Balabanto

Re: Favorite lost villain group

Dominique, there are large numbers of ways to build an extremely powerful character. But when the average PC is built on 250-350 points, has a SPD of 5, a DEX of 23, and an 11d6 attack, any TWO of these guys would rip the PC's a new behind. And you know, those averages are still pretty much in evidence today. Even at the high end of the scale, with the way the new rules work in terms of Chargen, you're still not tipping the scales at 5d6 RKA.

And there's the issue.

Lung Hung didn't need a SPD of whatever it was. The only SPD Lung Hung ever needed in my game to bedevil the PC's was a 7, because the top range for most PC's was a 6. Just the simple ability to recover on a phase where the PC's didn't go was enough to make her a virtual god.

The system still hasn't broken the "2 die staging rule" where 2 more dice of power is radically overpowering. Moving it up to a 3d6 staging rule (Which seems to be closer to the 5th edition design benchmark) has WRECKED the combat system and the carefully engineered math.

The problem is that some people only look at chargen and point totals. But it's how those point totals affected the combat rules that made Lung Hung a problem.

Re: Favorite lost villain group

The problem with Lung Hung was that his powers and abilities were ridiculous. The Damage Reduction was off the charts, and everything else, including the number of actions he got, was absurd.

Lung Hung owned the PC's when I ran that adventure for two turns, and then escaped.

How did he escape? She put on her damn Cheongsam after teleporting into the next room and made an acting roll. It was REAL easy. And my players are REAL smart.

I was stunned with how powerful they were, and after that, they were pretty much only encountered in groups of 1-2 with agent backup.

Re: Favorite lost villain group

Well, of course, except the Corruptors of All, who were supposed to make it into 4th, but didn't.

(Thanks, Dennis....)

Really, though, VOICE was built retardedly. They were so crackmonkey uber compared to standard PC's at the time that most characters spent their time going "WHAT'S THAT GUY'S DEX AND SPD?"

Maybe in 5th they would seem a little less powerful to people who play the system as written, but I'd be taking them down a peg if I got that assignment. Mixed groups are deadly because players ignore agents, not because the supers are uber.

Re: Rejected Superhero Names

The Amazing Colonoscopy Man...

Captain Flatulence

The Dweeb!

Look out, here comes...The Herpetologist!

The Wombateer!

Re: Rejected Superhero Names

The Griller: He leaves big black stripes that smoke on the side of people's bodies.

Re: Favorite lost villain group

I actually spoke to Steve about that. He says he has no plans to do anything with them, so that's really up to him and Dave. And he does have the rights, apparently.

Re: Rejected Superhero Names

The Constipator!: We won't say what he does. It's not polite!

Captain Orbital Bombardment (Self Only): Well...this is not very useful, but it is rejected.

Doctor Malpractice: Well...this is also self explanatory...

Re: Rejected Superhero Names

Cameraman: He flies around and films things. That's it.

Re: Favorite lost villain group

Shockwave=Arrowhead.

CLOWN. Well, you'll see CLOWN in Legacies eventually since they seem to be so popular.

Here's a few rejected superhero names: Feel free to add to the list at will.

Dark Vigilante: The Dark Dickwad...

Powered Armor with Particle Beam Powers: Agitator

Re: Veronica Mars

No, but when I do my Teen Champions Paul Revere High supplement, you'll get to see a lot of things in that style.

Re: [Char] Monster Man [Long]

You don't need to. Historically speaking, he, in fact, is half black.

Re: [Char] Monster Man [Long]

The worst part about Monster Man is that he really should be fifteen characters. 5 Classic, 5 Blaxploitation, and 5 CGI.

Re: When did [Title X] Jumping the Shark

You are not correct. Only issues of JLA Prior to issue #100 were erased from continuity. The origin story was retold, and everything prior to that, I believe, was erased from continuity.

Re: Review: Sharper Than A Serpent's Tooth

A few comments/questions for you, Balabanto (and rest assured, I mean this genuinely and innocently, without any intention to arouse your ire). I would simply like your opinion. Obviously, we fall on the opposite side of the tracks in regards to this book, and I'd like to hear more of what you have to say - your critique may improve how I use the book. As I freely admit my love of reptiles may have resulted in me seeing things with rose-colored glasses, and caused me to miss issues I might have had with the book otherwise.

 

It would seem that the issues you have speak as much for your opinion of HERO books in general these days as much as issues specifically with this book. Am I somewhat correct in this assumption? If that is true (again, assuming I'm right), would you feel that the power levels of the villains, in general, is on par with the higher power levels my group uses? (as mentioned before, we're at 300 base points, up to 150 disads, and around 50 xp. Average high-end attacks cap around 15d6 or so, though I haven't enforced hard limits.) Eg. Gorgon IS very powerful, but I'm fairly sure my PCs could whoop her in a single turn (ie. within 12 phases), with focused attacks and sound tactics + teamwork, and end up badly bruised but still whole. I can't expect you to know the specifics of my players, but what things would you see as problems, even dealing with high-powered PCs?

 

Gorgon's colossal STR in combination with that Killing Attack leads to instant weed whacking. Keep in mind, this part of the adventure is "Race against time." So, when you have a character throwing out a big KA virtually every phase, and using the PC's as weapons against each other with a grab and squeeze +smash, it's either double your pleasure OR Stun Lotto, and she will likely have the advantage of surprise. Remember, the most powerful twink in the game is still as many dice of KA as you can possbily generate.

 

Again, an honest question as opposed to veiled criticism of your opinions: had any of the villains presented in this book, aside from King Cobra, appeared anywhere else before? I don't recall seeing them anywhere else - but I admit my experiences with books previous to 5th ed. are fairly limited.

 

This was actually PART of the problem, Spidey. There were a million villains they could have rebuilt that they HAD the rights to and didn't.

 

What exactly do you mean by "voodoo math"? I didn't quite follow you there. I assumed you meant "overly complicated power constructs", but I wasn't sure.

 

Krait runs on the following principle. I have a super-high DEX, AND I Dex and SPD drain my opponents. You're failing to take the combat system into account. If I delay or hold my action, and wait to drain them until a phase where their SPD doesn't cross over, like, say, phase one, they don't get to go again until their SPD crosses over with another. This means I'm likely to get another action immediately, where I can drain their DEX + SPD again. That character is OUT OF THE COMBAT, possibly the scenario if you're running a race against time deal.

 

Your opinion of the villains aside, how did you feel about the overall plot of the story? Interesting, compelling, or something considerably less positive?

I also didn't like the story. It felt railroady and optionless. The only thing it takes to totally destroy this plot is Mind Scan and Tunnelling.

Re: Review: Sharper Than A Serpent's Tooth

Actually, I didn't like the revised King Cobra and his flunkies.

I loathed Gorgon, who is incredibly powerful as well as virtually impervious to the attacks of most starting characters.

Krait is flat out broken, I don't believe anyone should have the ability to go first, drain your speed and DEX, and keep all of his levels in DCV while you attack. Quite frankly, that sheet should be burned at the stake.

Taking away King Cobra's potions and giving him the power directly? Another bad move. 100 new agents an hour? Gimme a break!

Resetting these guys to zero was, while necessary, do-able in a better way. The Brawling Balabanto feels that they should have stayed truer to the origins of the original characters. They already had the rights to them, there was no need to mess with things this much.

If you can do it with FOXBAT, for gods sake, you can do it with King Cobra.

There is a tendency in 5th edition to "Ultimize" villains in the same way that Ultimate Marvel does. Quite frankly, more powerful doesn't mean better, and good storytelling and writing will win over more powerful every time.

I didn't like this sourcebook. I can't even use it. The power level of my game is too low for it because I didn't upgrade my PC's power level when the edition switch happened. Nor will I. They took close to 15 years of universal standard when the change happened, and threw it out the window. Now people just build stuff with what they THINK the character should have instead of thinking about game balance vis a vis the average group of player characters.

I don't consider that "right-thinking." A good GM cares about his players. A good game designer keeps things simple and eliminates voodoo math so the GM can run the scenario easily.

Consider me on the side of the dinosaurs, but I was so disappointed in this sourcebook that if I didn't feel honor-bound to support the company to make sure people know and love Hero System, I wouldn't have put out the money for it.

Re: CKC + USPD updates

Well, you'll get to see a version of them in Mind over Matter that assumes they really have been active in your gameworld for as long as the system has been published. Hide under a rock, my friend.

Re: Quote of the Week from my gaming group...

During an exchange between two NPCs, one of whom is a self-styled cowboy gunslinger and the other is the most powerful native american shaman in the world.

"The Cowboy": There you go again with all that great spirit stuff.

"The Shaman: (Grabs The Cowboy by the shirt...) Listen up, Ruxnall. The Great Spirit thinks you suck!

Re: Quote of the Week from my gaming group...

Millennium Guard interviews Captain Unity about some information

Magus: I can't think of anything else. Someone else ask some questions!

Gibraltar: I'll ask some questions!

Partacel: No, Gibraltar. Let Hyperdrive do it!

Gibraltar: Why?

Partacel: Because he asks questions logically!

-----------

Partacel: We could always ask Dr. Brutallo!

Shadowsilver: It sounds like an advice column. Ask Dr. Brutallo!

Re: When did [Title X] Jumping the Shark

Well, really, the problem was that DC really jumped the Shark in the late 60's.

I mean, come on. The Eraser Who Tried to Rub Out Batman?

That killed YEARS of comics for me right there.

Re: CHAMPIONS REVISED -- If We Do It, What Would You Like To See?

I am certain that I can write a decent Mechanon origin. The point is, I feel like I'm treading on sacred ground and I don't want to tamper with the classics.

Re: Quote of the Week from my gaming group...

This after-session scene occurred over Yahoo Messenger, when Prestige, after discovering her mother was queen of an entire magical dimension, went to Sarah's place.

Sarah looks up, and comes over to the window. "Oh...uhm...hi... " She says. "I was just working on my stepmom's birthday present. Come in.'

Prestige: "You know those fairy tales about the poor girl with a single parent who learns that her father is reallya megamillionair or where she finds out that she is really royalty in a far off dim...place....those stories really leave out the....complications that occur."

Sarah: "What?" She says. "All I did was build a shopping list drone. Yeah, fairy princess. Look at this...you type in the data, like this, and then it scans the vicinity for items that match the data, and it flies over, and you follow it around and do your shopping with it...cool...hu...FAIRY PRINCESS? BAWK?"

Sarah : "That's the best prank ever. You're not only a magician, you're a fairy princess with your own kingdom. So who's Prince Charming? If you tell me Mervin Spitzner, I'll be back after the barfing stops."

Prestige's face is dead serious." 'Prince Charming' would be who ever the divination spells say it is."

Sarah blinks "Excuse me?" She says. "All right...you are serious." She begins pacing back and forth. "So if the Divination spells say it's a gopher, you have to marry a gopher, and..." She's pacing and pacing. She turns on a sound suppression field. She looks like she needs to explode. "WAIT A MINUTE! Your marriage is ARRANGED BY A WIZARD? NOT EVEN BY YOUR FAMILY? Some twit in a pointy hat wiggles his fingers and says "Marry George!He's the one???"

Re: When did [Title X] Jumping the Shark

I don't mind Spider Man as an avenger:

But let's give a brief list, shall we?

Amazing Spider Man: Venom. A needless villain who added nothing to canon and spawned a clone called KARNAGE? Who was writing this stuff? Crack salesmen? It didn't really jump the shark until Clone Saga. Strazynski's bringing it back, but sometimes I think he'd rather kill Quesada than work with him.

Iron Man: Oh, lord. This is a case of the individual hero's book jumping the shark because of what they did to him in another. Kang once, Ultron Twice?

WHERE IS HIS CLASSIC ROGUES GALLERY?

MELTER? (DEAD)

Blizzard (Thunderbolts? EAT MY SHORTS),

Whiplash/Blacklash (Who knows?).

Where's Midas and Firebrand (Oh, wait, that's right, he's a HERO now, just kill me). Even that Looney Lama guy was a better character than most of Iron Man's current enemies. Only the Mandarin has been retained.

Living Laser has become an energy being cariacture of himself. If EVER there was a character that needed a reboot, it was this one.

Titanium Man? Oh, wait, that's right STARK PAYS HIS SALARY NOW!

Justin Hammer and Obidiah Stane are pretty much done, but they were great characters too.

And you know, when was the last time Iron Man REALLY faced Ultimo?

Iron Man has received the WORST treatment of any character in Marvel, and his portrayal in Civil War was astonishingly awful.

The thing that amazes me the most about this is that people let this happen over and over again to him. They even managed to make him RIGHT during Civil War (Which was also wrong, the real Tony Stark, the Tony Stark I remember, wouldn't stand for this), and the spiral just kept getting worse...

And now, that all THIS crap happened to him, he's Ultron...AND A GIRL!!!!!!!!!

When is this madness going to end?

Captain America: I think you all know my opinion on this one already, so I won't review it here. Just look at my signature.

Avengers: Disassembled says it all.

Fantastic Four: That AWFUL Doom Story that Mark Waid wrote. I wanted to throttle him.

Iron Fist: This is a character that has been constantly written like garbage, and when Iron Fist: The Immortal came out, I became completely disgusted.

The Punisher: The Punisher jumped the shark at the moment of his creation! Doesn't anyone understand that he was created AS AN ANTAGONIST FOR SPIDER MAN? HE WAS NEVER MEANT TO HAVE ANY SORT OF POPULARITY! They should put him back where he belongs.

I own this comic. He was not portrayed sympathetically. Only a total idiot could even find sympathy for him if you love superheroes.

X-Men: After issue #200, original series, this book was pretty much dead to me. The law of economy of characters destroyed it.

There are as many "major" characters in my own world as some of these comic book companies. Unfortunately, I don't try and cram them all into one arc, because I'M NOT A MORON!

Re: CHAMPIONS REVISED -- If We Do It, What Would You Like To See?

I realized a bigger problem with Champions Revised than I thought, and it all goes back to Dennis Malonee again.

I realize that Steve TRIED to fix this in the first edition of the champions sourcebook, but the truth is, that I was probably as frustrated as the rest of you.

Ready...

Thanks to Dennis Malonee...

MECHANON HAS NO ORIGIN!

That's right! Mechanon has no origin because in First, Second, and Third editions, he was the League of Champions Robot Butler....

Only now, he CAN'T be.

Re: [Review] The Algernon Files 2.0 (Hero Edition)

The Brawling Balabanto loves the Table of Contentions:

The Brawling Balabanto will run Malthus against Contention One, as Doc Steel and the Sentinels Save Lives,

Business Confidence also against Contention One, as they destroy vast amounts of property with attack misses,

And Wombat Paradigm just because.