Christopher

Re: Superpowers and Ethics

By the way, I just picked up Champions Powers and on page 228 they have a variation of Mind Control: Silver-Tongued. "Instead of reflecting literal

control of the mind, they represent his extreme persuasiveness. With a few glib words, he can convince people to do just about anything. Add Requires A Persuasion Roll (-½) and Incantaitons (-¼)"

So I could use this power to convince an entire town that I'm their leader, and it would not be viewed as an attack/illegal in and off itself? If I don't use them for anything criminal, nobody can legally stop me?

Re: Superpowers and Ethics

It would be very difficulty to learn of the attack, but if it was learnt/oberserved everyone who can would act accoringly. Invisibility does not changes that it is an attack. It is just harder to track back to you.

Re: Superpowers and Ethics

Whether or not RSR is applied has nothing to do with the ethics of a power or whether the use of a power is an assault.

No, you misunderstand. If it is an attack should be part of the game effect. How this attack is viewed, that is part of the law, the ethics and concepts like "realtive force" in the campaing world.

For a Red Mage of Tay in D&D it is okay to burn their slaves to a crisp on a whim, as is allowed in most slaveholder states. (The Tays to worser things to traitors)

Likely, knocking someone out to get him out of mind controll (especially when ordered to attack you) is okay. Most likely even for the victim ("Thank you for preventing me from something I regrett).

This does not change that the power used to archive it, is still an attack, just how it is viewed by everyone differs.

The MC-User may actually be quite upset for disabling his toy or may even have real concern for the wellbeing of his controlled.

Re: Superhuman women less attractive in 6th Edition?

You made the assumption that the guard was male - and straight.

Or Bisexual. Or Metrosexual. And not Asexual towards women (he can still feel love for them, but their body isn't that interesting).

Of course, the "shirtless Construction worker" could work for female guards.

Re: How To Delay Effect

or we could follow the barrier route' date=' and have the default be Increased Size, and have Growth be a modified version of that.[/quote']

What

Re: Obviousness of Telekinesis

Some of the stronger uses of the Force, Like for Force Jump or Force Shove (High STR Telekinesis, only to shove) could easily be put into the same Mutlipower (together with your KA Lightsaber, deflection). Thier short time precognition could be simulated with a Overall Skill level or CSL's, OCV/DCV Bonus also put in the MP.

Most of thier powers should cost at least half endurance to activate and maintain, and only rare should be Persistent/Uncontrolled.

Re: Superpowers and Ethics

I actually think that MC being an attack on the mind of the target, is part of the game effect.

MC has so many advantages: You can easily(and certain) archieve high results, you can make the target forgett, it gives you direct controll, it can easily be used in combat.

And in order for it to work that way and still be balanced, it should always be considered an attak and always stay percieveable by mental awareness. If not (even just if he's the only one with mental powers) it should be an advantage. Otherwise such a power can grow to strong.

Also, no one could so far give me the example for any other attack power that hinders/damages the target but is not viewed as an attack. So MC should not get any extra's here because of SFX.

About the super skills: Each of the examples uses "Requires a Skill Roll" (-1 per 5, 10 or 20 Active Points; aplicable to skill modifiers; may be "blocked" with skil contest). This would seriously change who and what it can affect.

Re: Obviousness of Telekinesis

Also gestures may be usefull, or has a Jedi ever shown the ability to use it with hands tied?

If Yes, variable Advantage and Disadvantage may be a way to go (it can be strong but hearable, magescaled but cost concentration/endurance,...).

Re: ADVANCED PLAYER'S GUIDE II -- What Do *You* Want To See?

I enthusiastically second this. Used judiciously' date=' I think it could add some really cool flavor to many games -- not most, necessarily, but at least a significant minority. It may call for a "Caution" sign, but the right Advantages and/or Limitations might make it less problematic.[/quote']

And especially the fact that they would cost endurance when used this way.

Re: Superhuman women less attractive in 6th Edition?

knowing the Palindromedary? 96 is equally likely.

Or perhaps Roman/Binary like II, XX or 10011001?

Re: Superhuman women less attractive in 6th Edition?

What COM is a palindromedary?

A palindromic number of course, like 777 or perhaps sexy 69?

Re: ADVANCED PLAYER'S GUIDE II -- What Do *You* Want To See?

Except that a "No Parking Zone" is a legal issue and anyone can move into it' date=' physically speaking. So the question becomes, how do you build a legal issue without resorting to handwave?[/quote']

It must be very close to the "Lawfull Neutral Zone", they will enforce non parking there.

Re: Quote of the Week from my gaming group...

Anyone else amused that this is page 666?

For me it is 999 (have switched to 10 posts/page). But it is interesting to find the number of the devil togehter with a post about CoC.

Re: 6th Edition Brick

The 60m is part of her inner magic. Without it, she can run at 15 (Jogs in her freetime). In fact, her development could go towards speedster tricks (like autofire punch, speed evasion).

Her Move By is overall a loss: Instead of having 60 STR, she would have 30 STR + equivalent of 30 STR from velocity. And she couldn't keep her defenses online at full strenght, while she tries this.

I also noticed that I forgot to put the STR in the Multipower, so it would only get worse (25 + 30 with only 10 def...). I mostly took it, since every hero should have at least one usefull noncombat movement power...

Also I think you overestimate 12 DC knockback: average BODY per dice is 1, meaning 12-2d6-10, so 1:36 that she is knocked down. Even at a critical hit (used in this campaign) she takes only 24 BODY -2d6 -10, so 24 m at worst (half move at 48m running or full move at 24m). She would be stunned, prone at have lost 47 STUN from that hit, posibilly k.o. her with previous damage. But interestingly still no body damage...

And Combat Maneuvers seem to be rather unused in that campaign (ecept for defensive maneuvers). Also I follow your advice and upgrade her limited Knockback to 10 (total of 14).

I am reworkign her, but I think I may have to take an aditional limitation on the limited powers, since she has no skills, CLS or the like and only few points left.

Re: Superpowers and Ethics

This means' date=' of course, that a player who has poor interaction skills cannot successfully play a suave con man - he can't have character skills inconsistent with his player skills. I dislike that result. We don't make the martial artist's player perform a triple backflip and come up in a roundhouse kick, so why should James Bond's player have to demonstrate equal charm to Mr. Bond himself?[/quote']

I do have very poor interaction skills and totally agree.

 

Tell him you will not allow that ability to be useful in game' date=' so he should spend his points elsewhere.[/quote']

Or let it fall under the "what not to spend points on" rule. It helps to make the sheet readably when you find it after a long time or show it someone else.

Re: Superpowers and Ethics

One clarification:

Of course, that sugested mechanic for Interaction Skills is only what I see and it seems to support the daramtic sense and realism simultaneously. If anybody can give me the true mechanic for decay of interaction skill results it would help a lot.

Two things that might be interesting too:

Has the degree of result nessesary any influence on the ethics?

Seducing a single in a single bar (doesn't mind doing) and a nun (Vow of Chasity/Violently opposed) seem to be totally different levels of influencing.

Has the using of complications in the atempt any influence on the ethicality?

Let's say the nun has a psychical Complication: "Dry Nymphomanic" (the reason she went into the Monastery). On the one hand using that makes the roll easier, on the other hand it could have a more long-lasting effect on the target. Either making the "shifting" longer or (in this chase) re-activating an serious illness.

Re: Superpowers and Ethics

What this would meen:

It think the use of the skills Charm/Presuasion and Oratory are a bit less unethical. The reason is, that you respect your target enough that you try to convince it.

By MC and Interogate/PRe vs. EGO you don't care for your target or its opinion, you just want to archieve a result (they are as ethical as a blast).

Re: Superpowers and Ethics

I don't see that anywhere in the rules' date=' but you're welcome to view it that way. I don't see that having any meaningful effect on the mechanics[/quote']

Of course it has no effect on the Mechanic. It IS the mechanics working here, the clear difference between Charm/Persuasion, MC and Interogation/PRE vs EGO.

Asuming we have a rule allowing that effect, would your nun start having sex regulary? Or would she return to follow her oath of chasity? (asuming no further seduction atemps are made)

 

My issue is with the position you've stated that any use of MC is unethical.

Hmmm...No!!? I said time and again: MC is as etical as a blast or any other attack power.

What I was "violently opposed to", was an MC difined in a way that is is not viewed as attack (by victim, bystanders and law), once detected. But that was apperently a missunderstanding.

Re: What sort of technology do you use in yiour games?

One of our players moved away and we have been able to successfully keep her in the game with an extra laptop dedicated to video chat. We see her all the time and we move the camera around to point to one of us or to the mat if we have miniatures out. It works better than I thought it would.

Full Frontal Nerdity

Re: Free no character point equipment simulating not very powerful powers

Another way for reliable Information might be Data Link(wich should be better named: Access to restricted information):

You can have access to the FBI or Until database, giving you a good deal verified of information. For Ingame Effect: How about just buying the KS, but not based on the user INT but 11+, and call it "Access to UNTIL Database"?

Re: 6th Edition Brick

Good point, but I hadn't defined any skills yet. About being Gymnast, she was before her density increased by about 8 times. Such a thing is bady for every agility skill (one of the reasons I gave her an 12 DEX).

While the walking part of clinging isn't that interesting for my concept and the Knockback-Res would be cheaper with the power, the Trip/Shove/Throw protection is interesting (and -1d6 Knockback may be just an addon). What value should have a Clinging Limitation (Not for Movement)?

The only downside is, that I currently can't think of a fitting Special effect for her Clinging, but putting it in the Limited section could count as a Subconcious Anti-Trip/-Shove/-Throw adaption.

Re: Tactile Metal Control powers

Don't know 5E, but it think they may be comparable. I also hope my 6E to 5E reverse translation makes sense.

1) and 2) are pracitally the same and I think dispel works better. for the effect: I think it may make your Swords HKA "dull" or make the entire sword brittle. As long as it is a focus for a single power, it would thus simply break it and deny the use of that power (that's what you get for using OAF's).

For a focus that aplies to multiple powers, each use would break the part for one power (like would do damaging). Things like making one of the guns firemodes inoperational. Normal items could just break totally

3-5) don't sound really usefull (so it may be worth a big limitation)

Have you though about Drain/Supress(?) Metal Powers/Metal Elemental Controlls? Or Metal foe defenses?

You could "destabilize" your enemys, but they can catch themself again (like the "cohesion fight" between ds9 changelings).

Drain bought vs. metal objects, you could then easily smash the target. Perhaps linking it to an attack, so you get "defense cracking" attacks.

Metal Powers might imply high defenses, usually personal nature (at least thats the first thing I think when I hearing "living metal"). So something to breake armor/damage resistance may be usefull. If those come as adders, you should check if the Adjustment Powers already have the "Can add/remove Adders" advantage. Also think about variable advantage for attacks.

The NND Idea 'not made of metal' woudl not stand up to the rulse of 6E, no idea if they were that different in 5E.

Re: Superpowers and Ethics

I've read trhough the skill descriptions

I think I found the mayor difference between Persuasion/Charm Skill and Mind Controll:

The Skills make you take on the others point of view ("You like to be around me", "I think...."), at least for a time. It is nowhere clearly stated when it ends but I would go for: until Situation worsenes (i.e. when for MC the EGO+X level would increase) or you had some time to think it through (sleep a night about it). Of course, if it get's reinforced regulary (i.e. reapplication of the skill for the same effect) it could make the effects more long lasting (unless you stop charming your wife, then they may fade). Same is true if the skill user can use the complications of the targets (you want to believe it).

MC on the other hand does not change your Point of View. It aplies one to you that supresses your natural pov. The breakout roll is just the the reaction of the mind, to "shake of" the unnatural pov. To return to it's natural pov.

You do not really like that guy/gal or buy on that idea, but that is irrelevant. Your Point of view is supressed by a different one (chosen by the MC user).

What that could mean for the ethics discussion:

I would give the Skills the slight "benefit of natural pov". So they might are a little bit less unethical. Of course not all. Interrogation and PRE-Attacks resisted with EGO are way closer to MC in they are there to break the targets will (thus comlying to something, that goes against your pov).

This may also give is the "Not HERO System" terms we are looking for:

Charm/Persuasion Skill is temporarily Transforming/Influencing the Point of view

MC is Supressing/Replacing the Point of View

Interogation/Fear is "breaking" the Point of View (lack's a better term)

Oratory: It may have a support role. it may slow the rate of decay for a Persuasion as well as playing with the natural "Herd Instinct" of the target. But someone still would have to give you "personal attention" (Chruch Service vs. personal talk with the pastor).

This may sound like I say all religions are influencing you. And yes, that is what I think.

However I also think it is possible to choose a certain influence when you think it helps you to become/stay a better Person. I even personally use that technique, albeit not with a religion.

Re: Superpowers and Ethics

Children are easily influenced.

Try this with a grown up who has no complications to work with.

Re: Superpowers and Ethics

I still would say that a EGO+30 result can't be done with the best skill result. You had to first change the targets psychical complications so that they fit your atempt (thus lowering it towards EGO+20).

When he has to choose to kill either his child or his wife, when both are equally loved, a father simple could not choose (since he has equally strong complications/one family complication).