And Massey?

No. Luke's PT training, though admirable, and certainly more grueling than anything I could probably take, is nothing compared to what a truly elite commando goes through.

You raise a point. I have never seen a Jedi wookie. Why is that?

Re: Star Wars - Balancing Jedi with everyone else and heroic vs. superheroic

Actually' date=' both Obi-Wan and Anakin show some unarmed skill, though in this category, Obi-wan seems to have more prowess. In [i']Attack of the Clones[/i], Obo-Wan clearly demonstrates some maneuvers, including a flying kick remniscient of Tae Kwon Do and fights Jango Fett unarmed through most of a close quarters combat. I would call the fight a draw, as Jango hopped into Slave-1 and flew off. In Revenge of the Sith Obi-Wan again shows that he has some training when he (foolishly) tries to kick out General Greivous' leg. The technique and form are there.

 

I have to disagree with your supposition about lightsabers based on two observed details from the movies. The first is that lightsabers slice through flesh like warm butter. It wouldn't take a great deal of physical exertion to do the same to the commando. Then there is the style used by both Obi-Wan and Anakin during their big duel in which both Jedi used quick, close in maneuvers.

 

 

Luke Skywalker was able to lift C3PO while having both hands bound. Now I will admit that he appeared to have to concentrate a little harder, so this may not be an appropriate defense in a hand to hand combat situation. (EDIT) Once again, in Revenge of the Sith, both Obi-Wan and Anakin used "gestures" that appeared to be a short open palmed strike. If that is all they need to send the Commando flying, then that also negates the assumption that a Jedi is incapable of hand to hand combat without his saber.

 

Still, I have to give the hand to hand to Jedi and I fear we may have to settle on an agree to disagree situation. On the other hand, while trained in close quarters combat, it's not the Commando's specialty. Ambush, deception, traps and surprise are. If the Commando has the time to plan a proper tactical battle, his training wins over Jedi arrogance.

Well, a few basic attempts do not constitute training.

Open palm strikes can be deflected, by turning them to the side.

However, since two people claim that they demonstrate more martial skill than I can recall, I will do as suggested and review the movies once more, specifically looking for instances of Jedi actually using their BODIES as weapons, sans lightsabers.

If I find I was incorrect, I will retract some of my statements.

I still say a commando fights smarter, and therefore could win. But it would have to be on conditions that they established. Fortunately, commandos are VERY good at doing that, while Jedi are not.

Re: END feedback

This doesn't sound like a personal combat shield.

I mean, those are typically kept up constantly because you are in the thick of things, and can be attacked from any angle at any time. You need something already there, just in case.

To me, this sounds like a "delaying tactic" shield.

I'm sorry if I am being unclear, but bear with me.

This END feedback sounds like something a character would erect to buy his teammates time, most likely in the shape of of wall.

So, I would offer the limitations of: Cannot move (-1/2), Maintain Concentration (-1/2) and Gestures (-1/2)

Note, those limitation values I was guessing at, not reading from the book.

Let me offer a scenario:

Three characters are running down a corridor, trying to reach a very important computer console at the end, where they can install a deadly virus to destroy the complex's security network and allow the rebels to storm the base.

Magik, the groups mysticist, sees guards in hot pursuit behind them. He knows that it will take time to complete the upload.

"Go on ahead, I'll hold them back!" he shouts. His teammates glance over their shoulders in concern, but they keep running because they've been in tougher spots than this... they hope.

Magik stops at the last intersection before the console, and plants his feet wide, begining to wave his hands in mysterious and fluttering gestures. He clenches his jaw and furrows his brow, and he begins to sweat. A faint blue shimmer appears before him, running from wall to wall and ceiling to floor, bulging slightly outwards.

Which is a good thing, because split seconds after that a hail of gunfire slams into the force field and richochets back down the corridor.

Magik's face sets in a grim mask as he channels all of his energy into maintaing the field while his companions begin to hack through the firewall of the console..... wondering how long he can hold out against the increasing firepower of the soldiers on the other side of the field.....

Re: Star Wars - Balancing Jedi with everyone else and heroic vs. superheroic

 

 

 

Okay, I have to say that it is an even fight. If the Commando gets surprise, which is problematic and depends on which movie you're watching, he almost has the battle won hands down. A quick knife spot to a vital area and down goes the Jedi. If the Commando doesn't get surprise, the battle becomes a lot more interesting.

 

Even though the Jedi code prevents them from feeling anger, it apparently does not prevent them from killing en masse. Though to be fair, the droid army would hardly provide a moral quandry. I just don't see the Jedi having any problems with killing a soldier. So that equation is removed. On the other hand, the Jedi Mind Trick isn't going to work on the Commando. You never even see Obi-Wan try it on Jango, because he knows better. A run of the mill stormtrooper does not a commando make.

 

So, in the non-surprise scenario, it is Jedi training vs. Commando training. Hmmm. I have to give this one to the Jedi. In the absence of the primary weapon for each (gun or lightsaber), the Jedi would be much faster and that would be the deciding factor. Sure, the Commando has an edge over just about any non-Jedi. He is trained, conditioned and focused. Against the Jedi reflexes and ability to do one hell of a drop kick, he's going down. Maybe not easily, but he is going down. Couple that with the Jedi telekinesis ability and he just doesn't stand a chance. The Jedi doesn't even have to push or pull him. All he has to do is restrain him and the battle is over. Jedi wins. Doesn't even violate the stilted moral code.

 

Now, a face to face battle is not where Commando type units excel. It is subterfuge, ambush and using superior tactics. This is where the Jedi runs into problems. You see the Jedi in the prequels are arrogant. They depend on their superior mystical abilities. Heck, even Luke Skywalker does this in Return of the Jedi, when he walks into both Jabba's palace and Lord Vader's clutches. He is so confident in the Force that he forgets that he is mortal. This is where the Commando unit can use his training to the fullest. Ambushes, booby traps and coordinated attacks from superior tactical position and the Jedi is toast.

Nolgroth, I'm glad someone has finally taken the time to analyze this seriously.

First, I would contest that the Jedi are hypocritical for their callous killing of droids, because by Episode III many of the droids are self-aware and therefore "alive."

I completely agree on the point about the mind tricks.

A Jedi MAY be faster, but, I do not think (unless they were highly skilled in the use of the Force) that they would be able to maintain this advantage in the face of A) The fact that the average commando will have more sheer muscle power and the fact that once the commando gets a physical hold on the Jedi, they can't go ANYWHERE. Speed is negated. Leaving brawn. Also, the Jedi telekinesis would be of no use at close range. Because, all Jedi that I can remember seeing have relied upon gestures to help them focus and use their telekinesis. If a Jedi starts waving his hand towards the commando, once they are within arms' reach, the commando is just gonna grab his hand and snap it into a very unnatural angle.

Yes, they are extremely arrogant. Their biggest weakness.

-Greg:

I would give the Jedi 10:1 odds AGAINST them in hand-to-hand.

Why?

Because Jedi (to what I have seen from the movies ONLY, mind you) have NO hand-to-hand training.

That's right! The only close combat training they have is completely dependent upon: A) Having their saber or GETTING their saber.

They don't know how to punch, kick, block, break wrists, ANYTHING.

A commando does.

A lightsaber is completely useless once a commando is within arms' reach, because, like any sword, the cutting edge cannot be brought to bear. All the commando has to do is keep striking at those arms and pushing them to the side, and follow it up with strikes to critical organs etc while the Jedi's guard is opened.

Re: Variable Power Pools

 

Also, in a Fantasy Hero type game, by making all magic one VPP, it reduces some roleplaying options - who cares about getting into another mage's library or discovering a long lost tome of magic - your character can already do anything in the book anyway - if he has enough points in his VPP. This is fine in a superheroes game, but not so good in a Fantasy setting. For a fantasy setting, I would say have separate VPPs for each "school" of magic - and make people pay points for knowing "spell formulas". It requires a bit of work sorting out how it functions and can require some rule tweaking but it's worth it in the long run IMO.

Ah, but see, I wouldn't allow that at all. The VPP is just a mechanism explaining the cost of what I allow them. I would only allow them to use spells that they had learned. Thus, they might want another mage's books so they could learn more spells.

Great stuff guys, keep it coming!

Re: Star Wars - Balancing Jedi with everyone else and heroic vs. superheroic

Jedi can leap 40' into the air. Good luck getting into hand to hand.

Jedi can control minds. "I'm not the one you're looking for."

Jedi can see the future. Good luck ambushing them.

 

Commandos are basically stormtroopers in camoflage.

Yes, but if there's no where to land, they still come back down. And, well, the Jedi just gave up any objective that they have. Because a commando won't feel the need to chase down the Jedi just to prove something. He has a MISSION to accomplish.

Actually, no they can't. They can influence minds. A little. Only weak ones. Commandos are highly trained, highly disciplined, highly motivated, very smart individuals. "Um, I just crawled through 2 miles of sewers, crept past three security teams, retrieved my stashed gear from the bottom of a ravine, all just so I could be here now. I'm pretty sure you ARE the one I am looking for. Oh, and thanks for standing so close to me. Made my job that much easier. *crunch*"

And, actually, their presentience only applies to either A) incoming projectiles aimed specifically at them (they can sense the "intent" of the sniper basically) and really hazy notions of maybe futures that offer no practical benefit against a commando breaking your knees backwards, snapping your wrist, and then crushing your esophogus with the side of his hand.

I seriously think only a Dark Jedi could reasonably hold their own. Dark Jedi would probably smoke a commando.

Force Lighting works at close range. Hehehe.

Re: Variable Power Pools

And I just thought that it would be inappropriate for most of my magic systems...... since they are learned SPELLS......... not inherent powers. A psionicist is another matter.........

Demons, and certain kinds of magic, as well as elementals, that would be more appripriate for a VPP.

Still, do VPPs make it cheaper to afford spells?

'Cause then I could allow them to do it with the restriction of "Only with learned spells -1" and still let them save some points for elsewhere.

And..... what is PITA?

Just a quick question about those.

I have been interested in testing them out, yet I am a bit confused.

I think I understand the gist, but my GM claims that he likes to avoid VPPs.

The reason I find this confusing is that to me it looks like a reasonable way to allow characters to build their wizards' spells. That's how I've seen most of you guys draw up character sheets at least, of those posted. The GM makes us buy them as individual powers.

Now, I have no problem with this, but, as a GM, I have been considering letting my Fantasy campaigners buy spells via a VPP. I haven't had a chance to disucss in detail with the other GM, so I was wondering what sort of abuse or loopholes or gamebreaking aspects there are to VPPs that I should look out for, etc.

Oh, and this is for a Heroic level, 75+75 point campaign.

Re: Shattered Sun - A Star Hero campaign

Sounds perfect, except for the lack of gladitorial games.

I'm sure there are illegal venues for such things?

Re: Star Wars - Balancing Jedi with everyone else and heroic vs. superheroic

Typist' date=' are you forgetting the part in Attack of the Clones where a saberless Obi-Wan dukes it out with ubercommando Jango Fett, while the latter is wearing armor? How about the scene in Revenge of the Sith where Obi-Wan flings General Grievous against the wall with a wave of his hand? Your hypothesis is cute and all, but it just don't bear out.[/quote']

 

Um, I don't remember the first part, so maybe I should rewatch.

 

And the second one? It barely phased General Grievous, Grievous was a complete wimp, and it was used at a more medium range.

 

My "cute" theory has Jedi being made into gimps by commandos once within arm reach.

 

Because the all light Jedi powers are USELESS at close range.

Re: Shattered Sun - A Star Hero campaign

What is Traveler Hero?

Re: Star Wars - Balancing Jedi with everyone else and heroic vs. superheroic

See, I bet solid slug weapons would be mostly unheard of except on the most backwards of planets because of their inherent limitations: weight restirctions, lower ammo counts, ability to misfire, noise, etc.

Most places, laser weapons could be made with relatively little cost.

So, it would be unusual for someone to come after a Jedi with a solid slug weapon. But I think that is part of their weakness. They are built to defeat only ONE type of situation: the universe that they are used to. They really aren't as adaptable as they are made out to be.

And I think a good commando could move nearly as fast as a Jedi, and hit a whole lot harder and a whole lot smarter.

Re: Star Wars - Balancing Jedi with everyone else and heroic vs. superheroic

Sorry, I completely forgot I posted here! Haha!

Anyway. I think that most commandos could take on most Jedi. Why you ask?

Jedi can't fight worth a shiny nickle.

Seriously! Think about it. They have been given completely unstopabble weapons. So, they just need enough hand eye coordination to NOT hit themselves, and they can slaughter everything that moves (and most things that don't)!

No skill. The only time Jedi display any real martial skill is when fighting other Jedi, and maybe when they are deflecting lasers. But, that's more because of the Force anyway.

Also, I would be intersted in seeing what a solid slug would do if hit by a Jedi laser. I think it would just slide through it, with some damage, and impact into the fleshyness beneath.

But, once within arms reach (I.E. within the reach of the god-killing sabers)...... Jedi can't do jack. Their Force powers are virtually useless, and any decent commando would be able to deflect them. The commandos would use joint locks, strikes, and breaks to basically dismantle the Jedi piece by piece.

It would be hilarious to watch.

Re: Sex and the Single Superhuman

Style - Now in a serious relationship with Hexencat, another PC. Was briefly involved with Chisako, a Japanese heorine turned villainess.

 

Flesh Gordon - Has been involved with a long list of minor super-villainesses, starlets, news women, make-up girls, waitresess, flight attendants, and politicians. Most of them have attempted to kill him, to the point that it is now his standard first scene in any adventure.

 

Legend - Single, not involved with anyone at the moment, would be interested in a relationship but is probably too far on the Dad side of the Dad vs Cad scale to interest most supers, and would not date a normal for fear of the possible danger to her.

Do they try to kill Flesh before or AFTER the relationship has run its course?

Re: combat luck

Ah. My bad I'm sure. I'm still kinda stupid about all this. Forget obvious things, etc.

Re: combat luck

I just don't see why combat luck would be effected by night. To me, it wouldn't, as long as the character wasn't suprised by something. But if he was going into a firefight, and it was night, I would say he gets his luck.

Negatives to his DCV if he fails to see certain attacks maybe, but he is alert.

Re: combat luck

Ever met Kev?

No. I haven't.

Why?

Who is Kev?