Setting up magic system. Comments needed.

[Theros]

I would like to hear opinions and also possible suggestions to upgrade my idea of magic system that I am going to use. Currently I am planning to set up fantasy hero into the Shadow World (Rolemaster's fantasy world).

 

Target:

 

- I can use directly all the spells from Grimoire (no need to calculate anything when players pick up spells)

- Magic should be "mid magic". Between low and high magic setting.

- Magic is not rare, but not available for everyone.

 

What I did pick from fantasy hero:

 

- Spells will consume END like those are listed in grimoire. If spell casting roll fails, it still consumes full amount of END.

 

- Spells willl be ranked by power. Spell rank will be (Active points / 10) + (real points / 10). This will limit purchased spells so that every rank that is above spells casters rank (see below) will give extra -1 to casting roll.

Then comes question. If we think strictly based on rules, can I decide that kind of thing without braking the system.

 

- Spell caster will be ranked based on casting skills. Spell caster with skill 10-11 is at rank 1, 12-13 is at rank 2, 14-15 at rank 3 and so on.

 

- Caster should pick up a talent to be able to cast spells (Magic: Adept, 10 points). That represents natural ability to cast. It can be bought during the adventures too, but without training character might trigger some random powers. During and after the training character can buy spells using CPs. Not before that.

 

- Spellbooks and spells should be bought by money or found from somewhere. Spells will cost a lot of gold. I was thinking something like 1 gold / real point or maybe even 10 gold / real point. Spells will take one page for every 2 real point cost from the spellbook.

 

- Character cannot buy spell that don't have in book using character points. And if there are situation when character is not able study spells, he cannot buy spells even he has character points. If studying time should be calculated, it is 8 hour / day. Number of days is equal to real point cost of the spell.

 

- Variable power and multipower are available from equipment only. Something like Wizards staff etc.

 

- Lesser magical items (and in some rare cases more powerful too) can be bought from bigger cities. Those are relatively expensive.

 

- Intelligence minimum is the minimum number that is needed to learn the spell.

 

- Character buys casting skill separately for every magic school.

 

- Diamonds can be used to power up spells (converted into the END). This I need to think more, as there are no ready system for that.

 

- Spells are cast using casting time form the Grimoire book. I am thinking that I will add one extra phase for every rank difference that spell and caster have. Rank 2 caster is trying to cast rank 4 spell, he adds 2 phases to casting time of that spell. When caster goes up in rank to rank 3, he adds only 1 phase to casting time. Minimum is listed casting time.

 

- Wizards should use focus, gestures, focus and so on...when needed.

 

- Wizard can learn schools, but maximum number is their (INT-10)/2, which is basically 5 schools for humans.

 

Then clerics...

 

This is hard one.

 

- Clerics spells use end from caster like the wizard's spells.

 

- Cleric needs casting skill (Faith)

 

- Cleric cannot cast higher rank spells like wizards can (as wizard have to buy spells to books), but they can cast higher rank spells.

 

- Cleric have to use only focus (holy symbol) to cast spells.

 

Something else? According to this clerics will be much better casters (even they have different spells than wizard's) than wizards are.

 

Then about general things...

 

Magicians will be trained, according to their rank (need to named later on) they have access to more powerful spells. Spells above rank 4 are almost impossible to get from magic stores. Those need to be found or got from magicians guild.

 

Priest will have most likely ranks inside the church too. They start from initiates (others are lay members), and then increase ranks. Paladins start always from the initiate and increase in ranks (up to two from their starting point).

 

Is there some sort of paladin template ready?

 

I thank from comments and suggestions before hand.

[Kraven Kor]

My first comment:

Make your "Spellcasting Talent" not just a 10-point tax.  Make it a talent that offsets penalties on the Spellcasting skill roll or something; and maybe (since you are calling it "natural ability) that talent itself has ranks (+1 vs. all Spellcasting penalties up through, say, +3.)

 

Just a thought.  More as I have time.

[Kraven Kor]

On Clerics vs. Wizards (and Sorcerers?)

 

Clerics and Paladins can use the same exact setup; the Paladin is just going to have less spellcasting and more heathen smiting.  If going by typical tropes, at any rate.

 

Your concern that clerics will be "better" than wizards is a bit of a misnomer; as it seems your faith-based casters will have fewer limitations to their spells, and you aren't using frameworks...  so it would appear clerics / paladins will have fewer spells available at an equivalent cost.  Clerics will have OAF, RSR for -1.5 total; Wizards and such will have RSR, Gestures, Incantations, OAF, Requires Both Hands, etc.  (Again, if I'm reading this correctly and going by typical fantasy tropes.)

 

Do you intend to have "sorcerers" or psionics or other archetypes?

[JasonPacker]

Given that skills are all based on a bell curve, I think I'm inclined towards notion of having the Spell Level be a penalty to skill level instead of only a penalty if your skill is too low. This makes it possible to still have a relatively high skill (17-, say) and cast a spell that's level 3 at a 14-, that is most of the time, but still able to cast a much higher skill spell, say a level 7, half the time.

[Kraven Kor]

Given that skills are all based on a bell curve, I think I'm inclined towards notion of having the Spell Level be a penalty to skill level instead of only a penalty if your skill is too low. This makes it possible to still have a relatively high skill (17-, say) and cast a spell that's level 3 at a 14-, that is most of the time, but still able to cast a much higher skill spell, say a level 7, half the time.

 

I'd just go with the default -1 to the roll per 10 AP of the spell, personally.

 

And then you can have the spellcasting talent offset penalties, as well as things like taking extra time or multiple casters working together.  Kind of neat how the default RSR rules kind of bundle that all in.

[Theros]

On Clerics vs. Wizards (and Sorcerers?)

 

Clerics and Paladins can use the same exact setup; the Paladin is just going to have less spellcasting and more heathen smiting.  If going by typical tropes, at any rate.

 

Your concern that clerics will be "better" than wizards is a bit of a misnomer; as it seems your faith-based casters will have fewer limitations to their spells, and you aren't using frameworks...  so it would appear clerics / paladins will have fewer spells available at an equivalent cost.  Clerics will have OAF, RSR for -1.5 total; Wizards and such will have RSR, Gestures, Incantations, OAF, Requires Both Hands, etc.  (Again, if I'm reading this correctly and going by typical fantasy tropes.)

 

Do you intend to have "sorcerers" or psionics or other archetypes?

 

I am going to have Sorcerers, but more likely summoning and wild magic based.

 

Psionics yes...I will use those more likely Rolemaster Mentalists

[Theros]

I'd just go with the default -1 to the roll per 10 AP of the spell, personally.

 

And then you can have the spellcasting talent offset penalties, as well as things like taking extra time or multiple casters working together.  Kind of neat how the default RSR rules kind of bundle that all in.

I will consider that. Still I want to discourage player to do "over casting"

 

Maybe I should add some END cost, if character tries to cast spells that are in higher rank than skills are.

[JasonPacker]

I will consider that. Still I want to discourage player to do "over casting"

 

Maybe I should add some END cost, if character tries to cast spells that are in higher rank than skills are.

 

That's definitely what Side Effects are for. If they fail their skill roll, some sort of detrimental effect occurs, and the higher the level of the spell (AP/10), the higher the penalty to their skill roll.

[NuSoardGraphite]

I use the rolemaster magic system (essence, channeling and mentalism) converted to hero because i use their shadow world campaignsetting for my fantasy hero efforts.

 

For clerics i recommend the following limitations:

 

RSR(faith) -1/10 active points.

 

OAF (holy symbol) could even be fragile or difficult to obtain a new one. (This would create the roleplaying effect of the cleric being obsesive about protecting their holy symbol)

 

Limited power: only works if acting in alignment with the deities goals/sphere of influence. i usually put this at -1/2. i'm not super strict on it, but i do not want the cleric of a god of war just randomly healing people (outside of the battlefield) nor do i want the cleric of a god of healing smiting armies with but a wave.

 

If a cleric of a diety is within a temple of that deity, they should recieve at least +3 to all their faith rolls to perform divine magic. if they are in an area that is within the sphere of influence for that deity, they should recieve at least +1 to +3 to their skill rols. example...a battlefield for a god of war. the woods for a goddess of nature. an ocean vessel for a god of the sea. during a thunderstorm for a god od thunder. etc. gods that have a high influence in certain areas (everyone in this area worships this specific deity or pantheon) would give their clerics +1 while in that area (all clerics of the greek pantheon would receive a general +1 while in greece) but if they are in areas far from their area of worship, they could recieve penalties. the penalties will be higher when in the area of worship for dieties with whom they hold an enmity towards. (A cleic of zues travelling in persia would recieve a -1 for being too far from greece and the center of the greek pantheons power and an additional -1 for being in an enemy zone of influence)

 

Regular prayer and devotions allows a cleric to have normal communication with their deity, fueling their magics. when this is disrupted, their magics should prove more difficult. for every step on the dime chart staing with 1 day a cleric cannot perform his or her normal prayers and devotions, apply a -1 penalty to faith rolls. also consider retricting the mana recovery stat (if using a separate mana characteristic instead od inherent endurance)

 

Also consider allowing the cleric bonuses on holy days for their deity. at least bonuses to their faith roll is relevant, if not outright AID to the clerics divine magics.