How would you build this power?

[Gideon]

Re: How would you build this power?

 

Sean Waters:

 

He can "see" and "hear" when he is alone, yes.

 

Clairsentience I found out yesterday doesn't work. It says under the description of senses that you cannot establish LOS with clairsentience. Since he is a mentalist (and needs to establish LOS to, say, ego attack someone) that doesn't work.

 

The detect may be a good way of building it. I will ask my GM which he prefers.

 

braincraft: Earplugs, earmuffs, and similar technically shouldn't work on him, his ears don't function. The same goes for blindfolds or other eye coverings. He has no working optic nerves, corneas, or retinas. However it only applies to objects covering those areas. He can't see in room with no light etc...

[braincraft]

Re: How would you build this power?

 

What would you have to cover to blindfold him? What if you covered his whole head? His whole body? What if it was a really, really thick blindfold? If he can see even with very thick barriers in his way, can he see through walls and around corners? If not, what is the greatest thickness of material he can 'see' through? Does it matter what the material is made out of? Does he have to turn his head to look around? Can he see from the back of his head? What's his field of vision if it's not 360 degrees?

 

In other words, what is the actual physical effect at work here? If you're using nonexistent physics, then you need to know how explicitly and specifically how those physics work, because you can't use real physics as a baseline.

[Gideon]

Re: How would you build this power?

 

braincraft:Darn you and your logic!

 

Ok. Well I think I need to better define my idea.

 

There are really two ways to define the power:

 

1: the easy way: Even though his sight and hearing are psychic (clarvoyant) in nature he still "sees" through his eyes and "hears" through his ears. Or at least for the most part. So a physical object based flash would effect his sight (sludge in the face) because he believes he is seeing through his eyes, but a bright light based flash would do nothing. His hearing would work the same way.

 

2: the more complicated way: Even though his point of perception is his eyes and ears, that he perceives via his entire body. No sight or hearing flashes would work. Only blocking light from contacting his body (or blocking sound from contacting his body) would blind or deafen him.

 

Remember the concept is sight and hearing through the use of clairvoyance and ESP.

 

Maybe I could start out with option 1 and have him "grow" into option 2?

[Doc Democracy]

Re: How would you build this power?

 

1: the easy way: Even though his sight and hearing are psychic (clarvoyant) in nature he still "sees" through his eyes and "hears" through his ears. Or at least for the most part. So a physical object based flash would effect his sight (sludge in the face) because he believes he is seeing through his eyes, but a bright light based flash would do nothing. His hearing would work the same way.

 

2: the more complicated way: Even though his point of perception is his eyes and ears, that he perceives via his entire body. No sight or hearing flashes would work. Only blocking light from contacting his body (or blocking sound from contacting his body) would blind or deafen him.

 

Remember the concept is sight and hearing through the use of clairvoyance and ESP.

 

Maybe I could start out with option 1 and have him "grow" into option 2?

 

Well, option 1 costs no points - it is all special effect and no advantage or disadvantage - so definitely easy.

 

You could define option 2 as requiring light to hit his body but if it is true clairsentience then the only blockage that should matter is something that prevents his spirit form reaching out.

 

I might define that, in game terms, as mental defence. So anything that provided mental defence that covered him (completely or possibly just a particular chakra point) would prevent that sense being used.

 

 

Doc

[JmOz]

Re: How would you build this power?

 

The conceptual issue I take with this (and I think we're at least partially on the same page) is that no one argues DD should not pay points for his radar sense "because it just makes up, partially, for loss of sight". In my view, DD is blind and should get the points for that - his loss of sight means he has given back something other characters have by default. He has a Radar Sense - he should pay the full value of this, as it is something other characters lack.

 

If this isn't "balanced", it's because either the Blind disad is mispriced or the radar sense power is. Fix the costing for everyone, not just for the guy who has both.

---Clip----

 

To me, either:

 

(a) DD should get full points for Blindness [25 points] and pay fully for his Radar sense [15 points], on the basis these are two separate abilities/disabilities OR

 

( Should pay the net cost (nil) and receive a disadvantage for the net deficit [10 points] on the basis these constitute one ability overall ("sees by radar sense instead of sight").

 

The character should not have to pay full freight for radar sense and suck up the loss of sight as having no impact.

 

I'm almost 100% with you, just with a clause in it about about not getting more disad points than you are spending to get around it

 

this comes from the character named blob I once had cross the GM screen, who took a physical limitation of "No arms and legs" then Extra limbs "Tentacles", he said that no arms and legs was worth 25 points, buthe spent 5 to get around it, netting him 20...he also took a DF for big blob of purple goo.

 

Your option 2 is very interesting to me however, and one I will have to give some serious consideration

[SteveZilla]

Re: How would you build this power?

 

The conceptual issue I take with this (and I think we're at least partially on the same page) is that no one argues DD should not pay points for his radar sense "because it just makes up, partially, for loss of sight". In my view, DD is blind and should get the points for that - his loss of sight means he has given back something other characters have by default. He has a Radar Sense - he should pay the full value of this, as it is something other characters lack.

 

If this isn't "balanced", it's because either the Blind disad is mispriced or the radar sense power is. Fix the costing for everyone, not just for the guy who has both.

 

 

 

As is anyone who paid 15 points for Radar Sense and is not blind. DD is getting the SAME benefit as anyone else.

 

 

 

This is an issue of the NND, not the radar sense. The purchaser of the NND decided that anyone with the DISADVANTAGE of being blind has the ADVANTAGE of avoiding all damage from his attack. A lot less NND's have "damage resistance" as a defense than Force Field. Should we raise the price of Force Field?

 

 

 

Advantages bestowed on anyone who paid 15 points for Radar Sense, blind or not.

 

 

 

To me, either:

 

(a) DD should get full points for Blindness [25 points] and pay fully for his Radar sense [15 points], on the basis these are two separate abilities/disabilities OR

 

( Should pay the net cost (nil) and receive a disadvantage for the net deficit [10 points] on the basis these constitute one ability overall ("sees by radar sense instead of sight").

 

The character should not have to pay full freight for radar sense and suck up the loss of sight as having no impact.

 

So would you allow someone to take No Legs (All the Time, Fully) for 25 points, then buy Extra Limbs: Legs for 5 points, or would you limit the Disad to only giving 5 points, only giving 20 points, or some other option?

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: How would you build this power?

 

So would you allow someone to take No Legs (All the Time' date=' Fully) for 25 points, then buy Extra Limbs: Legs for 5 points, or would you limit the Disad to only giving 5 points, only giving 20 points, or some other option?[/quote']

 

First off, that's a lot like buying 0 END and "costs END". A smack with a 5er would appear to be in order.

 

To take a more technical approach, however...

 

The "no legs" disadvantage presumes the character is incapable of walking. That's why it's an All The Time, Fully Limiting disadvantage. In my game, it would not be written "no legs", but "cannot walk". The SFX could be nonfunctional legs, a lack of legs or anything else that prevents the character walking. 5 points spent for Extra Limbs provides Extra Limbs that can do anything the character's other limbs could do. Thanks to that physical limitation, he cannot walk. So he can have as many legs as he wants (Extra limbs), but cannot use them to walk (Phys Lim).