UMA Maneuver Names

[Dust Raven]

Hello everybody!

 

I've taken up the task of making custom maneuvers an option for HDv2 (see this thread for details).

 

What I need to do first is give all of those spiffy maneuvers that are already in the UMA, but aren't on the Maneuvers list a good, generic name. Most of them are pretty easy, or already have a suitible name. Others, however, sound very style specific. So, I'm asking for help finding a name for the rest of them.

 

Here's a list of maneuver names and the styles they're associated with in the UMA that I'm having trouble with. Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.

 

Ballestra (Fencing)

Ceduto (Fencing)

[Commando] Hold (Commando Training)

Crab Pinch (Lua)

Double a Double (Fencing)

Eagle Claw (Hsing-I)

Gentle Grasp of Master Shiokawa (Takijutsu)

Grypes (Fencing)

Tirayaki's Human Web (Dancing Spider

Knee Strike (Thunder Dragon Kung Fu)

[Thunker] Legsweep (Thunder Dragon Kung Fu)

Pasata Soto (Fencing)

Silken Hand Strike (Silken Blake Kung Fu)

Touch of Tsukiomi (Takijutsu)

Waterfall Throw of Sakai Akemi (Takijutsu)

 

Thanks in advance!

 

(p.s.: if anyone has any suggestions for other custom maneuvers I could add in please post those as well.)

[Derek Hiemforth]

Re: UMA Maneuver Names

 

How about some of these...

 

 

Ballestra (Fencing) = Flying Lunge

Ceduto (Fencing) = Disengage

[Commando] Hold (Commando Training) = Offensive Grab

Crab Pinch (Lua) = Nerve Grab

Double a Double (Fencing) = Martial Counterstrike

Eagle Claw (Hsing-I) = Fast Grab

Gentle Grasp of Master Shiokawa (Takijutsu) = Defensive Grab

Grypes (Fencing) = Grappling Disarm

Tirayaki's Human Web (Dancing Spider) = Takedown Grab

Knee Strike (Thunder Dragon Kung Fu) = Aggressive Strike

[Thunker] Legsweep (Thunder Dragon Kung Fu) = Aggressive Throw

Pasata Soto (Fencing) = Defensive Counterstrike

Silken Hand Strike (Silken Blake Kung Fu) = Killing Counterstrike

Touch of Tsukiomi (Takijutsu) = Defensive Nerve Strike

Waterfall Throw of Sakai Akemi (Takijutsu) = Fast Throw

[Dust Raven]

Re: UMA Maneuver Names

 

Cool! Those will work!

[Rapier]

Re: UMA Maneuver Names

 

Ballestra (Fencing)

Ceduto (Fencing)

Double a Double (Fencing)

Grypes (Fencing)

Pasata Soto (Fencing)

I'll take the ones I have some knowledge around.

 

Ballestra - This is a hop and a lunge: Great Lunge, Moving Lunge, Hop Lunge, Closing Lunge, Leaping Lunge

 

Ceduto - This is nothing more than an escape for a bind that involves removing your blade from the bind and stepping back a pace: Escape Bind, Disengage (this is with a capital D since it refers to you taking a backwards step and actually moving yourself beyond the range of contact [the range where the formost 1/3 - 1/4 of the blades touch] as opposed to a fencing disengage which is just changing which side of your opponents blade your blade rests against - from targetting left to targetting right), Withdrawal

 

Double a Double - A riposte (counterattack) that you engineer (trap) your opponent into falling for (or setting up a pattern of attack/response and then breaking the attack pattern - this is one of the first strategy maneuvers you learn and has no "real definition." You can use ANY maneuver (or group of maneuvers) as the basis: a 5 parry, disengage, tap, disengage, beat, repeat. You do this a couple times and then instead of tap you lunge): Lure, Fake or Patterned CounterStrike

 

Grypes - Patently illegal in "modern fencing." Fencing used to be taught in "schools" (usually named after the city, state, country or armsmaster) and certain schools espoused certain maneuvers. The English schools were a little less Marquis of Queensbury (they were a little more dirty infighting type. the tought trips, kicks and other non-polite forms of maneuvers) than some of the others. With this maneuver you are actually going to close and use a strike/grab/lock on your opponents weapon arm (usually lead with your offhand) to force him to drop his weapon (the theory was the more damage/pain you can cause when you do this the better. that way if you failed his weapon hand would not be at its best). Some variations actually urged a strike using the main-gouche on the weapon hand. This was REALLY dirty pool since you could main someone very easily and end their fencing career: Closing Disarm, Striking Disarm, Weapon Hand Strike, Weapon Hand Cripple

 

Pasata Soto - When your opponent is charging at you (as in a Fleche) you throw back and out your off leg (the opposite of the weapon hand) and push back slightly with your forward leg. This will cause you to fall forward (chest down) but with a backwards direction. You drop your offhand (if you are using a main-gouche you must either drop it, accept it becoming damaged/bent/broken and risk breaking your fingers and/or wrist - you usually drop it or throw it off to the side) to the floor to support your weight. Depending on your school your fingers are either tented (make the mother-in-law yapping talking motion with your hand, close the fingers, now open them all spread from each other) or your palm is flat. This is an all or nothing defensive maneuver. If it doesn't work you are helpless since this is a very difficult maneuver to recover from (at least a 1/2 phase to stand). To remain a "legal" maneuver your body can only be touching at three points (both feet and hand), your knees, hips and shoulders may not touch the strip: Sacrifice Thrust, Disengaged Thrust, [i have actually heard this referred to, by a fencer from Belgium as a translated-directly-from-the-German] Tripod (or 3pt) Thrust (or Lunge), Defensive Stop Thrust (see below), Rear (or Back) Lunging Stop Thrust. You can take the Stop out of those last couple, if needed.

 

Stop Thrust: A stop thrust is a response to an attack (usually one involving a quick close - eg Fleche, Ballestra etc). You disengate to garner right-of-way and then extend the arm. There should be no foot movement or shifting of weight. While this can be done without garnering right-of-way, its considered a cheap chicken shit cowardly way to stop an engagement (in modern fencing). In old skool fencing it was just another maneuver. In modern fencing the engagement stops when a touch is made (regardless if it garners a point or not). At any rate, the goal of a Stop Thrust is to make a touch before your opponent can close to his attack range.

 

Fleche: The fleche is already pretty well handled in UMA, except I want to mention that during a fleche the blade is held very lightly and the act of making the touch is allowed to force the weapon from your hand. Obviously, if you are fencing with live blades, this is something you are going to want to consider very closely before attempting.

 

There is quite a bit of difference between Old Skool and Modern fencing. Modern fencing allows no contact between the fencers except the blade (the full blade in sabre or just the tip in epee). Modern fencing also concentrates on Right-of-Way. RoW is the act of declaring an attack. This is signalled by straightening the arm. If your opponent straightens his arm, even if you hit first, you cannot score a point unless you have regained RoW (by defeating his attack, maneuvering his point off target or something similar). Regardless of who has RoW, the first touch in an engagement is the only one that counts. So if you opponent has RoW, even if he hits you if you can touch him first he gets no point (this is also considered cheesy).

 

Now aren't you sorry you asked?

 

EDIT: I tried to stay away from some of the "classic" Hero definition words because I didn't want to use something you had already thought of.

[Dust Raven]

Re: UMA Maneuver Names

 

The maneuvers template (and prefab) for HDv2 is done, and can be found on the Free Stuff page. (http://www.herogames.com/forums/showthread.php?p=732862#post732862) (http://www.herogames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24849)

[prestidigitator]

Re: UMA Maneuver Names

 

I'm a fencer, so I have to interject a little here.

 

Double a Double - A riposte (counterattack) that you engineer (trap) your opponent into falling for (or setting up a pattern of attack/response and then breaking the attack pattern - this is one of the first strategy maneuvers you learn and has no "real definition." You can use ANY maneuver (or group of maneuvers) as the basis: a 5 parry' date=' disengage, tap, disengage, beat, repeat. You do this a couple times and then instead of tap you lunge): Lure, Fake or Patterned CounterStrike[/quote']

I'm actually not quite sure to what this is referring. I think maybe it is either supposed to be a redoublement, which is a second attack made after your first fails but your opponent fails to riposte, or a double (with accent over the 'e') attack, which is two immediate disengages followed by a thrust (essentially two feints in a row).

 

Grypes - Patently illegal in "modern fencing." Fencing used to be taught in "schools" (usually named after the city, state, country or armsmaster) and certain schools espoused certain maneuvers. The English schools were a little less Marquis of Queensbury (they were a little more dirty infighting type. the tought trips, kicks and other non-polite forms of maneuvers) than some of the others. With this maneuver you are actually going to close and use a strike/grab/lock on your opponents weapon arm (usually lead with your offhand) to force him to drop his weapon (the theory was the more damage/pain you can cause when you do this the better. that way if you failed his weapon hand would not be at its best). Some variations actually urged a strike using the main-gouche on the weapon hand. This was REALLY dirty pool since you could main someone very easily and end their fencing career: Closing Disarm, Striking Disarm, Weapon Hand Strike, Weapon Hand Cripple

Huh. Yeah, I'd never even heard of that one. Any such maneuver would be considered intentional brutality, and the offending fencer would be immediately expelled from the competition (a black card). This has yet further reprocussions if you fence at the olympic level.

 

Pasata Soto - When your opponent is charging at you (as in a Fleche) you throw back and out your off leg (the opposite of the weapon hand) and push back slightly with your forward leg. This will cause you to fall forward (chest down) but with a backwards direction. You drop your offhand (if you are using a main-gouche you must either drop it, accept it becoming damaged/bent/broken and risk breaking your fingers and/or wrist - you usually drop it or throw it off to the side) to the floor to support your weight. Depending on your school your fingers are either tented (make the mother-in-law yapping talking motion with your hand, close the fingers, now open them all spread from each other) or your palm is flat. This is an all or nothing defensive maneuver. If it doesn't work you are helpless since this is a very difficult maneuver to recover from (at least a 1/2 phase to stand). To remain a "legal" maneuver your body can only be touching at three points (both feet and hand), your knees, hips and shoulders may not touch the strip: Sacrifice Thrust, Disengaged Thrust, [i have actually heard this referred to, by a fencer from Belgium as a translated-directly-from-the-German] Tripod (or 3pt) Thrust (or Lunge), Defensive Stop Thrust (see below), Rear (or Back) Lunging Stop Thrust. You can take the Stop out of those last couple, if needed.

This could really just be considered a surprise maneuver in which you hold until your opponent's attack and drop to a prone position (close enough). If you don't manage to surprise your opponent, you may hit, but you will almost certainly be hit yourself.

 

Stop Thrust: A stop thrust is a response to an attack (usually one involving a quick close - eg Fleche, Ballestra etc). You disengate to garner right-of-way and then extend the arm. There should be no foot movement or shifting of weight. While this can be done without garnering right-of-way, its considered a cheap chicken shit cowardly way to stop an engagement (in modern fencing). In old skool fencing it was just another maneuver. In modern fencing the engagement stops when a touch is made (regardless if it garners a point or not). At any rate, the goal of a Stop Thrust is to make a touch before your opponent can close to his attack range.

Actually, a stop thrust is executed properly when your opponent advances for an attack without gaining right-of-way (i.e. without extending the blade to begin the attack). This would be equivalent to an improper (modeled by a miss, perhaps, even though the full attack has not yet been executed?) or hasty attack with hesitation by your opponent in real combat. In practice it is risky in fencing because the director may miss the fact that an attack wasn't initiated during the advance, so your opponent may incorrectly be given right-of-way.

 

Fleche: The fleche is already pretty well handled in UMA, except I want to mention that during a fleche the blade is held very lightly and the act of making the touch is allowed to force the weapon from your hand. Obviously, if you are fencing with live blades, this is something you are going to want to consider very closely before attempting.

The weapon is held normally for a fleche, and the weapon is not dropped. In fencing, you are expected to collapse your arm as soon as you make contact, because there is a lot of force involved and your blade might otherwise break and impale your opponent. If used in actual combat, you obviously want to impale your opponent.

 

There is quite a bit of difference between Old Skool and Modern fencing. Modern fencing allows no contact between the fencers except the blade (the full blade in sabre or just the tip in epee). Modern fencing also concentrates on Right-of-Way. RoW is the act of declaring an attack. This is signalled by straightening the arm. If your opponent straightens his arm, even if you hit first, you cannot score a point unless you have regained RoW (by defeating his attack, maneuvering his point off target or something similar). Regardless of who has RoW, the first touch in an engagement is the only one that counts. So if you opponent has RoW, even if he hits you if you can touch him first he gets no point (this is also considered cheesy).

The first touch does not stop the action where there is right-of-way. In foil and saber, which have right-of-way rules, who touched first does not matter at all. The sequence of events is considered completely in order of right-of-way. If your opponent begins the attack first, but you counter-attack (attack without a parry) and land first, it is still your opponent's touch. There is one exception to this: if your opponent launches a compound attack (as opposed to a simple attack, which is not extremely simple to define as there are exceptions and caveats) and your touch comes more than a beat of fencing time (roughly the time it takes to execute one movement of the blade) before theirs, it is your touch (in practice this happens very rarely unless you are very quick on the retreat). Now if you attack with right-of-way and land off-target (arms, legs, or head in foil; legs and groin in saber), the action does stop, so any counterattack by your opponent is not considered.

 

In epee there is absolutely no right-of-way (nor is there an off-target area), and whoever touches first gets the point (a simultaneous touch--within a specified fraction of a second--means a touch for both fencers).

[bubba smith]

Re: UMA Maneuver Names

 

interesting topic