New Mechanic: Effective Range

[Thia Halmades]

For those weapons where you want to simulate a 'real world' firearm design, we often use Limited Range so firearms aren't traveling... well, way further than they should. However, that's a finite measure. By contrast, 'Reduced by Range' simulates a damage drop off for shotties and such. Perhaps I'm repeating a rule that already exists, but simply, I'm proposing a hybrid:

 

Effective Range (-1/4); a power with this limitation has an effective range, significantly less (often 1/2 or less) than the total listed range for the power. Additionally, once the Effective Range is reached, the power has a drop-off in Damage Classes, 1 DC per Hex beyond its effective range.

 

ex: A revolver has Effective Range (30", -1/4). It will do full damage up to 30"; at 31", it loses one Damage Class. At 33", it loses 3 Damage Classes, and so on.

 

Am I reinventing the wheel here? Is this already covered by the text? Or would y'all make use of this?

[ghost-angel]

Re: New Mechanic: Effective Range

 

I'd call this a version of Limited Range.

[Thia Halmades]

Re: New Mechanic: Effective Range

 

That's why I gave it -1/4. I'm not saying it doesn't fit under a prior mechanic, I'm saying it doesn't exist in this form anywhere in game; it's not worth -1/2 by any stretch. So you agree with the cost, then?

[ghost-angel]

Re: New Mechanic: Effective Range

 

Yeah, sounds about right for the Limitation.

[PhilFleischmann]

Re: New Mechanic: Effective Range

 

It seems to me that the first few hexes of range are a lot more valuable then the last few. A 12d6 EB has a default range of 60*5 = 300 hexes! When was the last time in a game you tried to hit a target 300 hexes away? Or even 200? Or 100? Most combats (in any genre*) happen at much closer ranges than that.

 

So a "limited range" that takes the default from 300 hexes down to 100 hexes is really not very limiting at all. IMO, even that isn't worth -1/4.

 

The general guideline I use is:

Default Range = 5x Active points in hexes (as per RAW)

Limited Range (-1/4) = 1/5 Active Points in hexes.

No Range (-1/2) = no range, same or adjacent hex only (as per RAW)

 

*With the possible exception of vehicular combat in fairly high-tech settings. But many of those will use MegaScaled ranges, so the number of hexes would still apply. But even two pre-modern pirate ships generally don't shoot their cannons at each other from 200 meters away.

[Mike W]

Re: New Mechanic: Effective Range

 

Well, real world weapons don't necessarily travel "further than they should". It's just that so few people are capable of making a shot at such extreme ranges that the extra range is meaningless - to say nothing of the fact that there are often objects which keep a bullet or other weapon the full distance that it is capable of going. I mean, good sniper rifles can fire a bullet over a mile, but who can actaully hit anything at that range? Virtually no one.

 

I don't really see this limit of being much use because of that. Plus, most games don't have big enough battle fields for the limit to come into play. In Champs, for example, you hardly ever have to hit anyone more than 15 or 20 inches away(and even those are unusually long shots given how much move most Champs characters have(and the fact that so many fights take place in the city where buildings and such restrict the battlefield lines of sight). It might be of use in Fantasy Hero but that's about it(maybe Space Hero for ship combat). Almost any other genre, the battlefields are usually far too small for the limit to matter as even at 1/10 the base range, an EB would still have an effective range of 30". More than enough for almost any circumstance.

[Sean Waters]

Re: New Mechanic: Effective Range

 

Hero used to do range modifiers differently -1 per 3" IIRC, that made shots at extreme ranges almost impossible anyway for all but the luckiest and most skilled. As things are at present, a decent 'superhero' type can hit a target at extreme range about 1 in 4 (assuming that it is not, you know, moving, and most targets at that range don't know it is coming). The range modifier at 300" is -12.

 

You might be better off with a limitation that affects range modifiers more quickly: Range modifier -4 per step (-1/4)

 

That would make a long range attack much more difficult, but preserve the existing mechanical structure, and would probably be appropriate for a lot of weapons. You might even want a -6 per step -1/2 limtiation for handguns, as they are more difficult to steady.

 

You might then reduce the limtiation value by limtiing it through a focus:

 

3d6 RKA 45 points

Increased range modifier -1/4 saves 11 points

Limitation purchased with focus -1 OAF (Tripod)

Total saving 6 points, final cost 45-6=39 points, so that when using a tripod the range modifier is normal. Concentration and extra time might alos be appropriate to limit the limtiation value.

 

Something like that, anyway

 

Snipers might even be able to buy a 'naked limitation' to offset the limitation.

[Mestopheles]

Re: New Mechanic: Effective Range

 

For those weapons where you want to simulate a 'real world' firearm design' date=' we often use Limited Range so firearms aren't traveling... well, way further than they should. [/quote']

I think ranges for firearms are reallistic, but that standard range penalties might need adjustment to reflect how reflect how difficult a long shot can really be. If you're using standard sights and engaging from 300 meters or greater, you're likely to miss if you're not a sniper (a man-sized target that's 150 hexes away isn't actually a tough shot with a rifle, but outside that even an infantryman is firing "hail mary" rounds). It might be worthwhile to design a mechanic to limit handguns' long range accuracy, but to me 99% of the time the limitation will case a miss, so I'd suggest greater penalties to CSLs past the limited range defined by the power.

However' date=' that's a finite measure. By contrast, 'Reduced by Range' simulates a damage drop off for shotties and such. [/quote']

I think I understand what you're trying to accomplish here, but honestly firearms (even handguns) have an actual range that far exceeds their effective range due to optical shortcomings and the variables of long-distance shooting like wind, gravitational deflection, and the vibrations in the shooter's hands caused by heartbeat, breathing, muscle tremors, etc.

Perhaps I'm repeating a rule that already exists, but simply, I'm proposing a hybrid:

 

Effective Range (-1/4); a power with this limitation has an effective range, significantly less (often 1/2 or less) than the total listed range for the power. Additionally, once the Effective Range is reached, the power has a drop-off in Damage Classes, 1 DC per Hex beyond its effective range.

 

ex: A revolver has Effective Range (30", -1/4). It will do full damage up to 30"; at 31", it loses one Damage Class. At 33", it loses 3 Damage Classes, and so on.

Again, I like the general idea, but I think the mechanical constraint should result in no damage or full damage past optimal range, with a penalty to hit for exceeding the stability and optics of your weapon. If someone hits you with a .357 magnum revolver from 150 meters away, the difference in velocity is barely measureable. It's just extremely unlikely anyone is going to score a hit with an iron sights pistol at greater than 25-50 meters.

Am I reinventing the wheel here? Is this already covered by the text? Or would y'all make use of this?

I don't think your concept is unnecessary, but the adjustment of DCs seems inappropriate.