Streamlining the system

[Mark Taylor]

Originally posted by Snarf

And since active defense is a standalone roll instead of resisted, buying a few levels makes you invincible to everything but surprise attacks. That's just one way GURPS gets broken when you try to do superhero level games. It would have been way better if they had kept it consistent.

 

I completely agree, which is why I use a few simple house rules which fix defense rolls when running GURPS.

[Caveman]

I thought that rolling 3d6 trying to roll 11 or less WAS a core mechanic. you modify the target number from there(combat OR skills). Saying that I try to make it easier for the players by saying 11 + OCV - roll = dcv you hit and I as the illustrious gm applies modifiers at that point to make it easier for the players if they are new to the game. However, I have run into confusing or fuzzy game mechanics in alot of different game systems(D&D, Gurps, MSH(wayback), etc...

 

 

 

Originally posted by archer

You were implying that the core mechanic of Hero was to roll 11 or less on 3d6, and that this was universal to skills and combat.

 

I'll agree that you always roll 3d6 under a target number, but that target number is generated in fundamentally different ways for noncombat skills and combat.

[M-3]

I've already done something similar although the other way around.

 

I've changed CV to be equal to 1+DEX/5 and ECV to be equal to 1+EGO/5.

 

This makes the combat values follow the same sort of progression that skill rolls do. It also makes Combat Skill Levels reasonably cost effective (in a superheroic game, 8pt levels are still pretty points-ineffecient, but in a heroic game, they make sense once your DEX hits 18).

With CSL's becoming more cost-effecient and DEX losing some of its importance, players have also started giving their characters DEX scores that actually fit their concept. Previously, a "large, strong but somewhat clumsy, ogrish type" would probably have a DEX of about 14 which is well above average, because giving him the DEX that concept actually calls for (let's say about 8) would completely cripple the character and compensating for it with CSLs would be more expensive than just buying more DEX.

[Shikarr]

I can understand that some people will always think of the Hero System as being complex. And in a sense it is simply because of the amount of math used in it not necessarily the complexity of the math. Now I would say any grade schooler should be able to do any of the math involved and certainly any middle schooler should easily be able to do that. With that said unfortunately I must also admit that that is not the case. Whether it is the schools or the students or just basic laziness, I don't know but to some the game is just beyond them in its complexity. I have played it for years and to me it is an easy and unified system that is capable of an amazing range of games(although at times it has a few shortcomings) that take the breath away. The games I run now days are for experienced players although even they dislike the amount of math in the games so I do it simply and easily for them. Pretty much the only math they have to deal with in my games is the to hit roll. I do alot of the math myself and most of the character generation. They tell me what they want their characters to do and I figure it out for them. The system has worked for several years now and my latest campaign is now almost a year old. Overall my advice is just to give the players what they want in level of complexity. If they like to tweak on a character let them with some oversite if they just want a character and to roleplay then make up the character for them and let play. Streamlining Hero system is easy to do but just involves more work for the game master is all but for the player the system can be very math free as long as you make sure what rolls and numbers you are going to need for your players. Just have the math done for them and the game turns very easy. Of course I am looking forward to the sidekick supplement also which will offer even better ideas for simplifing and streamlining the game.

[Almafeta]

There's been a discussion on this going for over a year at RPGnet, and all sorts of ideas have been slung around -- pick and choose from those you like:

 

http://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?s=&threadid=19039

[Intrope]

I don't have an issue with the complexity of HERO; it's good complexity-the ability to model nearly anything without new rules.

 

The reason I reverse the math comes from an empirical observation: switching from D&D 2.0 to 3.0 made it both easier and faster for people to roll to hit. The only reasons I can figure is that:

 

-it's easier/faster for people to add than subtract (almost certainly true)

-it's easier for people to roll and see what they hit than figure out what they need to roll and then roll. (probably).

 

Both of these should apply as well to HERO as AAD&D. So, math reversals for me and my crew. YMMV, past performance is no guarantee of future results, all predictions false or your money back, etc.

[Killer Shrike]

If you want to simplify character creation, buy Hero Designer 2.

 

I promise you, unless you are a total non-computer using person you will be amazed at how much time it will save you.

 

For those who got burned by previous HERO compatible CG software where a crafty and computer savvy player could hack the hell out of it, put your burn scars aside -- HD v2 is designed to support the rules as written in the book.

 

It's a very solid piece of software in general terms (and considering its the product of 1 developer rather than a team of developers is notable), and in terms of RPG software its downright amazing. And it gets better every week -- hardly a few days go by without Dan Simon adding new functionality or tweaks to the system. And thats not because its buggy or needs to be patched, 9 times out of 10 its extra or enhanced functionality.

 

Its the most valuable money Ive ever spent on a Roleplaying product of any kind, and my groaning book shelves indicate that this means something as Ive bought more than one or two game books in my day

 

As far as the die rolling, I too prefer to use the 11+OCV-3d6=DCV hit roll in combat. My main reason has nothing to do with adding or subtracting -- I just dont want to outright tell the players what DCVs they are trying to hit. Heightens the suspense that way.

[Intrope]

Originally posted by Killer Shrike

If you want to simplify character creation, buy Hero Designer 2.

 

I promise you, unless you are a total non-computer using person you will be amazed at how much time it will save you.

 

Oh Definitely!

 

And just to show off Hero Designer:

Hero Designer v2: (Total: 8 Active Cost, 2 Real Cost) Keeps Track of all your characters Eidetic Memory (5 Active Points); Only to keep track of HERO characters Power loses almost all of its effectiveness (-2), OAF Bulky Fragile (Focus: Computer; -1 3/4) (Real Cost: 1) plus Get all the math right Lightning Calculator (3 Active Points); Only computes HERO Math Power loses almost all of its effectiveness (-2), OAF Bulky Fragile (Focus: Computer; -1 3/4) (Real Cost: 1)