Simple solutions to try first

[dstarfire]

I'm no expert on hero, wouldn't even call myself a novice yet, but in reading the boards, I've seen a LOT of questions that can be answered with a little common sense. Unfortunately, common sense is the first thing to disappear when a rules dispute arises.

 

That said, here's some simple solutions to try before you go asking for help:

 

1. Throw out the rules.

If the players and GM can agree on something, the rules aren't neccesary. Rules exist solely for conflict resolution.

 

2. Is it neccesary?

Do you REALLY need to work out the mechanics of a [insert name of item here]? See idea 1

 

3. negotiate with the players/gm

Same general idea as before. If you want to do something just for the flavor/role-play aspect, there's no need to get the rules involved.

 

for GM's

3. Just say no.

A lot of questions seem to revolve around "how do I stop players from abusing ....?". Just say "no, you can't do that". If you feel it's neccesary (and appropriate) you can explain how doing that would be severely unbalancing.

 

4. If you do it, I can do it too.

As an alternative to number 3, warn the players that every tactic, tweak, and power-gaming trick they use can and will be used against them. This trick often stops munchkins dead in their tracks.

 

Yes, these ideas won't apply in all situations, and will be totally anathema to the rules-lawyers or other detail-oriented (aka anal retentive) people out there, but if you don't like it then don't use it. (actually, that should be idea number 5)

[Steve Long]

Since none of this is a question, I've moved it to the "Discussion" boards.

[Arthur]

Re: Simple solutions to try first

 

Originally posted by dstarfire

I'm no expert on hero, wouldn't even call myself a novice yet, but in reading the

 

I started playing Champions back in 1984 (before it was even called Hero System). I AM an expert (he said semi-modestly).

 

 

1. Throw out the rules.

If the players and GM can agree on

 

I wouldn't go that far. However, I do concur that many players take the rules thing too far. For instance, if a rigorous application of the rules is too complex, use the "roll your own Modifier" approach. It's there for a reason. Think of the effect FIRST, then see if a simple application of modifiers will simulate it. If not, then write up what it does, then make up modifiers if necessary.

 

 

2. Is it neccesary?

Do you REALLY need to work out the mechanics of a [insert name of item here]?

 

I remember that going too far in Fantasy Hero. It almost got to the point of defining rocks: (six levels shrinking Always On; Automaton; -6" running; etc.).

 

3. Just say no.

A lot of questions seem to revolve around "how do I stop players from abusing

 

Hmmm. I dislike a completely arbitrary "I don't allow that". One of the beauties of the Hero System is that it never ever says "you cannot do this". It just gives a point cost. Now, before someone brings up the old "it doesn't do absolutes" argument, well, that's a function of the real number system, not the game. An infinite effect requires an infinite number of points.

 

However, some things are not in genre. Rather than disallow it completely, I prefer to use a "Rarity" modifier. For instance, in FH, I will let PCs buy natural Resistant Defenses ("Toughness"). However, I require the Armor Power with a +1 "Rarity" Advantage. If the rPD or rED goes beyond 3, then the extra points require a +3 "Extreme Rarity" Advantage. Etc.

 

 

4. If you do it, I can do it too.

As an alternative to number 3, warn the players that every tactic, tweak, and

 

Reminds me of an old AD&D game I was in where our nemesis (a high-level fighter) kept showing up even after we'd killed him. The opposition can use Resurrection too, you know.

 

You have some good ideas. Notice I'm not really disagreeing with you much.

[Dust Raven]

Re: Simple solutions to try first

 

Originally posted by dstarfire

1. Throw out the rules.

I don't really ever "throw out" the rules, nor to I suggest it as a first resort (unless you are playing a rules light game in the first place). I generally consider this a last resort for GMs. If I can't figure out how to do it using the rules, I'll either make a rule for it, or just hand wave it in or away.

 

2. Is it neccesary?[./quote]

This is almost always my first course of action and I highly recomend it. Like with headlights or vehicles or the reflector on a bike helmet. And just how to you simulate having a library card? Just have it and be done with it. If it's gonna grant a character a significent advantage (or create a a disadvantage) then the rules should be looked at, but otherwise just keep playing.

 

3. negotiate with the players/gm

I wouldn't say there's no need to get the rules involved. The rules are there for a reason. I'd stick with the advice in #2 here.

 

3. Just say no.

Fortunately, I don't find the need to "just say no" very often. There are occasions when someone will ask for something outragous and I'll just "not in this genre" and keep playing. More often I'll just tell them what they'll need for it and how many points it'll cost (for the power, or just the skill to perform the action). Not only does it prevent an arguement, it gives the player something to work toward if they are serious about it.

 

4. If you do it, I can do it too.

I've always done this, and made sure that my players know it. I also let them know it works both ways. Occasionally I'll confront the heroes with a villain possessed of a power construct that seems to overwhelm them and they'll want it too. If they work at getting it (earning xps and role-playing its acquisition) I let them have it. Of course, most player characters in my game don't need or want an orbital doomsday machine, but if they ever save up enough points...

[ghost-angel]

Re: Re: Simple solutions to try first

 

Originally posted by Dust Raven

Of course, most player characters in my game don't need or want an orbital doomsday machine, but if they ever save up enough points...

 

I saved up enough points for one of those, but ... my Orbital Doomsday Device has yet to arrive .. I got the points from my Experience Plus Visa, it said 6-8 weeks for delivery but, honest now, who has time to wait that long to blow up the planet?

 

to comment on the above .. we never throw out the rules wholesale, but if the dramatics of a scene would be ruined by sticking to the rules we tend to ignore them favoring story and plot over The Numbers.