Armored Cheongsam

[Fabricati]

The idea is very simple- I've already one tentative build for the idea. The difficulty is that I don't have FRED; I'm stuck looking at the Armor Coverage table in the original fifth ed book.

 

It's a dress, more accurately a set of formal wear- in this example, a cheongsam, sleeveless, with the inevitable requisite proper gloves, nylons, etc.- that looks very proper, suitable for a high society 'do' and yet provides a level of protection well beyond its means.

 

Armor's the proper power, no doubt there- as it costs no END, it need not have a visible special effect (at least until someone tries to blast the character). My problem is the coverage, as this is not a typical 'suit' of armor in any way, shape or form.

 

So far, my coverage has come up with 9-18, and 6 (since the gloves don't come up past the elbow).

 

Questions:

 

1) Is 13- the proper Activation Roll?

2) If so, is this the right build, rules-wise:

 

Armored Cheongsam with Armored Nylons: Armor 20 PD/20 ED [60 Active Points], Activation Roll 13- (Hit Locations 6, 9-18) (-1/2), Quarter Mass (-1/4), OIF (-1/2), Real Armor (-1/4). Real Cost: 24 points.

[Blackberry]

Re: Armored Cheongsam

 

As a GM, I'd say you choose; 13 or 14 both could be argued if you go by body area exposure.

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Armored Cheongsam

 

Well, that's a ball park, innit? The question is, are you using the Hit Location table? That makes it all much easier. Otherwise, you'd need to do math to figure out the exact relationship from one to the other, but yes. 13- or 14- would both handle this adequately, were I to ball park it in my head.

[AmadanNaBriona]

Re: Armored Cheongsam

 

Just as an aside...

 

You might want to check in with your GM about the "Real Armor" and "Mass" limitations.

 

Just because, you know, some people might take issues with the idea that a formal dress and sheer stockings can conceal enough "Real" defenses to armor an AFV.

 

I know in most of my games that'd be a firm "HELL NO!", and I tend to be very liberal with Limitations.

 

Moreover, does the outfit inhibit the characters movement, flexibility, heat retention, perception, or any of the other aspects that makes Real Armor a limit? Unless you want your armored dress of doom to have the general characteristics of one of the lead aprons you wear getting an X-ray, you'd best not take the limit.

[Fabricati]

Re: Armored Cheongsam

 

Well, the character is the gadgeteer in a Champions universe campaign, so it's definitely not a problem in that regard.

 

I'm mostly adding things like the 'Mass' and 'Real Armor' limitations to emphasize that yes, this is an actual 'gadget' of sorts, though not the kind you typically associate. The key word here is 'subtle'- if necessary I can get rid of the Mass limitation especially, but she does need to mend it, etc. like real armor or else it loses its effectiveness.

 

As for the flexibility problems, well, it IS a formal dress...

[AmadanNaBriona]

Re: Armored Cheongsam

 

Well, the character is the gadgeteer in a Champions universe campaign, so it's definitely not a problem in that regard.

 

I'm mostly adding things like the 'Mass' and 'Real Armor' limitations to emphasize that yes, this is an actual 'gadget' of sorts, though not the kind you typically associate. The key word here is 'subtle'- if necessary I can get rid of the Mass limitation especially, but she does need to mend it, etc. like real armor or else it loses its effectiveness.

 

As for the flexibility problems, well, it IS a formal dress...

 

Yeah, I don't have a problem with the uber-armored dress in a Supers game. My old Gadgeteer character did the bulletproof spandex thing hisself, and on at least one occasion hid it in an IIF tuxedo.

 

It's not the gadget I was questioning, merely those two limits. Generally they're of limited applicability for Supers characters, and many GM's require that anything taking the various "Real" limitations at least fall into the ballpark range for the real item the gadget is simulating.

 

Is the occasional need to repair your Focus (part of the Focus Lim, btw) the only part of the Real Armor Limitation you see this conveying? As for the real Mass, well, according to the Equipment section listing for "Mass", the base weight is 2.5 Kg for full coverage at 2 DEF, doubled for every additional +2 Def. This gets proportionally reduced, but even so, checking the totals for a 14- Activation (Because there's no listing for 13- and I'm too lazy to do the math) nets (at Quarter Mass)...

Letsee.... 70 KG@ Act 14- @10 Def, 5 doublings, then quarter total....

 

560 KG.

 

Heavy dress, innit?

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Armored Cheongsam

 

I'm not sure about the 'mass' Limitation. Especially since this is for a super/Champions game as opposed to Heroic. Activate 13- sounds about right but is worth (-3/4). Also, your sections appear at first glance to be less percentage wise than the default options (I'm pretty sure someone has already posted a % breakdown of the hit location chart but I don't have it handy) so (-3/4) looks good either way. I would also go with IIF if you want to hide it under clothes.

 

This is what I came up with using HDv3:

 

27 Armored Cheongsam with Armored Nylons: Armor (20 PD/20 ED) (60 Active Points); Full Coverage Helmet, Long Jacket, High Boots (Protects Locations 3-5, 9-14, 16-18; -3/4), IIF (-1/4), Real Armor (-1/4)

[Fabricati]

Re: Armored Cheongsam

 

Yeah, I don't have a problem with the uber-armored dress in a Supers game. My old Gadgeteer character did the bulletproof spandex thing hisself, and on at least one occasion hid it in an IIF tuxedo.

 

It's not the gadget I was questioning, merely those two limits. Generally they're of limited applicability for Supers characters, and many GM's require that anything taking the various "Real" limitations at least fall into the ballpark range for the real item the gadget is simulating.

 

Is the occasional need to repair your Focus (part of the Focus Lim, btw) the only part of the Real Armor Limitation you see this conveying? As for the real Mass, well, according to the Equipment section listing for "Mass", the base weight is 2.5 Kg for full coverage at 2 DEF, doubled for every additional +2 Def. This gets proportionally reduced, but even so, checking the totals for a 14- Activation (Because there's no listing for 13- and I'm too lazy to do the math) nets (at Quarter Mass)...

Letsee.... 70 KG@ Act 14- @10 Def, 5 doublings, then quarter total....

 

560 KG.

 

Heavy dress, innit?

 

Wow, I was unaware it was quite so heavy, but now I see that's the case. Heavens to murgatroyd, better to get rid of that entirely. Oof.

 

I had been running off the assumption that you run the mass for 1/4 of the defense, making it a much more manageable (for an STR 18 woman, anyway) 40/4= 10 @ activation 14- = 70, which is admittedly still a little too heavy.

 

See, this is why I wanted to ask- the 'defining Armor' rules aren't as clear as I would like- something I hope is fixed in FRED.

[AmadanNaBriona]

Re: Armored Cheongsam

 

I'm not sure about the 'mass' Limitation. Especially since this is for a super/Champions game as opposed to Heroic. Activate 13- sounds about right but is worth (-3/4). Also, your sections appear at first glance to be less percentage wise than the default options (I'm pretty sure someone has already posted a % breakdown of the hit location chart but I don't have it handy) so (-3/4) looks good either way. I would also go with IIF if you want to hide it under clothes.

 

This is what I came up with using HDv3:

 

27 Armored Cheongsam with Armored Nylons: Armor (20 PD/20 ED) (60 Active Points); Full Coverage Helmet, Long Jacket, High Boots (Protects Locations 3-5, 9-14, 16-18; -3/4), IIF (-1/4), Real Armor (-1/4)

This write up here I'd almost certainly let into a game, with the caveat that I'd want to discuss how the real armor limit will limit in play. It's only a -1/4 tho, so it's not a huge deal to me.

 

Wow, I was unaware it was quite so heavy, but now I see that's the case. Heavens to murgatroyd, better to get rid of that entirely. Oof.

 

I had been running off the assumption that you run the mass for 1/4 of the defense, making it a much more manageable (for an STR 18 woman, anyway) 40/4= 10 @ activation 14- = 70, which is admittedly still a little too heavy.

 

See, this is why I wanted to ask- the 'defining Armor' rules aren't as clear as I would like- something I hope is fixed in FRED.

Yeah, they're a bit scattered and can be confuzzling. Even now, I think you might have miscalculated, because the Mass limit, in the edition we both own, is calculated using DEF, so if things worked your way, it'd have come out at 35 Kg, not 70, because 40 "points" of Armor defences translates to 20 DEF.

[Fabricati]

Re: Armored Cheongsam

 

HUh. I'd thought it was total DEF, not individual max DEF- in this example 20 PD + 20 ED = 40 total DEF- but also leaves room to include other more exotic defenses in the Armor advantage and still have it affect the Mass.