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That's where I was going with it. We are essentially playing a Pathfinder game (set in Forgotten Realms) with Hero, since many of us are familiar with FR. In my case, I'm a rogue/assassin kind of guy looking to have my sneak attack damage without resorting to crazy stuff like Flame Bolt. In this case, sneak attack using hit location rules seems to make good sense. In short, this appears to be how it works: Example 1: Attacking with 1d6HKA dagger with a called shot to the head, with surprise a) Stun Applied to Defenses: 1d6x5x2= 35 STUN BODY Applied to Defenses: 1d6x2= 7 BODY Example 2: Attacking with 2d6N dagger with a called shot to the head, with surprise a) Stun Applied to Defenses: as normal (doubled for surprise), then doubled after applying to defenses as per hit location (28pts average) BODY Applied to Defenses: as normal, then doubled after applying to defenses as per hit location Combat Modifiers: -8OCV/2 (Hit location penalty adjusted for surprise), 1/2DCV Surprise So hitting at -4 penalty to strike the head from behind, but opponent is at 1/2DCV (at 8DCV these two modifiers wash each other out. Higher DCV is better for me.

So are yours. With surprise (out of combat), your 17.5 stun before being applied is actually 35 for the killing attack. And the N attack would be off as well. But I appreciate your clarifying my thinking so I could arrive at the correct answer.

Well that is certainly awesome, and I had forgotten it completely. And I shall note it down while the rest is pondered. I amend my preface to ask: I’m thinking about using called shots as sneak attack damage. For the sake of clarity, I will assume I have Penalty Skill Levels: +4 OCV vs. Hit Locations w/ Sneak Attack (4pts) which is offsetting the halved -8OCV Hit Location Modifier from surprise, and I shall not include any strength in terms of damage.

I’m thinking about using called shots as sneak attack damage. For the sake clarity, I will assume I have Penalty Skill Levels: +8 OCV vs. Hit Locations w/ Sneak Attack (8pts), and I shall not include any strength in terms of damage. Sneak Attack, Called Shot to the Head, And Assuming It Hits. Weapons are a 1d6KA knife and for comparison a 2d6N club Targeting the Head: -8OCV modifier, STUN5, BODYx2, N STUNx2. With Surprise (aka Out Of Combat) modifier is ½ DCV and STUNx2. Question: In this situation, I understand that a 1d6 dagger would do (by average damage rule) 6BODY and 60STUN. With a club we would have 2d6x(5)x2x2 which by average damage rule would be 120STUN. Question: I understand 8 Penalty Skill Levels: +8 OCV vs. Hit Locations w/ Sneak Attack to be righteous. Or is this a 2-pointer? Anything else I might have missed?

Hyper Man nailed it. I wasn't getting how the power was actually laid out. The 2nd example you gave answered it for me. Thank you!

I guess what I'm trying to say is I don't know how I would make this as a Power. This is right out of book, but it's an advantage. With 6" of running the 5pt cost means it's a 4pt power base cost. What I am guessing is mebbe 5pt Running 4", Invisible to Hearing Group (+1/4) (10 Active Points); Requires A Stealth Roll (Active Point penalty to Skill Roll is -1 per 5 Active Points; -1)

Ultimate MA pp81 has The Paths Of The Cat: Invisible Power Effects (Hearing Group; +¼) for up to 10” Running: 5 points. I don't get this. Can someone explain how this works? What is Invisible Power Effects applying to? Is it some kind of Naked Advantage? I thought it's a neat ability but I can't use it if I don't understand it.

I've been looking in the rulebook, and it appears that it is possible to use Haymaker and Spreading in conjunction with each other. So here's a scenario I'd like your comment on. Let's say I decided to Sweep a thrown dagger attack as a Haymaker using the spreading rules. (I'm assuming thrown daggers are still HtH and therefore use Sweep and receive STR bonuses to damage). So in this scenario, I can use the +4DC damage and convert it to +4OCV, in essence giving me [2] free attacks on my Sweep.

120 points, approximately. The character has many thief skills, but would more likely be described as a commando with a preference for sneak attacks (and if in fair combat, favors high maneuverability and sweeping attacks).

I agree. I cannot use spreading to hit a single target more than once with a single attack. My initial idea turned out to be a dud. However, I have enough information to ask a better question.

Got a question because I am certainly coming along with the rules, but learning them and really knowing them are often different. I should probably mention we are using 5th Edition (but I am happy to hear 6th Edition answers also, just let me know ). I've got a character with Ambidexterity and Two Weapon Fighting that wants to use the Spreading rules when performing a ranged attack against a single character. She wants to Rapid Fire for 3 attacks, using her 2-weapon fighting to deliver those three attacks at -0OCV, -0OCV and -2OCV. If she is fighting using Rapid Fire against a single target, am I correct that she can give up a strength DC to get a bonus to OCV, netting me +1OCV +1OCV, and -1OCV respectively? What CSLs and such can really buff this out? If this character gets all crazy with the 1d6-1 small stars (shuriken, Autofire 5), what else should this character do (aside from Rapid Autofire for 5pts) to similarly get this dialed in properly?

Actually, it isn't the specific point.The rule book does say that "Alternately, a character may Spread his attack to hit more than one target." along with the means to do so. Not to be provocative, but just so you know.

Thrown daggers then. Good point!

I had a brainstorm, being I sweep and spread on a single person. I can only do 1d6 with a dagger (thrown or melee), so I can do 2d6 adding in some STR. Since I have a 2 1/2d6 STR bonus, I use the other 5 damage classes to offset the -6CV to every attack for making 5 attacks with spreading. Now I am making 5 attacks at -1OCV against a single opponent, doing 6 points of BODY by average damage rule. I was hoping I might solicit feedback as to the viability of this tactic. For what it's worth, the character is lightly armored and highly dextrous. A rogue/assassin type, and I'm thinking about this tactic from surprise or behind.