True Faith

[Steve]

I think there should be a difference between the Perk of being a priest of an organized religion and a Talent like True Faith. One is more political and social-oriented, and the other is a spiritual gift. I understand some posters concerns with trying to render into game mechanics something that involves sacred things.

 

It could be that some creatures of darkness are just afraid of brandished holy symbols, even if the wielder is an agnostic or atheist. That would be represented by the creature having appropriate Complications. However, there could be other. more powerful things, that would just slap it aside. But if the brandisher had True Faith, even those creatures would had reason to be wary.

 

A priest may just have the Perk of being a priest, without any special power. But some otherwise ordinary people may have True Faith, even if they hold no status within an organized religion.

[Markdoc]

Actually, my problem is not with "sacred things" - we're talking about a game with magic, true faith and vampires

My problem is that as defined, "true faith" is too nebulous to make a game mechanic out of.

 

Let's say you make a perk "True faith". OK. Cool. But what does it do? "You write "But if the brandisher had True Faith, even those creatures would had reason to be wary." Why? Why would they be wary? What happens to them? If you can answer that question, I can tell you what mechanics we need to build it.

 

The bit about roleplaying is in answer to "who has true faith?", not an attempt to model effects. 

 

cheers, Mark

[NuSoardGraphite]

Actually, my problem is not with "sacred things" - we're talking about a game with magic, true faith and vampires

My problem is that as defined, "true faith" is too nebulous to make a game mechanic out of.

 

Let's say you make a perk "True faith". OK. Cool. But what does it do? "You write "But if the brandisher had True Faith, even those creatures would had reason to be wary." Why? Why would they be wary? What happens to them? If you can answer that question, I can tell you what mechanics we need to build it.

 

The bit about roleplaying is in answer to "who has true faith?", not an attempt to model effects. 

 

cheers, Mark

It gives the user the ability to use their PRE attacks against certain automatons that are normally immune to PRE attacks (zombies, skeletons etc).  It might give a small bonuse (+1 or +2D6) to PRE attacks used against "demonic" beings.  Other uses can be defined by the GM as appropriate for his campaign setting.

 

For those creatures that have a susceptibility or Vulnerability to Holy objects, or a psychological limitation of not being able to stand within sight of a holy object or holy ground, the person with True Faith counts as said holy object or holy ground under those circumstances.  Their attacks can harm evil beings and will activate their susceptibilities or vulnerabilities.  They would not be able to stand long in the presence of someone with True Faith....based on the complications of the creature in question.

 

So in other words, the Perk of True Faith gives the person the ability to take advantage of the complications placed on other-worldly beings when appropriate.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Steve]

To me, True Faith is divine power channeled through a person who has it. That power burns demons and inspires fear even in monsters that would normally not be afraid of a brandished holy symbol wielded by an unbeliever.

 

I could see it as driving off evil creatures by brandishing a crucifix or other type of holy symbol (Star of David?). Prayer could protect against black magic or maybe even all magic. Maybe a faithful person could heal the sick or exorcise a demon.

[Philip Nicholls]

maybe you could base it on Deadly Blow but using Presence, where it gives you a bonus to your presence attack vs enemies of the faith.

[Markdoc]

To me, True Faith is divine power channeled through a person who has it. That power burns demons and inspires fear even in monsters that would normally not be afraid of a brandished holy symbol wielded by an unbeliever.

 

I could see it as driving off evil creatures by brandishing a crucifix or other type of holy symbol (Star of David?). Prayer could protect against black magic or maybe even all magic. Maybe a faithful person could heal the sick or exorcise a demon.

 

See, these are 4 different things, built with different powers, which are going to require different mechanics. I've already noted that I like the idea of complications for creatures rather than power constructs because thats simplifies things a lot. But if you want to include things like positive actions, then really you are looking at, not a power, but a limitation: powers bought with "Requires true faith". Depending on how hard you judge keeping the true faith to be, that could be anything from -1/2 to -2, though I'm guessing a -1 is probably about right.

 

For complications nothing more difficult than "Susceptibility x2: takes 3d6 normal damage (Body and Stun) from attacks made by person with True Faith (uncommon, 25 points)" is required. A presence attack by a priest holding a cross (or holy wafer, whatever) might only get 3d6 based on his PRE, but if he has true faith, a demon with that susceptibility will take an average of 11 STUN and 3 BOD straight through all its defences, and is probably going to want to move away from him, pronto. That's not a huge amount of damage, but it's gonna smart. It would also apply to more conventional attacks made by people with true faith as well, so a paladin of the church (if they have such things) would make a fearsome foe for demons.

 

cheers, Mark

[NuSoardGraphite]

 

 

For complications nothing more difficult than "Susceptibility x2: takes 3d6 normal damage (Body and Stun) from attacks made by person with True Faith (uncommon, 25 points)" is required. A presence attack by a priest holding a cross (or holy wafer, whatever) might only get 3d6 based on his PRE, but if he has true faith, a demon with that susceptibility will take an average of 11 STUN and 3 BOD straight through all its defences, and is probably going to want to move away from him, pronto. That's not a huge amount of damage, but it's gonna smart. It would also apply to more conventional attacks made by people with true faith as well, so a paladin of the church (if they have such things) would make a fearsome foe for demons.

 

cheers, Mark

Precisely.  And how you determine who has True Faith or not, is who bought the Perk.  If you want to develop the True Faith perk after the start of the game, as with any other Perk, the GM will require you to go through an ordeal where it would make sense for your character to develop the True Faith.  

[Steve]

Buying a Perk/Talent and then buying specific powers would work a lot like how some magic systems work. The Perk/Talent provides the core of the power, and the individual spell purchases show the applications of that power that the character can do. Maybe one character with True Faith can only turn demons and undead and another character can only lay on hands and heal another.

 

A vey rare person of faith could do more than one thing.

[NuSoardGraphite]

Buying a Perk/Talent and then buying specific powers would work a lot like how some magic systems work. The Perk/Talent provides the core of the power, and the individual spell purchases show the applications of that power that the character can do. Maybe one character with True Faith can only turn demons and undead and another character can only lay on hands and heal another.

 

A vey rare person of faith could do more than one thing.

Yep.  That was my thought process.