Erkenfresh Posted May 17, 2008 Report Share Posted May 17, 2008 So, I ran a game on Wednesday and a situation came up. I haven't run many Champions games so it's fairly new to me. The players were fighting against Lodestone (from CKC). Basically he has magnetic powers, including an energy blast described as a magnetic wave. One of the players is a bit like Poison Ivy. His powers are derived from plant chemicals or chemicals related to plants. One of his chemicals is basically Miracle Grow, but it works really fast. So he sprays the ground underneath his victim and vines come up and Entangle him. In this case he got Lodestone pretty good. So, here's where it gets interesting. Can Lodestone use his magnetic wave to hurt the vines? There's not really any metal in them (OK, maybe a little bit but not much). And if he can't hurt the vines, he should be able to use the blast normally to hurt the players without the entangle first taking the damage? But then, why do magnetic waves hurt the players in the first place? At the time, I let his waves pass through the vines to do full damage to the players. It didn't change the outcome, the players still won the fight. However, how would you rule in this situation, and why? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Posted May 17, 2008 Report Share Posted May 17, 2008 Re: Entangle Special Effects? Lodestone's Magnetic Blasts are not bought with the limitation 'only affects metal' (this is also specifically mentioned in his power description). In this particular instance, 'magnetism' only describes the SFX of the attack (or rather, the portion of the EM spectrum the energy occupies). The attack would have to take out the entangle before Lodestone could use the EB on the heroes... On a side note, his Magnetokinesis only works vs ferrous metals and TK is inherently indirect iirc -- so Lodestone would have been able to use that attack vs the heroes w/o needing to defeat the entangle first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erkenfresh Posted May 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 17, 2008 Re: Entangle Special Effects? OK, well let me setup another case. Let's say you use a pair of handcuffs on someone defined as an Entangle. Does that mean the handcuffed victim's eye beam has to go through the handcuffs first, even though there's no limitation on the eye beam that says "doesn't work on handcuffs"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrosshairCollie Posted May 18, 2008 Report Share Posted May 18, 2008 Re: Entangle Special Effects? OK' date=' well let me setup another case. Let's say you use a pair of handcuffs on someone defined as an Entangle. Does that mean the handcuffed victim's eye beam has to go through the handcuffs first, even though there's no limitation on the eye beam that says "doesn't work on handcuffs"?[/quote'] No, but handcuffs would be logically purchased with 'only restrains the characters hands or feet', which would not impair the eyebeam. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erkenfresh Posted May 18, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 18, 2008 Re: Entangle Special Effects? Right, well you got me there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radar Posted May 18, 2008 Report Share Posted May 18, 2008 Re: Entangle Special Effects? You could use the old Green Lantern trick: pick up something metallic to rend the entangle - that's the beauty of special effects, after all, especially if you didn't hamper the power with the limitation of only affect ferrous objects. I'd say it was something of a cheat if you had. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comic Posted May 18, 2008 Report Share Posted May 18, 2008 Re: Entangle Special Effects? You might refer to UEP, Magnetism vs. Biological (standard effect, neither gains nor loses). Now, if it were a metal entangle, the -3 ED Magnetism enjoys vs ferrometallic physical barriers would make a difference, I imagine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erkenfresh Posted May 18, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 18, 2008 Re: Entangle Special Effects? I think I'm more confused now than before I read the last two posts. "especially if you didn't hamper the power with the limitation of only affect ferrous objects. I'd say it was something of a cheat if you had." Does that mean you agree the magnetic waves should pass through the vines and hurt the players unhampered? "Now, if it were a metal entangle, the -3 ED Magnetism enjoys vs ferrometallic physical barriers would make a difference, I imagine." Uhhhh? Never read UEP so I have no idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghost-angel Posted May 18, 2008 Report Share Posted May 18, 2008 Re: Entangle Special Effects? Essentially, Loadstone uses Comic Book Physics to hurt people with Magnetic Waves. You don't really need to think about SFX interaction much, it's just really really dense magnetism. That hurts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erkenfresh Posted May 19, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 19, 2008 Re: Entangle Special Effects? OK, one more quick question. If the attack is Indirect, it can bypass the entangle right? For example if you were to call lightning down from the sky, it would have nothing to do with the entangle. Well, unless you targetted yourself I suppose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghost-angel Posted May 19, 2008 Report Share Posted May 19, 2008 Re: Entangle Special Effects? Depends on the level of Indirect used. If it's "Always from the same point" like "always from the sky" then no, I would say it does not. If it's "Any direction" the the Indirect could 'start' from 'inside' the Entangle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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