Jhaierr

Re: Alternate Sexualities in Champions and Supers settings

Let's consider comics. How many comic books by the big two (Marvel and DC) had titles feature a hero or heroine of color that has lasted more than 50 issues? How many featuring white hero or heroines?

I don't know, honestly. But I'm not talking about making all of the primary characters in Champions LGB. I think you can't compare sales of comics directly with Hero books.

What about the new bi-racial Spider-man? That itself seemed to have caused quite a stir among comic book fans and not all of it good.

Wouldn't this have more to do with something like "You are changing a character I know already into someone else"? People said that about the Kingpin in the Daredevil movie. But I doubt they would've had so much trouble if there was a new character that was Black.

I was intentionally being over the top to be a little silly. Sometimes it's the best way to address a subject. And technically a fetish isn't strictly sexual. I could have easily said "and his favorite color is green". I probably should have in retrospect. In any case, I think it would give some people pause due to the misconceptions people have about LGB and that can lead to lost sales.

In this situation you were talking about a fetish in a sexual sense. I think that's fairly clear. Maybe more realistic example of a situation would be: "If the background of Kinetik revealed a romantic relationship with a guy, would people be more or less likely to buy Hero products?"

Re: Alternate Sexualities in Champions and Supers settings

The target audience for superhero RPG tends to be hetro white males so a company would do well to pander ... I mean cater to that demographic.

Has the inclusion of heroes of color caused fewer White people to buy the books? Should we worry about that potential consequence?

For better or worse, things like sexuality, religion, political affiliation, etc aren't mentioned in the character descriptions unless they are key parts to the character.

Yes and no. Sometimes it's mentioned, sometimes it's not. I don't think that's a rule.

And while it does tend to suck not knowing for sure if the heroes and villains in the book match (or in the villain case oppose) your own choices, in some ways it really doesn't matter. Plus by not mentioning it, you avoid some backlash from the customers and public.

In some ways it doesn't really matter, but in some ways it does.

I doubt there would be as much "backlash" as people seem to imagine. I'd even say there would be at least a tad more "brand loyalty" with LGB gamers if you publish books with canonical LGB characters.

If Steve Long came out and said, "Defender is bisexual with a fetish for being Entangled." would people be more or less likely to buy Hero products? (Sorry Mr.Long, not trying to put words in your mouth, just offering a hypothetical.) In a business, sometimes you have to make these decisions.

That's an extremely silly hypothetical that wouldn't happen. Just because someone is LGB doesn't mean it's time to talk about kinky sexual fetishes or whatever. Don't oversexualize. And I'm not even asking that sexuality be stated so directly as that (although it might be in some particular backgrounds).

Re: Alternate Sexualities in Champions and Supers settings

It would not be a problem, if heteros would recieved the same amount of "extra effort". Currently neither sexuality get's noted as being the exclusive sexual orrientation of someone. What you try to do seems to give homsexuals an "advantage". over-emanzipation is a very easy form of discrimination.

So why should homo-supers recieve additional effort hetero-supers do not get? No "Gay Man", "Princess of Lesbos" or "Straigh Men" themed superheroes for the official books please. Such things are bound to step on the toes of somebody.

I was gonna respond to this, but Bloodstone said pretty much exactly what I would've said.

Re: Alternate Sexualities in Champions and Supers settings

And I just prooved that practically none is beign show as being canonically hetero-only. If fact I doubt you find more supers with "cleary heterosexual" in the writeup than ones with "homosexual" in the writeup.

Let me be more specific then, because this question is really more of what I am asking: What would be the big deal with having some more superhero characters that are shown canonically to have same-sex romantic relationships either currently or in the past?

Re: Alternate Sexualities in Champions and Supers settings

Who says being not explicitly noted as being homosexual means they aren't?

I am not saying that. I am asking, again, what would be the big deal with having some more superhero characters that are shown to be LGB canonically?

Re: Alternate Sexualities in Champions and Supers settings

So what would be the big deal with having some more superhero characters that are shown to be LGB canonically?

That is only a problem if you asume that everybody not stating something specifically, is automatically hetero-romantical and hetero-sexual.

 

I think every super not staing any preference specifically is a likely to have homo-sexual relationship/marriage and a hetero-sexual affair as Joe or Joan Average.

No, wait... look at my question there: "What would be the big deal with having some more superhero characters that are shown to be LGB canonically?" I'm not talking about interpreting the unspecified characters; I'm asking that question specifically.

Re: Alternate Sexualities in Champions and Supers settings

You don't want supers to be defined by their sexuality' date=' but you think it should be more often noted/defined. Frankly I can not see how the two words "is gay" make that much difference then. I think that decision is deliberately left to the GM implementing them, to not overcomplicate matters if he has a certain preference.[/quote']

 

I've tried to explain my POV, but I don't think you understand what I mean. Let me rephrase.

 

Having a background that shows a character is LGB is no less appropriate than having a background that shows a character is hetero. So what would be the big deal with having some more superhero characters that are shown to be LGB canonically? There will also be those characters that are unspecified/unknown. That's fine; I don't think anyone expects a checkbox for sexuality or anything. But if there are many, many character writeups that reveal that the character is hetero by describing pieces of their background that make it fairly clear, I don't see why there can't be some more characters that are shown to be LGB by describing pieces of their background that make it fairly clear.

Re: Alternate Sexualities in Champions and Supers settings

This asumes it play a myor role in the character concept that he has "a new girl every week". Like I said, what he does in his Private ID is not as interesting as what he does in his heroic ID and if being gay plays no mayor part in it, there is no reason to mention it.

I mean there is nothing in the writeup of Kinetik or Ironclad that says they are not gay (and uninterested in interspecies dating).

I guess I look at it like this: there are tons of writeups that include mention of previous/current relationships, if a male character was lucky/unlucky with women, who a female character is interested in on her super-team, etc. It's just part of who they are and their background, but it doesn't have a lot to do with their super ID. I'm not talking about doing anything more than that, honestly.

Re: Alternate Sexualities in Champions and Supers settings

The difference between ethnicity, background and religion on the one side and being LGB or hetero: The former is mroe or less obvious/becomes easier obvious.

You can see/deduce ethnicity and background from sight or hearing (of a voice) and you are fare more likely to know that someone is moslem (and thus can't eat pork) the same way you would know somebody is vegetarian. And it plays are greater role in his super ID (wich is the part that interests us the most in any character).

I don't see how someone's vegetarianism or religion would be any more obvious than someone's sexual orientation. I'd say that, as the very least, they are equally as obvious. It doesn't take very long to figure out if someone is heterosexual in the course of normal conversation (we invariably talk about past relationships or dating life, even if briefly). Orientation can play just as strong of a role in a super ID as either of those two. It would be in different ways, of course, but yeah.

Re: Alternate Sexualities in Champions and Supers settings

And is was pointed out often enough: You can just define Talisman, Dr. Destroyer, Gravitar or Teleios with whatever sexuality you like/think would fit. It's not like being gay, hetero, bi or something else would effect mayorly what they do.

Of course that raises one questions: Is your problem that there are no supeheroes that are partially denfined/based on being LGB? Kinetik is a Black Role Model, German Supers are always "Ambassadors for a not Nazi Germany", Moslemic Supers would show that Moslems can be tollerant (unlike the popular believe). But there is no LGB Role Model out there.

Believe me, I'm well aware of my ability to change the sexualities of characters if I wish.

And no, my problem isn't that I want characters based around their sexuality (although when you are a minority, your identity as that minority usually becomes more salient, so it makes sense that a gay superhero might become a spokesman for LGBT rights, etc.). It's just that there is so little canonical representation at all.

Re: Alternate Sexualities in Champions and Supers settings

Well, "realistic" numbers would probably be more like 3-4% wouldn't it?

 

Or are my demographics wrong here?

Not technically, but I'm basing 1/12 on a conservative estimate of LGB population in large cities, since that's where most superhero stories take place: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_sexual_orientation#United_States_2

Re: Alternate Sexualities in Champions and Supers settings

It's a fun coincidence that you guys have created this thread. Lately I've been thinking about this, but primarily as it relates to the Champions universe. It seems like canon gay characters barely exist at all. The only character writeup that mentions being gay is Hydro (which thankfully has been pointed out to me by people here). Justiciar is gay as well, but it seems to only be mentioned in other characters' writeups -- almost like the text mentioning his sexuality in his writeup was removed or is missing (sounds paranoid, but it really does read like that -- the writeups assume you already know this fact).

The thing is, since I'm a gay guy myself, I always look for LGB characters in anything I read or watch -- I can't help it. And if I don't find any LGB characters in tons and tons of supplements, I find that to be... well, at the very least lacking in verisimilitude. When there are only two characters out of hundreds with writeups that are described as being LGB (and one of those only indirectly), I feel that LGB characters are being ignored. Maybe not intentionally, but nevertheless ignored. We have a huge variety of character backgrounds (e.g., countries of origin, religions, ethnicities) represented, but virtually no LGB characters at all. Meanwhile, in Marvel and DC comics, there are many such characters, and I can easily find many other LGB characters in other roleplaying systems' source material. So I am a little frustrated with Hero Games's lack of inclusion. In my mind it would be like having no superheroes of color, or just a dozen or so scattered throughout other supplement books. I'd say if you are creating superhero writeups, about 1 in 12 of them should be lesbian or gay -- otherwise it's just not "realistic." Doesn't even have to be that many, really.

Re: Setting books for Fantasy Hero 6E?

Thanks, guys! I will definitely look into the Kamarathin book!

I may be overlooking something right in front of me, but are there any licensed setting books for Fantasy Hero 6E out there?

Re: STAR HERO Cover Sneak Peek!

Will we get to see a nice scan of the completed cover (with logo, text, etc.)?

Re: The cranky thread

I am frustrated and angry. I'm trying to complete a (very amicable and much agreed upon) civil union dissolution (i.e., divorce). Since we have nothing we disagree about, I'd like to use one of the low-cost online divorce services that we can fill out ourselves instead of being charged around $2500 for getting a lawyer to do it. Unfortunately, NONE of the sites I have found (e.g., 3stepdivorce.com, legalzoom.com) offer help with civil unions. I'm checking on completecase.com, but I'm not holding my breath. Google searches and the like reveal nothing of any use.

It's rare that I feel my second class citizenship so strongly. Makes me angry, sad, and very cranky.

This is my very first post to the cranky thread.

Re: STAR HERO Cover Sneak Peek!

I like. Dynamic. I can't wait to see the full version of the cover with the logo!

Re: Alien Wars spaceship construction

The Escape Pod listed in Terran Empire has a Size of 3, giving it a 1x2 hex size, or 2m x 4m (8 square meters). I hope that helps! Let me know if you need any more information.

Re: Ctrl+V

http://www.facebook.com/chlapowski

Re: Ctrl+V

Again, I didn't want to be incessant texting guy. lol

Re: Ctrl+V

Taio cruz

Re: Ctrl+V

52161

Re: "Space" music recommendation!

Well... it seemed kinda, Idunno... obvious?

 

I try to recommend stuff folks might not have heard before, and I figure pretty much everyone here knows about Vangelis.

Um, actually I hadn't! Just listened to some of his stuff in samples. Really great. The 1492 music is fantastic, for instance. But I never knew much about the Blade Runner music 'til now.

Re: Ideas for a Star Hero solo campaign

On second thought, maybe the friend of the PC will have ESP, and the Malvan female is someone who wants to help them, so she provides the ship to get around in. Actually, maybe these things are Malvan technology. It would make sense that a Malvan might get involved then.

Re: Ideas for a Star Hero solo campaign

I'm mulling over the "group of NPCs plus the PC" idea, although that might be a little unwieldy for me. Not sure I can handle the antagonists and other NPCs and the protagonist NPCs' interactions all at once. Maybe there could be two other NPCs, one a good friend of the PC and another the Malvan female I mentioned.

The PC will be a human scientist, possibly a xeno-botanist. He'll have some combat experience. A few years ago he and a group of scientists were on a planet gathering data, and they were attacked by a group of aliens (not sure which race yet). Apparently the aliens were looking for something on the planet. The humans had to fight to survive this for several weeks (months?) until they could escape.

I'm thinking that the aliens eventually found what they were looking for. And now they are looking for 5-6 other pieces of this thing. They'll use this to construct something (?) that will cause a Bad Thing to happen (conquest, destruction?). And perhaps PC has decided to find these objects ahead of the aliens in other to prevent this Bad Thing from happening. I believe the Malvan female might have ESP and is how the PC can determine where the objects might be, sending them to various places around the galaxy.