Demonsong

Re: Please Help with Mutant Tentacle Guy

Thats it! Thanks!

Re: 3 1/2d6 vs. 4d6-1

In my fantasy hero campaign I always use 1/2d6 for all normal and mundane things and -1 for magic. I might not be totally balanced but it adds a little flavor and power to magic.

Re: Killing stroke

In my fantasy hero campaign the killing blow has another name. One of the PC’s a Half-Elf knife fighter and semi-mage performs “First Aid†on all the downed opponents. In short he walks around the battle field and slits all there throats. Is this heroic? No. Is it effective? Hell yes. And in a tough, gritty, demon infested world that I run it’s almost necessary.

I don’t have any special rules for finishing blows but it’s something to think about.

A mutant, completely human but has 3 long tentacles. Now here is the problem I want the tentacles to be able to attack (or take an other action) regardless of what the rest of the body is doing. So even if the character takes a full phase run or he attacks with his giant 2 handed sword, his 3 long tentacles can still attack (as a Autofire X3), or grab someone or something or parry or what ever.

Am I making sence at all?

I really can’t see a good way to do it. I was thinking about bending the rules a bit and just buying double his normal speed and have him take two actions per phase. Say buy a speed of 8 with the limitation of –1/4 (or -1/2) only with tentacles on 4 points of the speed. And then just have him act as if his speed was 4 and just take two actions each phase.

But is feels clunky and I was hoping one of the Hero Masters here could come up with a better way to do it.

Thanks

Demonsong

Re: What character concepts make you cringe?

It is unbelievable how many times I have run across that very combination. Can’t people come up with something new?

Re: THE ULTIMATE BRICK -- What Do *You* Want To See?

Well mechanics aside. My favored thing in all Heroes books are the pregenerated characters. I like the in-depth character profiles and examples of power constructs and ideas. I generally only play Fantasy Hero but I buy all the Hero system books and the first thing I turn to is the characters.

So to answer your question:

I want to see lots of characters.

Thanks

Demonsong

Re: Block vs Dodge: Statistics

In my current Fantasy Hero Campaign I have some Demon-Born Snakemen that use large shields. And I am here to tell you the that +3 is huge. Just ask my players Any way once shields are involved its changes things a lot I think.

And watch out for the Large Shield and Martial Block combo. The best of both worlds. I can totally see it being effective even in high powered campaigns.

With out shields, dodging is probably your best bet.

Demonsong

Re: RPG.net

Now if I was rude and was given to stating broad generalizations or deliberately insulting others, I might say some thing like…

“D20 is a very basic and simple system and all it take is a very basic and simple mind to understand it, master it even. With the Hero System you actually have to think a little and a lot of people find that difficult. “

But I don’t like to make statements like that. So I will refrain.

Demonsong

Well it’s a question more that a statement. This probably belongs in the Fantasy section but since the same could be said in any Heroic setting that uses melee weapons I figured I would put it here. Any way a bastered sword or battle axe do damage equivalent to most 2 handed weapons and allows a person to use a shield and for a +2 or +3 DCV bonus. I have only one person in my current campaign that uses a 2handed weapon and that is because they are fluff oriented. Especially since with his strength he could be wielding a one handed weapon and only loose a single DC. Has any one else noticed this or am I reading to much in to it.

I was thinking about razing the DC all 2 handed weapons by one. To more accurately reflect the actual extra power one gets form using a 2 handed weapon. And make using one worth while (vs. a shield any way).

Thoughts?

Thanks

Demonsong

So said Lavaman that latterly lives in lava can still be killed by a flame thrower that is not any wear near as intensely hot as lava. That’s cool.

I don't see why you would need Trigger, for two reasons. The power with the Linked limitation does not have to be used when the power to which it is linked is used. So if you put the Linked limitation on the Holy Blast, you couldn't use the Holy Blast without the HKA, but you could use the HKA without the Holy Blast.

So that means I did it correctaly, and I just need to reduce the Linked Limitation to -1/4.

Also, I don't think you can get away with 2-pt. skill levels for OCV for the sword anyway. Any skill levels you use with a linked attack must apply to both attacks. A 2-pt. skill level, by definition, can only apply to one single attack. At a minimum, a skill level with "magic sword powers" would be a 3-pt. level. And since I assume that the accuracy from the skill levels comes from the sword (and would thus apply if another character used the sword), you may as well make them 5-pt. levels with OAF.

Very good point. So 5 point skill levels it is. Is there a limitaion of not being able to use the 2 skill levels to boost DVC? Or would that just be -0 limitation?

What is the purpose of the AOE on the Holy Blast? Is that to be accurate with the Holy Blast, or is that to damage more than one demon if you catch more than one in the same hex?

I think it was the best way to describe the special effect I have in my mind. A burst or small explosion of holy light that radiates form the sword so that even if the sword swing misses odds are the beast will still be caught in the explosion of light.

So, maybe my best bet would to drop the link all together and add a +1/4 trigger: When ever attacking deamons with sword?

Hello all, let’s make a magic sword with a linked AOE Holy Blast……

Sword

1 1/2D HKA (25 pts)

+1/2 END = 0

-1 OAF

-2 Independent

12 pts real cost (It’s a magic sword so we are not putting STR mins or any of the other stuff on it.)

Holy Blast

5D6 EB (Holy Light) (25pts)

+1/2 END =0

+1/2 AOE = 1 Hex

-1/2 No Range

-1/2 Linked to Sword

-1 Only works vs. Demons and Demonkin

-1 OAF

-2 Independent

-0 Limitation: Holy Blast always works vs. Demons. It must be used, if attacking with the sword.

10 pts real cost

Perfect Weight and Balance

+2 OCV Sword

-0 OAF (0 because you have to buy 5 point skill levels to put limitations on them. Right?)

-0 Independent (0 because you have to buy 5 point skill levels to put limitations on them. Right?)

4pts real cost

The whole sword now costs 26 real points.

Questions:

1) You attack a person with the sword you attack a hex with the blast. Would you use one dice role and compare it to the two different DCV’s? The object here is that it is possible for the Holy Blast to hit even if the sword misses.

2) I linked the Holy Blast to the Sword because the sword always works and the holy blast only works vs. demons. But the Holy Blast costs more. What is the correct way to do this?

As always thanks for the input.

Demonsong

c) This has good "deathtrap" possibilites. If it always teleports him 2", for example, put him in a room with 5" thick walls and have an AE entangle in the room - he gets entangled - teleports - into an entangle - teleports - etc. and is caught in a loop he can't get out of. If this costs him END, he's in real trouble.

Very cool idea!!!!!

I third that.

Well I guess we just have to agree to disagree. I see a much larger difference here than there is in your bullet to force bolt comparison. But no worries. This is the land of the free. We can disagree and it’s not the end of the world.

Let’s look at one other way. Two characters completely the same, down to the last point. One is “The Archer†(cool music sounds in the background), the other is The Swordsman ( more cool music). The only difference between them is The Archers Multi-Power focus is a magical bow and arrows and The Swordsman’s Multi-Power focus is a Magical Sword that has the same effect, charges, points cost……everything. Now the Archer get penalized once every few games because he is being a hero and doing heroic thing but he needs two hands or he takes penalties of using a bow. This is some thing that the Swordsman never has to worry about, because his magical broadsword only ever needs one hand. All this because of a special effect. If you ask me it is enough that it would certainly cause me to change my character concept to the swordsman. Simi-random penalties because of the special effect I choose for flavor, even if it only happens once in a great while is still just not fair IMO.

But then I guess it’s all about play style and I am big in to special effects.

What about the wounded hostage that he saved and threw over his shoulder to carry to safety. What about the lap top computer, duffel bag full of top secret files, or the new supper high tech what’s-it that he took back for the bad guys that he is now carrying in his left arm/hand. He can’t very well leave any of those thing behind as he fights his way out of the enemy installation, collapsing building, or underground complex. Basically what I am saying it that with out the limitation the character can always fire the bow one handed, end of story. Even if he/she is hanging from a ladder with one hand, holding on to something or carrying a wounded civilian. Personally I would considerate it a bigger limitation than most people are talking about. That’s how I would read it as a player or a GM. But I am not totally inflexible. I can see -1/4 instead of -1/2 but I would think that the player would still be entitled to a good amount of leeway if they were forced in to a lesser limitation amount.

Well I can certainly see your point Gary. But with out the limitation if a GM was to ever limit a player characters ability to use his bow at full effect, in any way, for the loss or use of one hand the player would surly have every right to feel very cheated.

Well I guess my only point would be if you didn’t allow a player to use the -1/2 2 handed limitation there should never, ever, be a time when they can’t use the bow with one hand.

“Yes I know the Alien Death Ray cut off my left arm off but I can still shoot my bow at normal speed….I guess I'll use my teeth. Ya that’s it."

Vanderbilt_Grad

Well I don't have FH, but my suggestion would be to do something like mandate that all mages have Vulnerablity x1.5 Stun from Magic. If you use magic it can burn you more easily.....

Now that’s an interesting thought. But I think it would be more of a countermeasure to balance out magic if it was too powerful. But the reason for using Arcane Defense in my world is not to balance out magic. It is for use as a plot device. It makes since to me that in a world of high magic there are to be people and or creatures that have developed a natural resistance to magic. Thanks for the input.

KS

It sounds like the problem isnt anything to do w/ needing a Magic Defense power as much as it is a case of your PC's exceeding your ability to challenge them.

I assure you that game balance and a lack of challenge for the players is not an issue here. And as stated about this is about a plot device not balancing out magic or screwing my players.

KS

If you have a lot of spellcasters, but everyone else runs around in leather armor or less, or chain at the high end, then yeah, you are going to have a major problem.

No it's not really a problem. As matter of fact it is just the way it should be as far as I am concerned. Super heavy defenses take away for the gaming experience in my opinion. If you have no fear of the average solider / bandit there is no spice to the game at all. And the point I was trying to make when I mentioned the lower defenses what that magical healing was an important part of the game. And on top of that I want players in my world to be suitably impressed when encountering full plate in combat encounter and as a symbol of status in non-combat encounters. After all in history full plate was the equivalent at a walking tank, if you take my meaning.

KS

As a general rule of thumb, if a disproportionate number of players gravitate towards the same general idea, its probably because its an "attractive"-read-overpowered option and it should probably be eyeballed for balance.

 

Also, and this harkens back to the Summon Sword Spell, if you are letting your Spellcasters cast spells built on Instant powers like HKA, RKA, EB and HA like that and have them stick around for a while, then they are effectively getting constantly reusable spells from effects that are intended to be Instant and thus work once per casting. So, each such spell basically is carrying an shadow Advantage that isnt reflected in the point totals.

Your making assumptions here that just are not the case. As I stated before it has been my experience with the Hero Magic Users have more utility and are there for more effective in more situations then non-spell users. But that aside the sword spell issue is just one spell that is not even in the game yet. I can see where you are coming form its just not the case.

KS

IIRC you are also using a Skill Roll and Mana Pool system, where presumably the Spellcasters can cast spells as long as they have END/Mana. Unless you make them heavily limit their REC then they are going to be prolific spellcasters.

I am very happy with my mana system (END Reserve) I find it very balanced. Players REC only work when at complete rest, meditating, or sleeping. And I have not allowed player to over inflate the END reserve on the pool too much. One must be careful here not to choke their players by not allowing them enough mana to remain effective. But I believe I have come up with a good balance.

KS

Heres the thing, if you are having fun w/ your campaign and your players are having fun, all good. Add Arcane DEF or whatever and have fun with it.

As stated at the start of this post I am using it as a plot device. Arcane Defense is already in the game. I am not adding it as a balance issue. I am simple trying to get input on how other would or do use this power. It is a power that is very common in other games in this type of setting. Magic Resistance as it is know in one game or Mama Disruption in another, and the Magically Dead in another system. I look at it as a tool to help me tell a story. And I just want to make it the most useful and fair tool that I can. That is why I am asking for the input.

zornwil

Thanks for the thread, I haven't read my Fantasy HERO book yet, so will look this up. I have Supernatural Defense, which is INT/5, and there's Supernatural Attacks or regular attacks can be Supernaturally Based. THere's some benefits to these attacks as they aren't physical in nature and can interact in different/strange ways with the environment (affecting Desols, passing through objects, etc.).

I look forward to hearing your thoughts after you read it.

Since I don't own Fantasy Hero (Great book or not, it's a choice between eat and buy another book. I like to eat, sorry. ),

Well obviously you made the wrong choice!

Well your suppress idea certainly has merit but it is really expensive. Maybe I will try to put it together and see what I come up with.

I would disagree that Healing interference balances such an ability -- most healing will occur out of combat when time is not an issue where as most offensive spells will resolve during combat.

With the slow rate of natural healing added too the normal rules of the healing power/spell of only being about to be healed once unless the second spell is more effect. It is actually a very balanced counter. In a higher-powered campaign with higher defense what you say could very well be true. But in a 75+75 point with full plate armor being very rare defenses are kind of low, DEF's of 3 to 6 being the average. So during most are combats some one ends up hurt. A quick magical patch is what keeps every one going. Loosing that is a kick in the butt.

Also, allowing such an ability at that cost will seriously defang spellcasters in a standard Fantasy Campaign IMO. If thats what you want then so be it, but it would certainly discourage me from playing a Wizard type in that setting.

In a way I wish your statement was true of my players. Because currently 5 out of the 6 players in my group are Magic Users of some type. And the truth is told with the way the Hero is structured I find Magic Users (or Fighters/Magic Users) much more effective then just normal fighters in most situations.

And not that I don’t appreciate your comments but if you could add a suggestion on how you would handle this power, above and beyond your criticism I would appreciate it.

Does any one use Arcane Defense?

Arcane Defense is described on Page 81 of the Fantasy Hero book. If you don’t own the Fantasy Hero Book…WHAT'S WRONG WITH YOU? GO BUY IT! IT'S A GREAT BOOK. Any way I am posting this here and not on the Fantasy Hero Board because I can see where various forms of this power/ability could be used in lots of other campaign settings. So the question stands does any one use this in any form? If so, is it a figured characteristic that can be added too or is it just a power purchased in levels? Who much do you charge for it?

In a High magic setting such as I am using in my campaign I feel there is a need for this power and I am not sure I like what I am using. So I want your input.

The Arcane Defense I am currently using is described below.

Arcane Defense: 3 points for Arcane Defense at base level (CON/3). Every additional 2 points raises Arcane Defense by one point. A character's Arcane Defense cannot be turned off. Arcane Defense reduces the effect of ANY magical effect or damage by its value. Characters with Arcane Defense CANNOT cast spells. *Example 1: A 2D6 RKA Flame Bolt hits a character with an Arcane Defense of 5 in the chest. The damage dice are rolled, a 3 and 5, for a total of 8 Body. Now before any other defense is subtracted or Stun is figured the Body is reduced by five. So the Flame Bolts total Damage is now 3 Body and them stun is figured, in this case it's 9 Stun. Now the characters other defenses are used. *Example 2: A character with an Arcane Defense of 5 is hit with a 3D6 Entangle, the dice are rolled, the entangle has a total body of 3, 3 - 5 = -2, the entangle has no effect. *Example 3: A character with Arcane Defense of 5 is severally wounded in a battle with Orcs, he has 2 Body of his original 10 left, ouch. His friend the Sorcerer comes to his aid and heals him, with a 3D6 Heal Body Spell. Rolling a 3, 3, and a 6 for a total of 12 or 6 body. After subtracting the characters 5 points of Arcane Defense he is healed only (12-5=7 / 2 = 3) 3 points. @Note: Arcane Defense is not very expensive, however it is very balanced. The simple fact that magical healing is generally just not an option for characters with Arcane Defense is a huge counter balance to any positive effects.

Thanks

Demonsong

quote:

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Originally posted by Demonsong

Silly question: Why don’t any of the bows have the -1/2 Requires 2 hand limitation? It would seem to me that it would be almost mandatory. I have not seen too many one armed archers.

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Because it is not appropriate for a Champions campeign?

I don’t know if I agree with that. In a Champions setting you wouldn’t put it on rifles and heavy weapons because firing that type of weapon with one hand is common practice. But it seams to me that the first time I try to fire my bow one handed the GM is going to laugh at me.