Slowly Expanding AOE

[Susano]

The power work as follows:

 

The character unleashes a massive surge of energy, which forms around the character as a slowly-expanding destructive ball. The surge expands to a certain point, then retreats.

 

Here is my basic idea for how the power works:

 

6d6 RKA, AOE (x" radius; +1), Continuous (+1) Personal Immunity (+1/4); No Knockback (-1/4), No Range (-1/2)....

 

Now, here's where I'm a little stuck, the character can't move, he's pretty much occupied with attempting to control the surge. So that's... what? Concentrate 0 DCV, Throughout? Also, the surge takes some time to expand out to the full size of the radius, then comes back. So there needs to be a Limitation like "Surge Expands 1" Each Segment Till It Reaches Maximum Radius, Then Reverses".

 

I'm also considering a version of this power that adds the Advantage of Megascale (1" = 1km) titled "Oh No, There Goes Tokyo."

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Slowly Expanding AOE

 

Well.

 

I'd probably do that as an AOE with a variation on Gradual Effect, since he's TECHNICALLY pounding out a new set of damage every phase, it's really a unique advantage. Model it like an upside-down explosion. Purchase the radius (max), the rate (X"/phase) and go from there. No real need to leave the character in place, it's a custom advantage. You CAN have them at 0 DCV Orange Juice from Concentrate, but that's a separate piece than what you're referring too.

[Susano]

Re: Slowly Expanding AOE

 

How would one buy the rate? It's 1" a Segment, which seems about right for the concept. And I do want to leave the character in place, as he/she isn't going to be able to move while unleashing this sort of destruction.

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Slowly Expanding AOE

 

Hang on, we're talking about two separate things. I'm saying, "build it as a Custom Advantage" and then treat it as such; put a giant STOP sign next to it, certainly, but we're talking about a Custom Advantage on the power. Then, like any power, the limitations define how it looks & feels (form) while the advantages define how much destruction it causes (function).

 

Because it's a variant on Gradual Effect, I would start with the canonical 1"/phase at +1; each phase that passes it expands outwards, while anything still standing IN the AOE continues to take damage (hence the very high +1). To speed up the effect, increase the value (to 2"/phase, and so on at +1/4 per increase) and to slow it down, decrease the value.

 

I'd agree, you WOULDN'T want someone to move from an anime standpoint, but let's say you slap the advantage on a variation of grenade launcher? We're still talking about a slowly spreading effect on an AOE. Do you see where I'm going? It's a brilliant idea that should have an expanded application.

[Susano]

Re: Slowly Expanding AOE

 

Ahh... well, this is for a sample power and will only be used on that sample power. I'm not intending the expansion ability to be a stand alone advantage.

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Slowly Expanding AOE

 

But that's the best, most canonical way to build it, from my POV, Mike. Because it's really an advantage, yeah? And we build all powers the same way. Base (RKA) Advantages (AOE Cloud -- ooh! I like that!) and Limitations (Conc, 0 DCV, etc.). I think your life will be easier if you do it that way, as a Custom Advantage you can then reuse (hence, STOP Sign) and you'll have it forever after.

 

I'm going to call it AOE Cloud and puzzle through my own version of this. Too brilliant to not use.

[CrosshairCollie]

Re: Slowly Expanding AOE

 

How about making AE Hex, then ...

+1/4 2x radius, delayed one segment, plus

+1/4 2x radius, delaye two segments, plus

+1/4 2x radius, delayed three segments

 

until you're done? Probably not a huge limitation on those time delays (-1/4 to -1/2 at the end), but it seems to work by the book.

[Susano]

Re: Slowly Expanding AOE

 

But that's the best, most canonical way to build it, from my POV, Mike. Because it's really an advantage, yeah? And we build all powers the same way. Base (RKA) Advantages (AOE Cloud -- ooh! I like that!) and Limitations (Conc, 0 DCV, etc.). I think your life will be easier if you do it that way, as a Custom Advantage you can then reuse (hence, STOP Sign) and you'll have it forever after.

 

I'm going to call it AOE Cloud and puzzle through my own version of this. Too brilliant to not use.

 

I'd like to see what you get... this sample power is meant for publication.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Slowly Expanding AOE

 

This sounds like a job for a Limited Naked Advantage on a single power.

 

The unlimited version looks like the following:

 

150 With AOE Radius: Killing Attack - Ranged 6d6, 6 Continuing Charges lasting 1 Minute each (+0), Personal Immunity (+1/4), Continuous (+1), Area Of Effect (80" Radius; 60" Radius Max; +1 1/2) (337 Active Points); Concentration, Must Concentrate throughout use of Constant Power (1/2 DCV; -1/2), No Range (-1/2), No Knockback (-1/4) [6 cc]

 

If the Gradual Effect Limitation only applies to the AOE then just build that Advantage as a single Naked custom power:

 

90 And without AOE Radius: Killing Attack - Ranged 6d6, 6 Continuing Charges lasting 1 Minute each (+0), Personal Immunity (+1/4), Continuous (+1) (202 Active Points); Concentration, Must Concentrate throughout use of Constant Power (1/2 DCV; -1/2), No Range (-1/2), No Knockback (-1/4) [6 cc]

40 Naked 60" Gradual Expanding AOE Radius Wave: Custom Power (60 Active Points); Gradual Effect (1 Minute; Radius expands by 1" per segment; -1/2)

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Slowly Expanding AOE

 

See. you're still making it a Custom Advantage. I'm saying, write up a full bore advantage. Which I need to do, and can't until I get home. But if I were to slam it together real quick:

 

AOE (Cloud) +1

Requires: Continous, +1

 

Base Effect: The AOE effect expands outwards from the point of effect, creating a new ring of hexes every phase (on the character's phase). Any creature within the AOE on any given phase is affected by the AOE normally (hence the requirement for Continuous). The user spends END on every phase the AOE is Active (as Autofire, which is what this power is ultimately a variant of).

 

Purchase AOE +1, with standard AOE modifiers. The effect causes the ring to expand outwards to the maximum of the effect, or until the user stops paying END. Once it's hit it's maximium footprint, the effect ends.

 

Lingering: With this Advantage, an AOE Cloud will stay at maximum effect.

 

-1/4; for every -1/4, the effect is slowed (1"/2 phases, 1"/3 phases and so on).

+1/4; for every +1/4, the effect speeds up (2"/phase, 3"/phase).

Contracting Cloud: +1/2; if the cloud should also have a contracting effect, where it collapses and does damage, add +1/2

Explosive Cloud: -1/2; per Explosion, the cloud loses DC over the AOE as it expands (effectively a Gradual Effect Explosion).

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Slowly Expanding AOE

 

See. you're still making it a Custom Advantage.

...

 

 

Nope.

 

I'm using a Single Power Naked Advantage.

 

from:

 

Hero System 5th Edition, Revised ■ Chapter One

page 245

 

Single-Power Naked Advantages

Characters calculate the cost of a naked Advantage for only one power differently. In that case, recalculate the cost of the base power as if it normally had the naked Advantage. After you have that new cost, subtract the cost of the base power to determine the cost of the naked Advantage. All Advantages and Limitations applicable to the base power automatically apply to and/or function with the naked Advantage, but do not alter its cost. (Reduced Endurance is an exception — as discussed above, a naked Advantage has a normal END cost unless the character buys Reduced Endurance for it separately.)

 

Example: Dweomer has a Spell Of Sublime Attack: Energy Blast 8d6, Area Of Effect (One Hex; +½), Armor Piercing (+½) (80 Active Points); OAF (wizard’s staff ; -1), Incantations (-¼) (total cost: 35 points). He decides he wants to create another spell, the Spell Of Augmentation, that applies the Advantage Penetrating (+½) to the Spell Of Sublime Attack. He buys this as a naked Advantage. The power with Penetrating added would cost 100 Active Points, 44 Real Points. 44 - 35 = 9 points, so the naked Advantage costs him 9 points. The Focus and Incantations Limitations automatically apply to the naked Advantage, and do not reduce the cost. The naked Advantage costs 1 END to use. If Dweomer wants to apply a separate Advantage or Limitation to the naked Advantage, he starts with a base cost of 9 points.

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Slowly Expanding AOE

 

Right.

 

You're applying an advantage that doesn't exist yet. That's more my point.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Slowly Expanding AOE

 

Right.

 

You're applying an advantage that doesn't exist yet. That's more my point.

 

I am just applying the basic AOE Radius Advantage as a Naked Single Power Advantage with Limitations that only affect the Naked Advantage per the standard rules. There is nothing custom about it except the need to use a 'custom power' to express it within HDv3.

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Slowly Expanding AOE

 

One of us is speaking Martian.

 

It might be me.

 

Here's what I heard from Mike: "I want a power that creates an AOE that expands over time." Far as I know, no such construct exists in HERO, hence, why I built it. Are we talking past each other here?

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Slowly Expanding AOE

 

One of us is speaking Martian.

 

It might be me.

 

Here's what I heard from Mike: "I want a power that creates an AOE that expands over time." Far as I know, no such construct exists in HERO, hence, why I built it. Are we talking past each other here?

 

I think Mike's use of the word 'power' could be replaced with the word 'build'.

 

That's the way I was reading it at least.

I didn't read it as a request for a custom advantage but I could be wrong.

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Slowly Expanding AOE

 

I knew there was a gap there, since after 3 years it's so uncommon for us to take two drastically different approaches that my brain was in knots.

[Susano]

Re: Slowly Expanding AOE

 

I think Mike's use of the word 'power' could be replaced with the word 'build'.

 

That's the way I was reading it at least.

I didn't read it as a request for a custom advantage but I could be wrong.

 

Yeah, I want a build. Not a new Advantage.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Slowly Expanding AOE

 

Yeah' date=' I want a build. Not a new Advantage.[/quote']

 

So what did you think of what I posted earlier?

[Susano]

Re: Slowly Expanding AOE

 

Sounds like it might work, but I'm just going to make it one big power, not a separate Naked Advantage. I like Thia's idea as well, but I don't want to present a whole new Advantage.

[pinecone]

Re: Slowly Expanding AOE

 

The only "other" build that comes to mind is a succor to "Extra area" ...

 

 

so E-attack/RKA AE: one hex +1/2, Personal immunity+1/4, Extra area +1/4 (+1 so far)

No range-1/2.

 

Succor Area effect advantage cost 25% of top build each, this means as long as you just stand around boosting the top effect it gets bigger and bigger. Till it tops out.

 

I don't rightly know if continues is needed, just burn your phases "attacking your hex while maintaining the boost...

 

Possable? Crazy? Yes to both?

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Slowly Expanding AOE

 

Sounds like it might work' date=' but I'm just going to make it one big power, not a separate Naked Advantage. I like Thia's idea as well, but I don't want to present a whole new Advantage.[/quote']

 

It only 'separate' in the way I presented it. It could easily be packaged as a compound power as well. Regardless, a custom AOE Advantage is the only other option. Considering that the custom rules behind such a construct would have to be noted separately anyway I don't see it as an improvement.

[DevilInSatin]

Re: Slowly Expanding AOE

 

It's Extra Time.

 

If Extra Time on Teleport, Megascaled, is a "jump drive" that isn't instantaneous, I don't see why Extra Time on an AoE (or Explosion, now I think of it) can't be "goes boom slowly".

 

Simple is good.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Slowly Expanding AOE

 

It's Extra Time.

 

If Extra Time on Teleport, Megascaled, is a "jump drive" that isn't instantaneous, I don't see why Extra Time on an AoE (or Explosion, now I think of it) can't be "goes boom slowly".

 

Simple is good.

 

Nope.

 

Very similar but mechanically different Limitations.

 

Extra Time

(Hero System Fifth Edition Rule Book, page 186-187; Revised, page 290-291)

 

A Power with this Limitation takes longer than usual to activate and/or use.

 

Gradual Effect

(Hero System Fifth Edition Rule Book, page 192; Revised, page 296-297)

 

A Power with this Limitation works slowly, taking some time to achieve its full effect.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Slowly Expanding AOE

 

Gradual Effect could certainly just be applied to the build as a whole but a direct result would be that the damage of the Killing Attack itself would also take time to build up as well. The way I understood the original request, this was not desired. I could be wrong (wouldn't be the first time).

[DevilInSatin]

Re: Slowly Expanding AOE

 

Nope.

 

Very similar but mechanically different Limitations.

 

Extra Time

(Hero System Fifth Edition Rule Book, page 186-187; Revised, page 290-291)

 

Gradual Effect

(Hero System Fifth Edition Rule Book, page 192; Revised, page 296-297)

 

Well, tell it to the inventor of "Extra Time means slower travel" in Star HERO.