Panpiper

? Er... Buying speed and OCV/DCV is now VASTLY more expensive/difficult. One could contest that point levels have increased to compensate, but I have not seen a single campaign yet personally where that is actually true. In fact in the last few years, I have generally been surprised by campaign limits being ever more stringent. Strength/characteristics based characters have been massively neutered relative to powers and such, whose points costs remained unchanged. (Can you tell I am not much of a fan of 6th edition?)

A quiver with different sorts of arrows is both the most obvious and logical use of a Multipower in my opinion. A warrior's weapon like a reversible axe with a blade on one side and an armor piercing pick or blunt hammer on the other would also pass muster 100%. Expanding on that, if the warrior forgoes a shield, they might build a two hand halberd with several different powers, regular blade attack, piecing with a pick on the reverse, reach with the spear point, even a blunt attack with the shaft. Shields can be multipowers usable either as a DCV bonus or an area advantage bash. A bit more imagination might come up with more to put into a shield multipower.

The character I am currently playing has a flight multipower (one slot for combat flight, the other for much faster non-combat). It was my GM's advice for me to put 'unified power' on it for a -1/4 limitation. Makes perfect sense. If someone drains her combat flight, it would be quite ridiculous for her to be able to save herself by going supersonic.

I certainly would allow an archer to build a quiver as a multipower. I could be talked into a multipower for a funky martial artist with Wuxia abilities. The caveat however would be that the slots all be appropriate and thematic. I suppose if a wizard was held to a similar caveat...

All the other formats I have seen are significantly worse when it comes to making a legible PDF, unless you go to an ultra bare bones listing of stats. Even those however ignore paragraphing in all the background text, making it illegible. Choosing between a crappy presentation and illegible background text or not listing costs for OCV/DCV, I'll take the later every time.

I used the "DefaultPrintTemplate6e.hde" that is in my main HeroDesigner directory and did an Export/Preview Character. That opens it up in a browser window. From the browser with that preview displaying, I select Print. From print I have the option to save it as a PDF. Might sound a bit roundabout, but it takes seconds. DefaultPrintTemplate6e.hde

It's not that there is a problem. I just don't know if I have over spent on OCV/DCV, if I am in line with what a balanced character should be, or if I am going to find she is deficient with OCV/DCV. I really have no clue. She is bought pretty clean. Nothing overly gratuitous, no "funny stuff". Everything passed GM scrutiny. The 'unified' limitation in her flight multipower was actually suggested by the GM (it replaced a bottom of phase activation for her flight).

That may then be my issue. 250 used to be the norm. Maybe 400 is now the norm, because that is what is necessary now with the stat changes to get the same effect as 250 earlier. I'm focused on 300 at the moment because I am playing in someone else's game and we are playing 300 point supers (teens, the first generation of supers to exist). Take for instance the attached character (the one I am actually playing at the moment) built in 6th edition on 300 points. She has an OCV/DCV of 7 with a speed of 5. If I build the exact same character in 5th edition using 250 points and give her the exact same stats and powers 'except' OCV/DCV and speed, I can give the 250 point 5th edition version a speed of 6 and an OCV/DCV of 9/9! So yea, I think you do need 400 points in 6th to replicate the same heroes as one used to with 250 in 5th. My confusion resulted from my assumption that 300 was the new norm. I guess an OCV/DCV speed of 7/7 5 is reasonably solid then for a 300 point character. Ishtar Ninurte.pdf

The problems is that I CANNOT create the same character in 6th edition with 300 points that I could in 5th with 250 points. Sixth edition is almost a completely different game with the changes to stats, with strength based characters, indeed 'stat' based characters massively nerfed. Some things have to get scaled back. The averages CANNOT stay the same. Suggested campaign ballparks enforced for 'balance' can be the same, sure, but that's not what I am talking about. What I am trying to get a handle on is applied stats that starting character 'actually' start at because of the new expense in stats, so I can have a clue whether my character will be deficient or not.

Point taken.

Back in the days of 5th edition and earlier, I had a clear understanding that an OCV/DCV of 8 each was the effective average for a starting 250 point character without added skill levels, which starting characters would usually not 'start' with. With the complete redesign of the point system for stats in 6e however, I no longer have the slightest clue what the 'average' OCV/DCV is for a similar 300 point (for 6e) starting superhero. Might one or a few weigh in to give me their thoughts on the matter?

I would most likely use https://www.rpgcrossing.com/ That is the only PBP site I am remotely familiar with and I already have some relationship with a few people there. I have no problem helping with character creation. Character creation is my favorite part of Hero System. Truth though, I haven't had opportunity to play Hero in years, and I might fail myself in anticipating some issues that might arise. The game would not likely start for at least a couple of weeks yet as I develop the world concept and such. I'll add following the text of the 'design document' I have so far, still in the incipient stage. Feel free to offer any critiques or suggestions. Aether A great magical war has torn the planet asunder, every civilization in the world was utterly decimated, no civilization survived. There were individual survivors however, and over the course of thousands of years, they adapted to the ruin left of their world. Some semblance of civilization has returned, with villages and towns walled against the dangers, and even the occasional city states. Many parts of the world remain too dangerous to travel, and even in the safer areas, ancient weapons slumber. Many ruins of the old world are untouched since the war, as they lay within those areas too dangerous to travel, and who knows what lurks within, waiting to awake. The war tore holes through dimensions in many places, and things not native to this world now are. Often they prey upon the human survivors. A few are friendly, or at least not hostile, such as the Dwarves and Elves, and there is a usually peaceful coexistence. Magic exists in the world, but most people are understandably frightened by it, for using too much of it risks wakening ancient dormant powers. Player Characters & Magic The players are quite special in the world, even though they start out unknown. Fate has brought them together for who knows what purpose. Players can be reluctant heroes, they can be anti-heroes, but in the end they are heroes who will do the right thing. This is not a game of evil or villainy. This world is high fantasy with regard to the sorts of characters that could exist. The characters over time could well evolve to the super heroic, albeit still with a fantasy flair. Starting characters are 175 points including 50 points of matching complications. There are NO characteristic maxima, you can build Hercules if you want. (If you hit with a weapon strong enough to do 'more' than double it's listed damage, it will break. You could buy a weapon that could take the abuse, but you have to pay character points for it.) There is NO active point limit for starting powers and stats. However using any power with more than 60 active points risks awakening "things". The probability increases depending on how much you exceed 60 active points. (Mechanically this is a 1% chance for every 1 point of magic exceeding the threshold.) Be careful when and where you use such extreme power. Note you could buy a power that exceeds 60 but when using it declare you are 'only' using 60 and you would not risk awakening things. Note too that this threshold could change depending upon where the character is. If you are close to a rift or a dormant power, even lesser power could awaken it. You can buy a talent called Magic Acuity that allows you to safely cast magic exceeding 60 active points. The talent costs 1 point for every 1 point of excess power. This reduces the chance of awakening things created by your magic by 1 for every point in the talent making it safer to cast power at higher levels. Magic is bought straight up as powers, no frameworks, with as many limitations as are appropriate and thematic. Any character who spends more than 50 points in powers gains the right to apply an additional 'Custom Modifier' called 'Initiate' that is worth a -1/2 limitation on any and all their powers. This represents their effort devoted to their craft. Taking 75 points in powers changes that to 'Adept' and is worth a -1 limitation to any powers. Taking a full 100 points in powers changes that to 'Wizard' and is worth a whopping -2 limitation. Players may at their discretion use different words to describe this. It is the limitation granted by the devotion to magic that counts, not the label. There is a brand of dangerous magic called "Hedge Magic". Hedge magic is twice as likely to awaken dormant powers, meaning the threshold is 30 points, not sixty. This is because Hedge magic works by actually invoking stray magic power of those very lingering powers. It is a very easy magic to learn, nearly anyone can use it if they devote some effort to learning how. Any spell can be defined as Hedge magic and will gain a -1 limitation to the spell for it. This is useful for a player who wants to buy one or a few 'small' powers, but not make the size of investment necessary to reach adept or wizard levels. More World Description This is not quite a post-apocalyptic world in that enough time has passed for civilization to more or less re-establish itself, and for many of the world scars to have healed to some degree. The Great War however unleashed titanic magics that utterly obliterated the societies that were warring, and many remnants of the use of those magics litter the land. Gaps between worlds were sometimes torn. Numerous races hitherto unknown in the world, now live within it, some friendly, some not. Most such places are well known to locals and easily avoided. A few however are restless, an even fewer wander. There are no large empires. Large empires tend to waken old weapons and are quickly reduced by those forces. While there are a good few quite impressive city states, most people live within walled towns and villages that tend to be independent. Most of them simply impose a land tax on those who own property inside the walls with most of the revenue collected going towards guarding the walls and the local roads. Occasionally a few towns and villages ally and create a common force that patrols the roads even more effectively. That is largely the limit to kingdom structure. There is trade between towns, a good bit of it actually. Caravan guards however is also a thriving profession, and traders usually travel in packs. Adventuring is also a common profession, with various bounties and missions often posted in taverns. Law enforcement is often aided if not in some places almost wholly relied on with bounties, also posted in taverns. Crime, Punishment & Slavery Punishments for crimes can be harsh, depending upon the communities. It is usually some sort of restitution, and if the guilty party cannot pay it, they are indentured as slaves to do so. Those they are indentured to for restitution may keep the slave themselves, rent them out often to mines and such for pay, or sell them at their discretion. The closest thing to a prison would be mines and the like where the indentured slaves work off their restitution. One can be indentured for failure to pay debts as well. Dead or alive bounties are rare, as a dead criminal cannot work to give restitution to their victims. Sometimes though, victims prefer revenge over restitution, so dead or alive bounties are not unknown. There are two classes of slaves, those solely indentured who owe a sum that could be worked off, and the life indentured. Solely indentured have rights in most societies and can be legally abused only to the point necessary to compel their obedience. Life indentured are true slaves, they can be killed at the whim of their owners and they have no rights at all. Usually only murderers, bandits, and the like are made life indentured. Children born to indentured slaves are in some places considered free and wards of the owners of their parents, but their support costs are added to the indenture. Such children can help work off the indenture for their parent. It is in most places illegal to force sex upon indentured slaves. For the life indentured, there is no such prohibition. Stolen slaves, those who committed no crimes and were simply captured by raiders, are legal in some societies, not allowed in others. In societies where they are not legal, there is usually some bureaucracy with paperwork to trace the crimes and obligations of the indentured, and a slave without such paperwork would be freed. Things can get a lot less legal in places without such bureaucracies.

More likely a case of great minds thinking alike.

I too am no real god, but I actually do put my pants on 'two' legs at a time. I sit on the side of the bed, position the pants at my feet, insert both feet then roll back while kicking my legs out. Presto, pants on. GM always has not just veto power as far as I am concerned (Including when I am a player of course), but also editor's privilege if necessary, though sparingly applied.

I actually AM planning on a fairly high powered game, except characters start with only 175 points. Here's what I have so far. This is very much at the inception, sidetracking at the end into a lot of detail on slavery. Aether A great magical war has torn a planet asunder, every civilization in the world was utterly decimated, no civilization survived. There were individual survivors however, and over the course of thousands of years, they adapted to the ruin left of their world. Some semblance of civilization has returned, with villages and towns walled against the dangers, and even the occasional city states. Many parts of the world remain too dangerous to travel, and even in the safer areas, ancient weapons slumber. Many ruins of the old world are untouched since the war, as they lay within those areas too dangerous to travel, and who knows what lurks within, waiting to awake. The war tore holes through dimensions in many places, and things not native to this world now are. Often they prey upon the human survivors. A few are friendly, or at least not hostile, such as the Dwarves and Elves, and there is a usually peaceful coexistence. Magic exists in the world, but most people are understandably frightened by it, for using too much of it risks wakening ancient dormant powers. The players are quite special in the world, even though they start out unknown. Fate has brought them together for who knows what purpose. Players can be reluctant heroes, they can be anti-heroes, but in the end they are heroes who will do the right thing. This is not a game of evil or villainy. This will be high fantasy with regard to the sorts of characters that could exist. The characters over time could well evolve to the super heroic, albeit still with a fantasy flair. Starting characters are 175 points including 50 points of matching complications. There are NO characteristic maxima, you can build Hercules if you want. (If you hit with a weapon strong enough to do 'more' than double it's listed damage, it will break. You could buy a weapon that could take the abuse, but you have to pay character points for it.) There is NO active point limit for starting powers and stats. However using any power with more than 60 active points risks awakening "things". The probability increases depending on how much you exceed 60 active points. Be careful when and where you use such extreme power. Note you could buy a power that exceeds 60 but when using it declare you are 'only' using 60 and you would not risk awakening things. Note too that this threshold could change depending upon where the character is. If you are close to a rift or a dormant power, even lesser power could awaken it. You can buy a talent called Magic Acuity that allows you to safely cast magic exceeding 60 active points. The talent costs 1 point for every 1 point of excess power. Note this is a threshold bonus, not a power reduction. Normally using say 2 points of extra power would have a rather low chance of awakening anything. If a character had 2 points of Magic Acuity they could safely cast a 62 active point spell with no chance of awakening anything. If they cast a power with 63 points, they would still exceed the threshold by 3 points with the same probability of awakening something as would someone who had 'no' Magic Acuity. Magic is bought straight up as powers, no frameworks, with as many limitations as are appropriate and thematic. Any character who spends more than 50 points in powers gains the right to apply an additional 'Custom Modifier' called 'Initiate' that is worth a -1/2 limitation on any and all their powers. This represents their effort devoted to their craft. Taking 75 points in powers changes that to 'Adept' and is worth a -1 limitation to any powers. Taking a full 100 points in powers changes that to 'Wizard' and is worth a whopping -2 limitation. Players may at their discretion use different words to describe this. It is the limitation granted by the devotion to magic that counts, not the label. This is not quite a post-apocalyptic world in that enough time has passed for civilization to more or less re-establish itself, and for many of the world scars to have healed to some degree. The Great War however unleashed titanic magics that utterly obliterated the societies that were warring, and many remnants of the use of those magics litter the land. Gaps between worlds were sometimes torn. Numerous races hitherto unknown in the world, now live within it, some friendly, some not. Most such places are well known to locals and easily avoided. A few however are restless, an even fewer wander. There are no large empires. Large empires tend to waken old weapons and are quickly reduced by those forces. While there are a good few quite impressive city states, most people live within walled towns and villages that tend to be independent. Most of them simply impose a land tax on those who own property inside the walls with most of the revenue collected going towards guarding the walls and the local roads. Occasionally a few towns and villages ally and create a common force that patrols the roads even more effectively. That is largely the limit to kingdom structure. There is trade between towns, a good bit of it actually. Caravan guards however is also a thriving profession, and traders usually travel in packs. Adventuring is also a common profession, with various bounties and missions often posted in taverns. Law enforcement is often aided if not in some places almost wholly relied on with bounties, also posted in taverns. Punishments for crimes can be harsh, depending upon the communities. It is usually some sort of restitution, and if the guilty party cannot pay it, they are indentured as slaves to do so. Those they are indentured to for restitution may keep the slave themselves, rent them out often to mines and such for pay, or sell them at their discretion. The closest thing to a prison would be mines and the like where the indentured slaves work off their restitution. One can be indentured for failure to pay debts as well. Dead or alive bounties are rare, as they do not allow the prisoner to work restitution to their victims. Sometimes though, victims prefer revenge over restitution, so dead or alive bounties are not unknown. There are two classes of slaves, those solely indentured who owe a sum that could be worked off, and the life indentured. Solely indentured have rights in most societies and can be legally abused only to the point necessary to compel their obedience. Life indentured are true slaves, they can be killed at the whim of their owners and they have no rights at all. Usually only murderers, bandits, and the like are made life indentured. Children born to indentured slaves are in some places considered free and wards of the owners of their parents, but their support costs are added to the indenture. Such children can help work off the indenture for their parent. It is in most places illegal to force sex upon indentured slaves. For the life indentured, there is no such prohibition. Stolen slaves, those who committed no crimes and were simply captured by raiders, are legal in some societies, not allowed in others. In societies where they are not legal, there is usually some bureaucracy with paperwork to trace the crimes and obligations of the indentured, and a slave without such paperwork would be freed. Things can get a lot less legal in places without such bureaucracies.

That's true enough I guess. I've just never seen the allure of playing the utility character I suppose. I want a Gandalf in my party. Ghads! A reply from a veritable god of Hero! I am in awe! Yours is a name I have known for decades Chris! Another issue I have with most people's magic systems is that they are simply, overly complex. I would kill (well, not literally) to play in a game run by Chris Goodwin, but there is again zero chance I would play a mage. Way too many criteria to meet and match to gain any sort of real power at all. Another jack of trades that can only shine when everyone else is lackluster. A huge number of players, at least the players I have known, have a hard enough time knowing what to do in D&D let alone the complexity of Hero. I would prefer to find/create an elegant, simple to implement and understand approach that newbies to the Hero system can comprehend with relative ease. I fully expect most of my players to have never seen Hero before. Most will ask me to build their characters for them based on their conceptions and it has to be simple to not just understand enough that they can easily spend XP, but also understand tactically.

Easier to play an elven archer with the strength for the heaviest bow along with martial maneuvers and various skill levels. Zero chance of their 'fire arrow' power failing, lots more damage than the mage, and very probably a significantly better OCV. Outshine such a wizard every time. Or a heavy plate, axe and shield dwarven warrior with a similar focus buying their strength past maxima, picking Dwarven Axemanship martial maneuvers and levels, hitting for 3d6+1 killing damage and equally hard to hurt. Way outshine such a mage every time, and I can build that dwarf with 'half' points! This is the problem with most magic systems I've seen people use and suggest, the mages generally suck compared to everyone else. Overcompensating for high level D&D mages perhaps, or trying to simulate how low level D&D mages suck maybe.

So your master mage really would fail with every second casting attempt? That doesn't feel like much of a master to me.

I used to have a pretty simple rule. Create whatever you want, but fill out your character sheet in pencil. Turn it in to me, and then I make any 'adjustments' I feel are necessary for the game. If they turn in a sheet that is well balanced, I need make no such adjustments. If they hand me something lopsided or abusive, they get back a 'corrected' character to play. Another way to do it is let people do whatever they want, but stipulate they must spend X number of points in non-combat skills as well. A rule I gave myself once with a GM who really had no clue how to GM me as someone with power gamer tendencies, what that I had to spend half my character points on non-combat skills and abilities, but the other half I could go to town on, as long as I bought them on the straight and narrow (no gratuitous limitations). I was still the toughest fighter in the game, but not to the point everyone else wasn't having fun.

I am really not clear on how people use that Requires a Skill Roll limitation. You have it defined as having a -1 penalty for every 20 active points, with the total power usable being effectively 60 active points for someone with a 14 or less skill roll. The problem I have in understanding is, does that not mean that the -1 penalty for every 20 active points penalty reduces them to an 11 or less roll every time they try to cast magic, such that the "master" fails pretty much half the time they try to cast something? If they buy three extra 'levels' with the skill to get that skill roll so they only fail a quarter of the time on a 14 or less, is that now a "world beater" who still fails at magic regularly?

That is interesting Marcus. Did you allow people to buy up that ego based magic skill roll, and if so by how much? If it were up to me as a player, I would by it to the point where no magic would require me to roll less than 14, and likely buy it higher than that with XP.

Ok, I understand the issue with Multipowers now. How does this sound for a 175 point high fantasy game? Magic is bought straight up as powers, no frameworks, with as many limitations as are appropriate and thematic. Any character who spends more than 50 points in powers gains the right to apply an additional 'Custom Modifier' called 'Initiate' that is worth a -1/2 limitation on any and all their powers. This represents their effort devoted to their craft. Taking 75 points in powers changes that to 'Adept' and is worth a -1 limitation to any powers. Taking a full 100 points in powers changes that to 'Wizard' and is worth a whopping -2 limitation. Players may at their discretion use different words to describe this. It is the limitation granted by the devotion to magic that counts, not the label.

Ah, sorry. When I was thinking grab, I was just thinking of the holding part, not necessarily doing damage to them. Certainly if I wanted to grab and 'squeeze', that would involve using strength and therefor endurance. What if the character just wanted to grab someone and fly into the air with them, without doing strength damage, just using strength to hold on to them, not to do damage dice?

I am not really a newbie and should know the answer to these questions, but I've been away from Hero for too long. I hope someone will indulge my memory. I have a strength based character (strength 50) who has a couple of martial maneuvers (Flying Grab and Passing Strike) to compliment her flight of 40 meters. I am not certain how much endurance she is going to be using when she takes her actions. The flight has half endurance cost built in, her strength has no such reduced endurance. I am pretty sure that if I do a passing strike, it will cost her 8 endurance, 5 for strength and 3 for flight (probably need to buy more endurance and recovery frankly). But what about the flying grab? Does she use strength to initiate the grab, or only if and when the grabbed one (assuming success) attempts to break out of the grab? Any advice on how to handle the endurance, as she's apparently going to be using a lot of it?

One stipulation about which I am adamant. Players can play reluctant heroes, they can play anti-heroes, but in the end they are heroes, they fight on the side of good to the best of their ability. I cannot and will not run a game in service to evil.