Vehicle Question

[TheDarkness]

Relates to a question I put up on the 6th edition forum, but is from Champions complete.

 

I'm preparing to judge a game, and it's been a long time since I played Champions, so I'm doing a lot of prep-work. One of the things I'm working on is vehicle design. To make sure I'm understanding the rules, I'm back engineering a vehicle from the list in the Champions book, specifically a motorcycle.

 

From p. 216

Name             Size       OCV+    Mass (KB)    STR    DEF     BODY     DEX     OCV    DCV     SPD     Move     MAX      Cost
Motorcycle 2.5x1x1m     +0        200kg (-1)    20        4         11          20          7          7          3      56m x4    672m    133/27

 

The problem is, I can't get the active cost to work.

 

Size is 1 according to this page and page 162, size 1 costs 5 points, and gives a base strength of 15, raise STR to twenty is 5 more points, and the size gives the base BODY of 11. To raise DEX from 10 to 20 is 20 points, to raise OCV and DCV from 3 to 7 is 40 points, to raise speed from 2 to 3 is 10 points, to raise PD and ED from 2 to 4 is 6 more points. STAT TOTAL=86

 

Add 56 meters of running is 56 points, add the extra multiplier to make x4 non-combat movement is 5 points. POWER TOTAL=61

 

Now, if I assume that the vehicle gets a base running of 12m like a character, this becomes POWER TOTAL=53, but I suspect this is not the case, otherwise every submarine would technically have a 12m run.

 

This puts the active cost at either 147, or 139, not the 133 the manual lists.

 

Furthermore, this does not figure in that powers for a vehicle have to be bought to zero endurance or similar things. So the powers cost is likely higher, since the list does not suggest charges.

 

What the heck am I missing?

 

Also, just to confuse me further, I decided to compare with the V-Jet on page 215, and for some reason, the V-Jet has 7 OCV and DCV, but paid 30 for each. Since I'm assuming the starting value is still supposed to be 3, at 5 cp for 1 OCV or DCV, it should be 20. But because I can't get my head wrapped around a simple motorcycle, I'm assuming I'm missing something.

 

I feel like I'm getting closer to understanding, but that just could be the sign of imminent breakdown...

[Comic]

Most 'street legal' vehicles have Images (headlights, horn), and while I imagine most GM's give those for free, some might not.

 

However, I'm not a vehicles guy, so won't be much help to you.

[TheDarkness]

Most 'street legal' vehicles have Images (headlights, horn), and while I imagine most GM's give those for free, some might not.

 

However, I'm not a vehicles guy, so won't be much help to you.

The problem is, my cost is already higher than the listed cost, and it doesn't include buying zero endurance.

[Penthau]

The problem is, my cost is already higher than the listed cost, and it doesn't include buying zero endurance.

 

Isn't there a limitation about the defenses not protecting the passengers that could be applied?

[TheDarkness]

Isn't there a limitation about the defenses not protecting the passengers that could be applied?

That's an idea!

 

Damn, still puts me over the points they are saying, the defenses amount to 6 points. Maybe it's assuming a charge, instead of reduced endurance. My model, at the final cost, is still within a couple points of the cost they are saying, but the difference concerns me...

[BoloOfEarth]

FYI:  Vehicles' STR and Movement powers cost no END in both CC and 6E.

 

And 61 - 12  = 49, not 53.

 

Also, a vehicle comes with 12m Ground Movement and 4m Swimming for free; you can shave off another 2 points by buying off the Swimming.  (A submarine would presumably buy back the Ground Movement.)

 

I actually come out under their 133 points, if applying the -1/2 Limitation on the 4 DEF.

 

 

Name             Size       OCV+    Mass (KB)    STR    DEF     BODY     DEX     OCV    DCV     SPD     Move     MAX      Cost
Motorcycle 2.5x1x1m     +0        200kg (-1)    20        4         11          20          7          7          3      56m x4    672m    133/27

 

So, Size (5 pts), STR (5 pts), DEF (2 pts), DEX (20 pts), OCV (20 pts), DCV (20 pts), SPD (10 pts) Move (49 pts - 2 pts) = 129 pts.  Leaves 4 points for a headlight.

 

Or, if you don't put the Limitation on the 4 DEF, you get Size (5 pts), STR (5 pts), DEF (6 pts), DEX (20 pts), OCV (20 pts), DCV (20 pts), SPD (10 pts) Move (49 pts - 2 pts) = 133pts.

[Scott Baker]

Bolo has it. 

 

As for the V-Jet, the OCV and DCV are indeed 20 each. That's a misprint in the book. The characteristics do total 160, with the correct values of 20 and 20.

[TheDarkness]

FYI:  Vehicles' STR and Movement powers cost no END in both CC and 6E.

 

And 61 - 12  = 49, not 53.

 

Also, a vehicle comes with 12m Ground Movement and 4m Swimming for free; you can shave off another 2 points by buying off the Swimming.  (A submarine would presumably buy back the Ground Movement.)

 

I actually come out under their 133 points, if applying the -1/2 Limitation on the 4 DEF.

 

 

Name             Size       OCV+    Mass (KB)    STR    DEF     BODY     DEX     OCV    DCV     SPD     Move     MAX      Cost

Motorcycle 2.5x1x1m     +0        200kg (-1)    20        4         11          20          7          7          3      56m x4    672m    133/27

 

So, Size (5 pts), STR (5 pts), DEF (2 pts), DEX (20 pts), OCV (20 pts), DCV (20 pts), SPD (10 pts) Move (49 pts - 2 pts) = 129 pts.  Leaves 4 points for a headlight.

 

Or, if you don't put the Limitation on the 4 DEF, you get Size (5 pts), STR (5 pts), DEF (6 pts), DEX (20 pts), OCV (20 pts), DCV (20 pts), SPD (10 pts) Move (49 pts - 2 pts) = 133pts.

 

FYI:  Vehicles' STR and Movement powers cost no END in both CC and 6E.

 

And 61 - 12  = 49, not 53.

 

Also, a vehicle comes with 12m Ground Movement and 4m Swimming for free; you can shave off another 2 points by buying off the Swimming.  (A submarine would presumably buy back the Ground Movement.)

 

I actually come out under their 133 points, if applying the -1/2 Limitation on the 4 DEF.

 

 

Name             Size       OCV+    Mass (KB)    STR    DEF     BODY     DEX     OCV    DCV     SPD     Move     MAX      Cost

Motorcycle 2.5x1x1m     +0        200kg (-1)    20        4         11          20          7          7          3      56m x4    672m    133/27

 

So, Size (5 pts), STR (5 pts), DEF (2 pts), DEX (20 pts), OCV (20 pts), DCV (20 pts), SPD (10 pts) Move (49 pts - 2 pts) = 129 pts.  Leaves 4 points for a headlight.

 

Or, if you don't put the Limitation on the 4 DEF, you get Size (5 pts), STR (5 pts), DEF (6 pts), DEX (20 pts), OCV (20 pts), DCV (20 pts), SPD (10 pts) Move (49 pts - 2 pts) = 133pts.

Thanks! I'll try this myself and see what totals I come out with. just to make sure I'm following, though, as you point out, I might want to double check my math!