UltraRob

Re: WuXia Hero

Very cool. I just started a wuxia game myself' date=' and have been lamenting the lack of campaign support material on the web for it. I'll be referencing your site frequently. Thanks![/quote']

 

Not a problem, that's why it's there.

 

Is your game set in Old China or someplace else?

 

Rob

Re: WuXia Hero

So, given Plucky's writeup, I have been thinking...

Hard/Soft

Internal/External

Yin/Yang

How are these really different?

Hard MA are focused on direct application of force, Soft MA are focussed on redirection of force.

Well, internal techniques seem to affect the user, and obviously external techniques affect the outside world.

Yin and Yang are different kinds of energy, Yin in the feminine, the passive, whereas Yang is the masculine, the active.

So for example, a "Hard Internal Yin" technique would be one which physically affects the user's body and makes use of Yin energy. (ie Making your skin hard like Iron.)

A "Soft Internal Yin" technique would be one that affects the energy balance of the user's body by making use of outside Yin energy, and makes use of Yin energy. (ie Absorbing an opponent's Qi into your own reserves.)

A "Hard External Yang" technique would be one that uses Yang energy to affect the outside world in a direct way. (ie An armour piercing sword technique.)

A "Soft External Yang" technique would be one which redirects outside energy and uses Yang as the basis for it's manipulations. (ie Using the force of an opponents punch to slam them into a nearby wall.)

Okay, if this is true then I understand Hard/Soft and Internal/External better now. But, how would Yin/Yang fit into this? Do they act like Positive and Negative electricity? Do you have to use Yang to counter Yang and Yin to Counter Yin? Or do you need to use the opposite to cancel out the one being used? Is there some effects which only Yin energy could generate and some effects only Yang could generate?

Okay, the next question is how to apply this to a game, and should we apply this to the rules or just leave it as a special effect, a story element?

I think this is really up to the GM and how he wants to run his game, but for my own money I rather like simplicity, so I would probably just use it as a special effect and story element when making up the techniques and martial arts for the game. These seem mostly to be classifications rather than actual sources of techniques, whether a technique is hard/soft or internal/external has more to do with the focus of the power and style of the manipulation than the "source" of the power or way in which it's manipulated.

I suppose I could use them to limit the types of powers PCs could build...For example limiting the types of powers they could build based on their Martial Art's particular focus:

Hard External: Offensive attack powers. (ie Energy Blast, Killing Attacks, etc)

Soft External: Defensive powers using outside foci, Pressure Point techniques, Healing Techniques. (ie Force Fields and Missile Deflection using objects and clothes, Drains and Transformations (to simulate pressure point strikes), etc.)

Hard Internal: Qi powers which affect the user's body in a physical way. (ie Damage Resistance, Aids to physical stats, Self-Healing, Leaping and Running, etc)

Soft Internal: Qi powers that involve the energy balance of the user's body. (ie Aids to "energy" stats like STUN and END, Transfers, Flight, Life Support, etc.)

So, I suppose if players chose to study Shotokan Karate, which is a Hard External art, they would only be able to buy Qi Techniques which are offensive and external in nature because it's an Hard External martial art. If they want to buy a "Lightness of Breath Technique" to "fly" which is Soft Internal, they wouldn't be allowed to do it until they had mastered a Soft Internal martial art. (It's up to the GM to determine what "mastery" of a new Martial Art requires and means.)

Of course, some Martial Arts are both External and Internal, or Hard and Soft...So can you really classify them like this?

Any thoughts?

Rob

Re: I need serious help!!!

I see Michael Surbrook and myself aren't the only Hero gamers to have heard of the Hellsing anime series .

(and I only recognized the 'carrier' reference after reading Douglas Q. Sangnoir's Fuzion character sheet (he was Bob Schroeck's character in Warrior's World,a long-running V & V campaign).

Alucard is perhaps one of my favorite renditions of Dracula of all time, the series kinda petered out by the end but he was so damn cool that I never missed a moment. Let Buffy try and Slay HIM!

Actually, there's a Hellsing movie coming out soon, if you haven't heard. I hope it's a continuation of the series.

Rob

Re: I need serious help!!!

I wouldn't Link them. If doesn't make any difference if the Charges are different, but Linking them is like buying EB 6d6 and EB 6d6 Linked for only 50 points instead of buying one EB 12d6 for 60. You wouldn't allow this normally, and it shouldn't be applied here.

 

Other than that, this looks like a great way to go. This is assuming that you enchant the bullets already in the gun, and don't have a seperate set of enchanted rounds kept seperately from the rest.

Actually, I disagree, there is a very good reason they are linked, if the base rounds can't be fired, then the magical rounds can't be fired either. Therefore the "booster" rounds should be linked to the primary rounds, and get a cost break accordingly. He's not getting a 12D6 EB, he's getting (to use your example combined with his...) 6 6D6 EB's and 7 12D6 EB's, which is definitely a limitation if I ever saw one.

Although I can see why some GMs such as yourself might not consider it a significant enough limitation to be worth a cost break. Personal taste I guess.

Rob

Re: WuXia Hero

Oh I thought everyone was bored with that story already! Yup!

 

They, along with several low-powered supers, fought the Justice Squad in actual battle only once - to a draw. They are one of the few opponents to just walk away from the JS in battle, having stalemated them through a hostage (DNPC) situation.

Nifty! I love it when Supers get bested or equalled by normals...shows them that powers aren't everything!

Thanks for the info!

Rob

Re: WuXia Hero

I like the sight. A few things on the translations (caveat, Mandarin it's a very fluid language with many dialects, my translations come from either the my study of formal mandarin, or my Sifu's knowledge of Taiwanese Mandarin):

 

Qi, can also mean Breath. The Japanese is ussually Ki. Chi is mispelled pinyin (the phonotic mandarin writing).

Dang it! You're right! That's what I get for tossing my "words list" on as an after thought at 2am because I thought there should be one.

Gong Fu, Is ussually translated as "hard work", "Repition" or "skill aquired through much effort".

Hmm, I have always been fond of the translation "hard skill" myself, since it tends to refer to skills which are hard to learn period. But, I agree with your translations too.

Qi Gong, is often translated as Breat work, there is also Body gong but for the life of me the wod for body escapes me (also known as Iron Qi Gong).

 

WuXia, often is translated as Knight Errant. Xia (in pinyin) would be pronouced shee-ah.

Good point, I should change that. Actually, I have reached the point of disatisfaction with translating "WuXia" that I prefer to use it as a term unto itself. Just like Samurai is "Samurai", and Knight is "Knight", I think WuXia should simply be "WuXia". There simply isn't a proper translation for them that I have heard and liked to date.

Woe love the stuff you wrote about QiGong and the Stances. Interesting fact, I've aften toyed W/the idea of giving forms W/low stances (northern Kung Fu, Shotokan Karate) a Dcv bonus. THese low stances are used to compress the bodies vital areas and to make you harder to hit. I'm however leaning towards the just making a PC buy a DCV level in this case though.

Hmm, would those be a DCV bonus only when the attacker is trying to hit certain areas? Or in general? Probably best to just let them buy a bonus level or two, since simple is usually best.

Hey, if you want to write up your thoughts on the subject, feel free to submit them to my site. I'd love to include some thoughts from a real Gong Fu practitioner since I am afraid my knowledge of martial arts is pretty much all theory and observation.

Thanks for the comments! I'll work on my glossary when I get the chance! You're right, it does need some fine tuning. :-P

Rob

Re: WuXia Hero

It's a very soft weapon, very little actual blocking, lots of parrying by simple avoiding the opponents force, if you ever see someone block with there edge though smack them. When weapon contact is required (usually to angle the other weapon away) always use the flat of the blade, else you'll lose your edge.

 

It can be used to slice but rarely in an arching manner. Such cutts are more often the result in flicks of the rist, it's trueist strength is thrusting, piercing organs and causing internal bleeding. THough I've seen some techniques with it in my school (a traditional Kung Fu school) that have the wielder slice in large circles.

Hmm...Interesting. That is what I suspected after watching people use them in movies and TV (including a few documentaries)...That makes perfect sense, though, they were practicing anti-armour techniques and ones that resulted in quick kills in what they saw as the most efficient manner.

It's a fast weapon though, really fast. When we practice parrying weapons with our barehands it is by and far the most difficult weapon to circumvent.

For gaming, this is one of the key things to keep in mind...I will remember this! Thank you! ^__^

Rob

Re: Character creation problems solved

I don't know if I want the players in my campaign making characters with 40 STR, which I can see happening with no NCM. That's not very realistic to me. But I guess it could work if you raise the characteristic maxima within reason.

When I tired to run a FH campaign on Champions level points (150+100) and no NCM, I ended up with exactly that...characters that weren't even remotely human, and were more or less demi-gods/superheros. Including a dude(tte) with STR:40...So I hear where you're coming from. No sir, I didn't like it at all. (and now only run FH at 75+50)

Actually a more practical solution to your problem really might be making most of the NCM Stats max out at 25 or 30 instead of 20, which is something I never thought of before, but in conjuction with 125 or 150pt characters might actually work quite well. They will have greater levels of potential, but still be at a "human" level for the most part.

I do however like the idea of emphasizing and rewarding other talents/abilities not combat related through the campaign. Although my campaign is very action/combat oriented, I will put my efforts toward doing this more. Thank you all for the feedback, I appreciate constructive criticism.

Actually, if the HEROs here recall, what you have done is institute what the Rolemaster RPG called the "potential stat" system. In Rolemaster you rolled twice for all your stats, the first roll was your current stat, and the second roll was how far you could go through experience, since everyone has different peaks and valleys in their natural abilities and how far they could push them. Worked well in Rolemaster.

Rob

Re: I need serious help!!!

Sound like an old V&V player there...

V&V...Err....I know not of what you speak...

heh heh

Tell ya a funny story, long ago in High School I played with a group and V&V was their favorite game, and for me it was love at first sight. But, when I went to the local hobby shops, they didn't have any copies of Villains and Vigilantes at all! All they had was this game called Champions I had never heard of....(3rd Ed. to be precise)...So, rather than wait until they ordered a copy of V&V for me, I figured this game was just as good and bought it...

Untold numbers of years later....Here I am still playing HERO.

Mind you, and this is between you, me and the rest of humanity...I did eventually get a copy of V&V, and it remains one of my favorite Superhero games to this day. (I have every module released but one!) I even pull it out from time to time for one-shots with whatever group I am running for...I campaign with HERO, but I still play V&V.

Rob

Re: I need serious help!!!

Once again' date=' Herodom restores my faith in the universe. Thank you very much guys! As for Digital Golem's suggestion, I do plan to turn it into a multipower later. Unfortunately I don't have $80.00 to spend on a Core Rulebook (I've been using my friend's. I was like "If you want a GM, you let me use the book!" ) and Herodesigner software. Yet. Rob, you are a Godsend! I can't beleive I didn't think of the linked thing sooner. Thanks guys.[/quote']

 

Not a problem.

 

I never thought of the linked thing either until I saw it done in one of the old Enemies books, and realized how simple it was to do tricks like that.

 

Now you can do any kind of "carrier" attack as well, like an Energy Blast with a linked Entangle, or even I suppose things like a Force Field with a trigger for a linked Flash Attack on it when someone tries to shoot you. (Although you might want to warn your fellow PCs about this, before you blind EVERYONE...Or not... )

 

Rob

Re: WuXia Hero

Yeah, but the women are spectacular! Great eye candy.

Oh heck yeah! Best looking girls of any Chinese TV series, ever! Actually, I heard one of them, I think it's Duan Yu's sister, is actually Chinese-American, California born and raised. Love to meet her on the street!

I can make myself understood in Mandarin, but not well enough to understand what they're saying without some help. I have about 1.5 character points spent in Mandarin. Not quite enough.

Heh. I have about 1pt spent in my myself, but I keep trying! Sounds like I'm a little bit behind you, enough to get myself into trouble, but not understand a word of the consequences!

Rob

Re: WuXia Hero

I'm not a martial arts sort of guy, but I have been gradually incorporating more elements as there are certainly cool things about martial arts - and particularly wuxia stuff. I will be revisiting this wesite in the very near future for more details, I'm sure, I just did a very brief scan and I'm impressed. I have a Chinese superheroine (or supervillainess if you're anti-communist!) NPC, China Left, and this will help me refine her. It will also help as I have a woman in Fox Force Five who has Wuxia elements and she'll be coming back and this will for her, too. Thank you so much! This is really good for people like me who aren't knowledgably much on this.

 

EDIT/PS, dang, no more rep to give today. catch this one later...

Not a problem. You actually have Fox Force Five as a villian group?

Rob

Re: I need serious help!!!

I suggest simply you build your gun, then create a separate "booster" power linked to it that only has 7 charges.

ie

Power One: 3D6 RKA, OAF(Gun), 16 Charges.

Power Two: +2D6 RKA, OAF(Gun), Linked to Power 1, 7 Charges.

So we have a Gun that normally does 3D6 RKA and can fire 16 shots, but up to 7 times a Day it can do 5D6.

Multipowers aren't necessary unless you want to have more than one type of base bullet.

You can do the math for costs.

Rob

Re: WuXia Hero

She calls it the Sword and the Exquisiteness. She's currently working on the Legendary Twins.

Thanks! On it!

The novel is great. You catch lots of details that the anime simply can't capture. However, the anime is great eye candy. One series that you may have missed is Demigods and Semidevils. 5 episodes have been released by a group called Whe.

Under the title "The Warring States of Legends", I know.

I showed the first 15 mins of the 1st episode of DGSD 2003 to my gaming group last session while waiting for a late player. When they realized they weren't looking at matte scenery shots, their jaws hit the floor! Then their eyes bugged out as they were watching the action scenes and I reminded them this is a 40 episode TV series.

As my one player put it..."We can't compete with THIS!!?!"

Well what do you expect when they start making action TV series in China with our movie level of quality at 1/10th the production costs and the support of the Chinese government. :-P

Although as it goes on, I wish they hadn't trimmed out so much story in favor of fight scenes. :-/

He's awesome. I just wish my Chinese was good enough so that I didn't need a translator.

Indeed mi amigo. Indeed.

I'm a year or so away from being conversational in Mandarin, but as for reading and writing...

Rob

Re: Darts

Use Hit Locations and Partial Armor Coverage.

 

Wimpy darts really shouldn't penetrate decent armor, but armor is rarely worn all over; let it hurt in the soft unprotected spots.

 

There was a thread recently that gave a lot of good reasons for people to not wear armor as much (and IIRC it was specifically for a Chinese setting).

 

(rant)

FWIW, it's little attacks like these that I dont' allow "Combat Luck" as rDEF, If that is why your PCs have rPD I'd recommend using "Damage Reduction" instead of "Armor" for "Combat Luck" so that they still take a minimum of 1 point of damage.

(/rant)

Yeah, "combat luck" as written is a real pain in the a**, players either want it to stack with armour or treat it as their excuse to be invulnerble to low-powered weapons like darts and knives.

I can't help but think "combat luck" should be more like bonus DCV with an activation roll that they get when they're not wearing armour. After all, if you're lucky, you don't get hit at all!

Actually, something just occured to me as I wrote this...Would making darts an NND(Not vs Armour 2rPD or greater) which do 1D6 STUN each work? Then they would have an "ouch" factor, but not do real damage, just cause pain. Any poisons would be a carrier attack on the darts.

Hmm, I may have just answered my own question...:-P

Rob

Re: WuXia Hero

I've read pretty much all their translations. Athena has actually completely translated an entire Gu Long novel there. I'm hoping that when summer arrives, the translators will continue and finish a couple more.

Really? Which novel did she complete? You're not talking about the 1st Lu XiaoFeng novel, are you?

Also, the d-addicts site has already fansubbed 28 episodes of Duke of Mount Deer. And they release these suckers pretty quickly.

 

If you like ROCH, Live Evil has released 22 episodes of the anime. It follows the story fairly closely until they hit Passion Valley. They've done a great job with it.

Got all of the above. ^_-

D-Addicts isn't subbing those Duke episodes, though, they're capturing them off Singaporean TV, where Chinese shows air in Mandarin on TV with English subs. (Nice place to live! )

As for the ROCH anime, I have to say I like the novel a lot better...I am enjoying the anime (just watched 21+22 yesterday, in fact!) but I find it just doesn't have the same vibrant feel that the novel has. Still, it's cool to see, and not a bad way to hook people on WuXia stuff.

I just wish someone would finish translating Condor Heros the first series! I would have rather read them in that order instead of reading the sequel first! Although the sequel is damn cool! ^__^

I actually just ordered "Fox Volant of the Snowy Mountains" this afternoon from an online bookstore, one of only three Jin Yong novels available officially in English. Cost me $35, but I've never read anything he wrote that I didn't love, the man is a genius!

Rob

Re: WuXia Hero

UltraRob' date=' are you a member of SPCnet? I love that site. [/quote']

 

My Monkey Genius friend, that is one of my most favorite sites on the Internet since I discovered it! Mollelion and the others who devote their time to translating WuXia novels for us are saints! ^__^

 

Do you read any of their translations? I read Return of the Condor Heros and The Adventures of Lu XiaoFeng.

 

Rob

Now, as some of you may or may not know, in Chinese fantasy Darts, Needles and throwing blades are a big deal. Usually thrown in 3's, they are used as distractions, warnings, and often to carry drugs or poisons to the target.

And so far in my HERO experience, have proven to be utterly useless. Which is why I'm asking to see if anyone else has good ideas about how to handle them in HERO.

Usually the PCs have a couple points of rPD (Darts aren't going to do more than 1pip of BODY after all.) and don't seem able to do enough stun to be noticed or even make the target say "ouch".

And, of course they have to penetrate the skin before any drugs or poisons will take effect, so that kills that angle too.

About the only thing I have thought of is to declare them all penetrating (or made so by use of a little Qi boost), but that does make them pretty dangerous. Up to 3 body from a single salvo of darts seems a little much, don't you think?

Rob

Re: WuXia Hero

Looks cool...I'm guessing that you are useing hard/soft instead of internal/external? I've always included both sets of concepts as in my fevered mind they are differant. Please let us know how things are going....

Thanks, but in my own research I have found that hard/soft and external/internal seem to be used interchangably. I make no claims to be an expert, but I always thought that "hard" martial arts were focussed on outward expressions and development of Qi, whereas "soft" martial arts tended to emphasize internal focus and development of Qi. (There is even an article about my thoughts on it on my site under The WuXia Campaign.)

If this is incorrect, someone is welcome to correct me, I would be curious to know how they are different.

Rob

Re: WuXia Hero

I agree. One of my taekwondo teachers was showing me some stuff with the jian' date=' which I liked. He does Iaido too.[/quote']

 

Am I right in my assumption the Jian was a pointed weapon mostly used for impaling attacks? The Jian I have seen in movies and TV don't seem to have much of a blade on them.

 

Rob

Re: WuXia Hero

I like! I just bookmarked your site. Want a free plug? I was in a discussion about this kind of topic on the WOTC boards. Who knows' date=' we could gain a few converts.[/quote']

 

Thanks.

 

Go right ahead! The more people we can get turned on to this awesome genre the better! Everyone knows about Japanese fantasy/swordplay, but the Chinese stuff is just as cool, and has a different feel to it than the Japanese. Japanese stuff is so serious, whereas Chinese stuff is more romantic and over the top.

 

 

Rob

Re: WuXia Hero

Looks good, looks like a bunch of research was done.

 

If I weren't sure that some of those I play with wouldn't destroy the entire concept in three milliseconds I'd try it out

Thank you kindly.

This is just the start of the page, I plan to keep expanding it and putting up articles as time allows...I really want to put up articles on Chinese culture and of course lists of Qi Techniques, Funky Weapons and Characters.

UltraRob

Hi All,

I just finished the core version of a page set up for my own WuXia (Chinese Fantasy) HERO campaign, and about Chinese WuXia gaming in general. If you're interested drop on by at:

http://www.geocities.com/rpatersonca/WuxiaHeroIndex.html

Questions and Comments are of course welcome.

UltraRob

Hi All,

I just finished the core version of a page set up for my own WuXia (Chinese Fantasy) HERO campaign, and about Chinese WuXia gaming in general. If you're interested drop on by at:

http://www.geocities.com/rpatersonca/WuxiaHeroIndex.html

Questions and Comments are of course welcome.

UltraRob

Re: How do you get players to role play the genre?

on previous posts i advocated a spend XP for result type system, but was convinced otherwise due to the fact Combat Heavy characters, your frontline heroes, are always going to spend there XP compared to the Utility useful NC characters hence causing a imbalance. ( I Fight, and fight and fight no XP. I searched out the Vilains base and avoided all combat 4XP. )

 

i have to say i found his arguments persuasive, even though i was of the spend xp camp initially.

This is one of the areas where I think the GM has to secretly keep an eye on balance...if characters spend XP creatively, then I tend to make sure they get some of it back...in fact as one of my players pointed out...in my games players who Spend XP end up doing better in the long run. I reward agressive, active play (whether in combat or not), and tend to give fewer points to people who just sit there. (They did nothing, they get nothing.) In fact I would say about 1/2 the XPs spent in this fashion in my games are spent outside of combat anyways, but we do a lot of serious roleplaying between the fights.

I can see your point, and how this would happen if your Noncoms aren't taking many risks and your Coms are spending the points like water...In this case I might put a spending point cap on things...say 2 per game....So the Coms aren't screwing themselves out of their own Enthusiasm...I guess the other point is why you are letting them do this...And what kind of game you want it to be...I did it to encourage action and creativity, and it worked pretty well with my group....But when there's a fight there are no noncoms in my group!...Everyone wants a piece of the action in some way.

UltraRob