RFC: ACW-10 "Talon" Combat Rifle

[esampson]

Request For Comments:

 

Having been out of the game for a long time I've recently started encouraging my son to pick up the Hero System and as a result I'm getting back into it as well. I'm dusting off an old concept of mine from about 20 years back and am looking for comments/critiques/ideas/etc.

 

Cartel:

 

Founded in the mid 80's by the owners of several advanced manufacturing companies Cartel is motivated by a simple goal; profit. To be more specific Cartel is interested in the profits that can be made from the current situation created by supercriminals and the heroes who try to stop them. Initially concerning itself with the manufacture of arms and armaments for various villains Cartel quickly branched out into additional profit producing fields such as the training of henchmen, laundering of money, genetic enhancements, providing logistics and support in the form of trained agents, both non-powered and powered to villains willing to pay their prices, as well as providing services as a clearing house and arbitrator for supervillains interested in contacting and working with other (non-Cartel) villains.

 

ACW-10 "Talon" Combat Rifle:

 

In many ways the gold standard for firearms in the post-superhuman world. Created in 2010 by one of Cartel's various arms manufacturing companies as something of a showpiece weapon the Talon is too expensive for wide scale military deployment but sees a great deal of use in smaller scale. It is the standard firearm of most Cartel combat agents as well as enjoying a high degree of popularity among the various support personnel of quite a few criminal enterprises. Of course all weapons that are used illegally arrive on the street after being 'stolen' from the manufacturer in order to keep the company's hands clean. As a result the Talon is also deployed by the superhuman response units in many major cities, often being sold at a discount as escalating the power available to superhuman response units increases the demand from criminal organizations for Cartel's services.

 

Composed of high tech polymers and alloys the Talon is a light weight assault rifle capable of firing three round bursts of high calibre ammunition. The clip of the Talon holds 30 rounds and includes built in sensors capable of monitoring the amount of ammunition remaining in the magazine and passing the data along to the optional Advanced Combat Electronic Sight (ACES). Typical load out for most consist of 4 magazines of ammunition of either regular or armor-piercing ammunition.

 

Beneath the barrel of the gun is a specialized launcher. The launcher utilizes a cylinder capable of holding 6 specialized 40mm shells. Controls on the side of the launcher enable the user to quickly fire whichever of the shells they so desire.

 

[TABLE=class: grid, width: 100%]

[TR]

[TD]Points[/TD]

[TD]Power[/TD]

[TD]END[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD]35[/TD]

[TD]ACW-10 "Talon" Combat Rifle: Multipower, 71-point reserve, (71 Active Points); all slots OAF (Rifle; -1)[/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD]2[/TD]

[TD]Inherent Accuracy: (Total: 4 Active Cost, 2 Real Cost) +1 OCV on Autofire (2 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1) (Real Cost: 1) plus +2 range on autofire (2 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1) (Real Cost: 1)[/TD]

[TD]0[/TD]

[/TR]

[/TABLE]

 

Possible slots for the multipower include:

 

[TABLE=class: grid, width: 100%]

[TR]

[TD]Points[/TD]

[TD]Power[/TD]

[TD]END[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD]3f[/TD]

[TD]Autofire: RKA 2 1/2d6, Autofire (3 shots; +1/4) (70 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1), Beam (-1/4), 4 clips of 30 Charges (+1/2)[/TD]

[TD][30][/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD]3f[/TD]

[TD]Autofire: RKA 2d6+1, Autofire (3 shots; +1/4), Armor Piercing (+1/4) (70 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1), Beam (-1/4), 4 clips of 30 Charges (+1/2)[/TD]

[TD][30][/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD]2f[/TD]

[TD]Fragmentation Grenade: RKA 3d6, Area Of Effect (20m Radius Explosion; +1/2) (67 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1), 1-6 Charges (-3/4)[/TD]

[TD][1-6][/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD]2f[/TD]

[TD]Concussion Grenade: Blast 9d6, Area Of Effect (20m Radius Explosion; +1/2) (67 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1), 1-6 Charges (-3/4)[/TD]

[TD][1-6][/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD]1f[/TD]

[TD]Flashbang Grenade: Sight and Hearing Groups Flash 6d6, Area Of Effect (14m Radius Explosion; +1/4) (44 Active Points); 1-4 Charges (-1), OAF (Rifle; -1)[/TD]

[TD][1-4][/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD]2f[/TD]

[TD]Flashbang Grenade: Sight and Hearing Groups Flash 6d6, Area Of Effect (14m Radius Explosion; +1/4) (44 Active Points); 5-6 Charges (-3/4), OAF (Rifle; -1)[/TD]

[TD][5-6][/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD]2f[/TD]

[TD]Smoke Grenade: Darkness to Sight Group 14m radius (70 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1), 1-3 Continuing Charges lasting 1 Turn each (-3/4), Limited Power (Doesn't block IR perception; -0)[/TD]

[TD][1-3cc][/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD]3f[/TD]

[TD]Smoke Grenade: Darkness to Sight Group 14m radius (70 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1), 4-6 Continuing Charges lasting 1 Turn each (-1/4), Limited Power (Doesn't block IR perception; -0)[/TD]

[TD][4-6cc][/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD]2f[/TD]

[TD]Shaped Charge: (Total: 71 Active Cost, 25 Real Cost) RKA 2d6, Armor Piercing (+1/4), +1 Increased STUN Multiplier (+1/4) (45 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1), 1-6 Charges (-3/4) (Real Cost: 16) plus RKA 1d6, Area Of Effect (8m Radius Explosion; +1/4), +1 Increased STUN Multiplier (+1/4), Armor Piercing (+1/4) (26 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1), 1-6 Charges (-3/4), Limited Power: Armor piercing only works on target directly hit by the attack and not against targets simply caught within the explosion. (-0) (Real Cost: 9)[/TD]

[TD][1-6][/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD]1f[/TD]

[TD]Flechette Shell: RKA 4d6 (60 Active Points); 1-2 Charges (-1 1/2), OAF (Rifle; -1), Reduced By Range (-1/4), Reduced Penetration (-1/4)[/TD]

[TD][1-2][/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD]2f[/TD]

[TD]Flechette Shell: RKA 4d6 (60 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1), 3-6 Charges (-3/4), Reduced By Range (-1/4), Reduced Penetration (-1/4)[/TD]

[TD][3-6][/TD]

[/TR]

[/TABLE]

 

When equipping a character with a Talon they will chose one of the first two slots (alternately they could chose both and have 4 clips of regular ammunition and 4 clips of armor piercing ammunition). Any of the remaining slots can be chosen although the gun is limited to a maximum of 6 shells. There's no particular limitation on this and it is simply a function of the weapon's special effect. Likewise while there is no explicit limitation a character who has both armor piercing and regular bullets who wishes to swap between them must spend a full phase action changing between those two slots to represent switching clips. Any other switching of the multipower is a standard zero phase action (although it is not possible to change from standard ammunition to a shell and then to armor piercing ammunition without spending the full phase to change clips).

 

Optional sights for the Talon include:

 

[TABLE=class: grid, width: 100%]

[TR]

[TD]Points[/TD]

[TD]Power[/TD]

[TD]END[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD]2[/TD]

[TD]Laser Sight: (Total: 5 Active Cost, 2 Real Cost) +1 OCV with all rifle attacks (3 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1), Limited Power: Only out to 125m (-0) (Real Cost: 1) plus +1 range with rifle attacks (2 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1), Limited Power: Only out to 125m (-0) (Real Cost: 1)[/TD]

[TD]0[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD]2[/TD]

[TD]ACES (Advanced Combat Electronic Sight): (Total: 7 Active Cost, 2 Real Cost) +1 OCV with all rifle attacks (3 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1), Limited Power: Only when shooter braces and/or sets (-1) (Real Cost: 1) plus +2 range with rifle attacks (4 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1), Limited Power: Only when shooter braces and/or sets (-1) (Real Cost: 1)[/TD]

[TD]0[/TD]

[/TR]

[/TABLE]

 

Because the slots represent things that might possibly be carried rather than what is absolutely carried the final cost of the gun can vary depending upon its configuration. As an example:

 

"Brick Killer" loadout:

[TABLE=class: grid, width: 100%]

[TR]

[TD]Points[/TD]

[TD]Power[/TD]

[TD]END[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD]35[/TD]

[TD]ACW-10 "Talon" Combat Rifle: Multipower, 71-point reserve, (71 Active Points); all slots OAF (Rifle; -1)[/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD]3f[/TD]

[TD]1) Autofire: RKA 2d6+1, Autofire (3 shots; +1/4), Armor Piercing (+1/4) (70 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1), Beam (-1/4), 4 clips of 30 Charges (+1/2)[/TD]

[TD][30][/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD]1f[/TD]

[TD]2) Flashbang Grenade: Sight and Hearing Groups Flash 6d6, Area Of Effect (14m Radius Explosion; +1/4) (44 Active Points); 2 Charges (-1), OAF (Rifle; -1)[/TD]

[TD][2][/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD]2f[/TD]

[TD]3) Smoke Grenade: Darkness to Sight Group 14m radius (70 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1), 1 Continuing Charge lasting 1 Turn (-3/4), Limited Power (Doesn't block IR perception; -0)[/TD]

[TD][1cc][/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD]2f[/TD]

[TD]4) Shaped Charge: (Total: 71 Active Cost, 25 Real Cost) RKA 2d6, Armor Piercing (+1/4), +1 Increased STUN Multiplier (+1/4) (45 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1), 3 Charges (-3/4) (Real Cost: 16) plus RKA 1d6, Area Of Effect (8m Radius Explosion; +1/4), +1 Increased STUN Multiplier (+1/4), Armor Piercing (+1/4) (26 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1), 3 Charges (-3/4), Limited Power: Armor piercing only works on target directly hit by the attack and not against targets simply caught within the explosion. (-0) (Real Cost: 9)[/TD]

[TD][3][/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD]2[/TD]

[TD]Inherent Accuracy: (Total: 4 Active Cost, 2 Real Cost) +1 OCV on Autofire (2 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1) (Real Cost: 1) plus +2 range on autofire (2 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1) (Real Cost: 1)[/TD]

[TD]0[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD]2[/TD]

[TD]Laser Sight: (Total: 5 Active Cost, 2 Real Cost) +1 OCV with all rifle attacks (3 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1), Limited Power: Only out to 125m (-0) (Real Cost: 1) plus +1 range with rifle attacks (2 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1), Limited Power: Only out to 125m (-0) (Real Cost: 1)[/TD]

[TD]0[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD]47[/TD]

[TD]Total[/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[/TR]

[/TABLE]

[Pattern Ghost]

Re: RFC: ACW-10 "Talon" Combat Rifle

 

What edition of the rules is this for?

 

One thing that stands out, and I don't know if it's true in 6th edition, is applying advantages/limitations to less than a 5 pt CSL.

 

The Shaped Charge slot Active Pts cost exceed the multipower pool size. Again, don't know if that's changed for 6e, but it seems weird if it did.

[esampson]

Re: RFC: ACW-10 "Talon" Combat Rifle

 

Sorry. It's for 6th ed. Math is included for the slots so if you can tell me what's off with shaped charge it would be great (Compound power with 45 and 26 active points, 71 AP according to my math).

 

edit: 6th says "The GM may restrict which types of CSLs a character can Limit; for example he might rule that only 3-point or more expensive CSLs can have Limitations." So that's sort of indefinite to me. One of the reasons for the RFC was for things like that. I don't know if lots of people say that no, you have to have at least 3-point CSLs for limitations or if that is rare.

[Pattern Ghost]

Re: RFC: ACW-10 "Talon" Combat Rifle

 

Ok, so it sounds like the rule for CSLs have changed to be an alternative rule, so no problems there.

 

And nevermind on the slot cost. I misread the write up. You do indeed have a 71 pt pool.

 

Sorry, I'm a bit out of it at the moment.

[kahuna's bro]

Re: RFC: ACW-10 "Talon" Combat Rifle

 

shouldn't this hread be in the dark champions forum???

[esampson]

Re: RFC: ACW-10 "Talon" Combat Rifle

 

Actually I've also got a variant written up that used Blasts instead of RKAs for the primary attack. Just didn't want to overload the first post. Additionally this really isn't meant as a weapon for the players. It is meant primarily as an NPC weapon, hence not worrying quite so much about things like an actual limitation for the full phase delay if switching bullets but not grenades.

 

If I were writing it up for Dark Champions I would probably be adding things like the Real Gun limitation, requires 2 hands, etc. I'd probably also tune the damage to be a bit lower. As the current damage sits I think it would probably shred most DC heroes pretty quickly.

 

But that does bring up the original reason for the RFC. The game that I originally created Cartel for was very much a DC style (DC didn't actually exist at the time). The original gun were basically just M-16s with M203 grenade launchers and the Cartel agents used pretty straightforward grenades. I've been out of Champions for over 20 years and in that time things have moved on a bit and I'm trying to get an impression of where the 'world at large' sits.

 

Saying the gun feels too Dark Champions is a perfectly acceptable response, btw. Would modifying the attacks to being largely or even completely Blast based instead of RKAs fix that or is the overall concept of gun with grenade launcher just too DC? What about the damage levels? To high/low for a standard superhero campaign? Is the +2 OCV +3 Range combination of Inherent Accuracy and Laser Sight for standard agents over the top (especially when combined with levels)?

[IndianaJoe3]

Re: RFC: ACW-10 "Talon" Combat Rifle

 

In the equipment guide, most high-caliber rounds are built with the Increased STUN Multiplier Advantage, but the Talon is not. Was this difference a deliberate decision on your part?

[esampson]

Re: RFC: ACW-10 "Talon" Combat Rifle

 

Partly. It was motivated by trying to balance cost/damage. Adding the +1 stun modifier makes the attacks 2d6+1 and 2d6 AP.

[esampson]

Re: RFC: ACW-10 "Talon" Combat Rifle

 

Ok. So one thing that comes up is the question "is this clear?"

 

[TABLE=class: grid, width: 100%]

[TR]

[TD]Points[/TD]

[TD]Power[/TD]

[TD]END[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD]2f[/TD]

[TD]Shaped Charge: (Total: 71 Active Cost, 25 Real Cost) RKA 2d6, Armor Piercing (+1/4), +1 Increased STUN Multiplier (+1/4) (45 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1), 1-6 Charges (-3/4) (Real Cost: 16) plus RKA 1d6, Area Of Effect (8m Radius Explosion; +1/4), +1 Increased STUN Multiplier (+1/4), Armor Piercing (+1/4) (26 Active Points); OAF (Rifle; -1), 1-6 Charges (-3/4), Limited Power: Armor piercing only works on target directly hit by the attack and not against targets simply caught within the explosion. (-0) (Real Cost: 9)[/TD]

[TD][1-6][/TD]

[/TR]

[/TABLE]

 

The idea behind this is that someone hit with the attack takes a 3d6 RKA, armor piercing, with a +1 stun modifier. People standing next to the target (or even the target themselves if the attack should strike an obstacle such as a wall behind them) would take a 1d6 RKA explosion with a +1 stun modifier (I should probably modify the limited power to remove the +1 stun modifier to targets simply caught within the explosion). It is not meant that the target should take a 2d6 RKA, armor piercing, with a +1 stun modifier then a second 1d6 RKA, armor piercing, with a +1 stun modifier.

 

So is it clear as written? Would you write it up differently as a 3d6 RKA with a naked advantage on 15 points of the RKA for an explosion? I'm not really looking for point efficiency (both of them should total to the same) but clarity.

 

And as always I'm looking for more general feedback as well. Does it feel too Dark Champions? Is it too complicated? Is the damage too high for agents? Too low to be a threat to what you consider your average brick?