Opposite Schools of Magic

[Lezentauw]

When creating spells for schools, do you take into consideration the differences of opposite schools of magic.

 

For example, Fire is always considered opposite of Water in the elemental branch. Would you put a limitation on a spell called Ice Armor, that it would lose some of its effectiveness against fire based spells? Or would you go the other way, and have Ice Armor purchase more defense only vs fire based attacks? Just curious...

[Karmakaze]

Re: Opposite Schools of Magic

 

It depends a lot on the setting involved.

 

If it's a four or five element setting (like, say, Avatar or Ronin Warriors), then yes, absolutely, there will be interaction. Implementation is again going to vary a lot by setting.

 

If it's a setting where everyone using magic is locked into schools and every school has an opposite, then I'd probably put it in as a 0-point limitation, and have defenses slightly weakened against the opposing force.

 

On the other hand, if it's a setting where everyone using magic is locked into schools and every school has a "compliment" (for example, healing and necromancy are simply two sides of the same coin), then I'd probably negate a DC off of "complimentary" attacks (on the grounds that the defender will know how to handle a similar magic to their own) and possibly more for "matching" attacks. And, again, if it's setting wide, it's likely a 0-point limitation.

 

On the gripping hand, if you're not locking everyone into an opposite/compliment, then I'd apply it on a per-power basis. That is, when the spell is built, define whether it is strengthened, weakened, or neutral to it's opposing force, and apply the corresponding advantage or limitation. For example, a wall of water might be easily evaporated by a firebolt, but a wall of ice would extinguish it.

[Justin]

Re: Opposite Schools of Magic

 

Depends on what you wanted to do.

 

Karma's got some great ideas, but there are other alternatives, such as having the effects be defined as "unpredictable" when one school of magic attempts to affect a spell from a different school. You could either have a random effect (roll on a chart or GM fiat), "real physics" logic (ice is vulnerable to heat, but it takes a long time to transmit heat through ice, so maybe the vulnerability is mitigated), or whatever you wish. Personally I like the "random effect" idea, but if your players arn't comfortable with the idea, you might end up with the peasants revolting.

[IndianaJoe3]

Re: Opposite Schools of Magic

 

The Ultimate Energy Projector has extensive lists of how various elemental effects might interact in a, "realistic" manner. It was written for 5e, but is still useful.

[Lezentauw]

Re: Opposite Schools of Magic

 

Ok, I found the notes concerning opposite elements in UEP. It offers some interesting ideas, if I chose to incorporate them. I was more wondering if other people bothered to incorporate this concept, or they just considered it part of the special affect.

[bigbywolfe]

Re: Opposite Schools of Magic

 

One interesting variation I've seen has been opposite "elements" are basically equal to each other but weak and strong to the other two. I think the reasoning was it seemed odd that fire would do extra damage against water and water would do extra damage against fire. Likewise, both of them being resistant to each other seemed likewise odd. The result was a circle where Water was weak to Air but strong versus Earth and neutral (no bonus or negative) to Fire. Earth was weak to Water, strong to Fire and neutral to Air, and so on. I don't think I'd always use that dynamic, but it gave an interesting feel to the magic of the particular campaign we used it in.

 

I've also played in a campaign that had 5 schools of magic making a sort of pentagram of SFX interaction. You had a bonus to your special school of magic, could cast spells from the two schools most closely related without penalty, and could cast spells from the other schools only if overcoming a large penalty. It lead to a sort campaign specific shtick enforcement so you couldn't just buy your favorite spells from each school. I think the five schools were Elemental concerning the physical, Ethereal concerning spiritual and life energy, Conjuration which involved summoning actual beings, Illusory which altered perception, and I forget the fifth. If your school was Illusory you could learn Conjuration and Ethereal spells without much difficulty (though would take a penalty if you tried to combine them since they are not complimentary to each other even though they are both complimentary to Illusory), but Elemental and the other were hard to use. If your school was Conjuration you could learn Elemental and Illusory as well, but would have difficulty with Ethereal or the other. A high enough level mage might combine Illusory and Conjuration magic to literally alter reality, or combine Elemental and Conjuration to create particularly strong, semi-permanent creatures such as golems that wouldn't have to return to a different plane of existence like a regularly Conjured creature would. There was also Divine and Abomination magic, but they were rarely used by people and were not part of the SFX interaction, and a sort of Void energy used by the Lovecraftian horrors that lived outside our realm (they liked to try to sneak in through Conjuration or pollute Ethereal magic to infect a person’s spirit/life force.