Char Maxima Question

[SleepyDrug]

I don't know if this has been a topic already. But i was comparing the old FH to the FREd FH and I noticed that while many races still get a boost to some attributes, none of them have penalties anymore.

 

So, I was curious how most people handled Char Maxs in their games.

[Catseye]

Im using the Shrike's suggestion. Package stats add in after everything else and thus arent subject to stat maxima

[Hierax]

Here's what I do: Racial Bonuses to the Base also add to the NCM and Penalties reduce the NCM proportionally.

 

E.G., +5 STR = Base starting STR of 15 NCM 25 ACM 35; -4 INT = Base starting INT of 6 NCM 16, ACM 26.

 

FWIW, ACM stands for "Absolute Charteristic Maxima" (ACM), my House Rule can be found here:

http://www.hierax.com/hero/house/acm.txt

[Vondy]

I don't do non-human player characters. No, really, I don't.

 

With that said - I just have anyone who wants to go over pay double. I don't think non-humans should:

 

1) get any freebies a human doesn't (point wise)

2) have to pay points in advance to offset penalties they may never incur by buying their stats up that high

[Eosin]

Originally posted by D-Man

I just have anyone who wants to go over pay double. I don't think non-humans should:

 

1) get any freebies a human doesn't (point wise)

2) have to pay points in advance to offset penalties they may never incur by buying their stats up that high

 

Ahhh...The voice of reason. I never could figure that out. I would never play non-humans when they had to pay points to increase stat maximums that they might not ever use. If I did play a non-human you could bet my "racially advantaged stats" (that is the ones I already paid double for) get jacked to the maximum for the race. If I have to pay for it in champions, I certianly want the power.

[Catseye]

Spoken like a true min/maxxer

 

In my games you get a lot farther by working towards concpetion rather then crankign the points but to each his own.

 

The Killer Shrike solution though solves all of these issues to my satisfaction. Its a plus. You always get the plus you paid for. If yo uwant a stat of 10, then sell off soem of your starting base to bring it back down.

 

There is an advantage that the plus is not subject to NCM BUT there's also a disadvnatge that it isn't sellable. (eg. If your an elf with a +5 Dex then you absolute min dex is 5).

 

On the whole they balance to my satisfaction.

[SleepyDrug]

I've been leaning towards setting NCM by Race. Ergo, they don't pay points but follow whatever the NCM for that race is.

 

Human NCM for STR may be 20

Dwarf NCM for STR might be 22

Elf NCM for STR might be 18

 

and so on....

 

for each stat

[Catseye]

I played with that idea. In the end shrike's approach did effectively the same thing to my tastes..

 

Now i AM toying with dropping EVERYONES NCM down to 15 (I have formulas for the secondary stat NCMs that seem to work reasonably if you want em.)

[Killer Shrike]

Personally I find the best control on Characteristics is based on how the GM runs their game.

 

If a GM runs a game wherein high stats are all you need to succeed, then characters will have high stats.

 

If a GM runs a game wherein a character needs skills and special abilities to succeed, players will spend fewer points on stats and more points on abilities.

 

Ideally a character that has spent X points on stats should be comparable to a character that has spent the same X points on abilities, with neither being disproportionately capable when considered in a larger scope, but in practice it has been my experience that stat monkeys are usually too limited because I run my games in such a way as to require interaction and competency on the part of the characters. Just being strong or fast or smart wont cut it -- a character needs something to focus all that potential thru.

[Catseye]

My situation is actually more complex KS. I don't wan't them necc to have high stats but I want them to have *different* high stats.

 

I actually do STAT pluses in my "class" package deals. Heavy Fighters get a plus to STR for instance while light-fighters get a plus to dex (and indirectly speed)

 

etc..

 

My game is very archetype driven. Siwss army characters that all have all the same fundamental abilities drove me nuts the first time I tried to use Hero. They started out different but as soon as they had exp to spend they started growing towards each other,

 

This is my solution.

[Killer Shrike]

Originally posted by Catseye

My situation is actually more complex KS. I don't wan't them necc to have high stats but I want them to have *different* high stats.

 

I actually do STAT pluses in my "class" package deals. Heavy Fighters get a plus to STR for instance while light-fighters get a plus to dex (and indirectly speed)

I do the same (see my Profession Packages for an example of this), but I also dont force the players to select from these Packages -- they exist as a time saver and as a kind of gamer shorthand, but they arent required.

 

 

Originally posted by Catseye

My game is very archetype driven. Siwss army characters that all have all the same fundamental abilities drove me nuts the first time I tried to use Hero. They started out different but as soon as they had exp to spend they started growing towards each other,

 

This is my solution.

 

I can understand that entirely. My approach to the HERO System is that the freedom of character design is its greatest strength, so I try to give my players the greatest possible latitude in character design, but this is trumped by the needs of a good roleplaying experience for all other players and the GM. Thus, Ill veto or "strongly recommend against" certain XP expenditures or character concepts when one character starts to step over other character's roles within the party -- whether this be a case of actual skill/ability overlap, or a character that is simply growing too powerful/advantaged. To me the concept is far more important than the implementation -- each ability must be justified at least marginally by a characters concept & background. If you can tie it into your characters schtick and it's appropriate to the millieu then ok, but if you just want it "because" then no.