gojira

Re: [New Product] Champions Complete

Just to toss in my two nickels here again, I hope the first thing HG produces is some PDF adventures to support Champs Complete. Any new player would like to have something to *do* with their new game, I'd guess, so a couple of extra products would help then and hopefully make a few bucks for HG.

Thinking about this more: since CC now omits a lot of examples and advice, I think perhaps it might be useful to make initial PDF adventures like these pedagogical. That is add some of the advice on running games and building characters that was omitted from CC into a few initial PDF adventures. Don't go over board; the idea is to pace the information and not flood them with details. Folks who demo games would know more than me how to do that, but starting out with useful bits of advice, taken in smaller doses, might be truly appreciated by new customers and older returning customers alike.

Re: [New Product] Champions Complete

But it sure would be nice to see CC sitting right beside a selection of adventures for Champions. A retailer could put this together quite nicely with third party scenarios (Balabanto's come to mind).

I was actually thinking more of the PDF variety. Cheaper to make, easier to sell. Even just an update to a 5th ed. adventure would help. Any brand new customers would appreciate it. I think you have to develop a line, or folks will just stop checking for more product. (Again, an opinion from someone who doesn't actually work in the industry. )

Re: There shall soar... the surfer girl!

Check the free stuff section of the main website (under resources). I believe there's several homemade spreadsheets that will mimic the basic functions of Hero Designer. At least it does the addition for you, and provides some formatting. If you don't have access to a spreadsheet, Open Office reads all the Excel formats I've come across.

Re: [New Product] Champions Complete

I am not looking forward to revisting the days of 1st edition Fantasy Hero and Danger International. Where I am paying for page count of stuff that will be basically copied word for word from the Champions rules. Worse yet would be where the decision would be to limit the Genre Chapter's pagecount to keep the book price down (ie just like the early days of hero).

To be honest, I rather agree. What I think might mitigate this is:

1) More customization of the rules, per genre. If Fantasy Hero Complete is just a copy-paste of the rules, that's bad. If there's a lot of tweaks, pre-built powers, and special ways of handling things just for fantasy, that's better. At least I'd feel like I'd be getting something more for my money (and page count).

2) Not too many rulebooks. I could see adding Fantasy Hero Complete, and Action Hero Complete. (The latter being my turn of phrase for a modern campaign book.) Action Hero Complete would handle Modern, Pulp, Cyberpunk, Hong Kong Action Films, Post Apocalyptic, Western, possibly Urban Fantasy, Anime and perhaps Space Opera as well. (I'm not really a huge enough fan of SciFi, say of the Star Trek genre, to go for a rulebook just for that.)

I *think* you could market that successfully. Buy one rule book that most matches your interests, and then you have a very large number of genre books and source books that support that one rule book. And three rulebooks is not so many that it causes customer confusion. Supers, Modern, Fantasy; that seems easy to grasp, and a smaller number of core rules reduces the "I'm always buying the same rules" issue.

I'll add too that, while my paycheck doesn't depend on anything here being correct, I see other companies publish core rule books as loss-leaders. Then they make their money on shorter, faster supplements. And the market seems to want that. Large stodgy books full of minutea don't really do it for me either. This goes for both rulebooks as well as supplements.

And I hope that Hero Games has plans to make sure Champions Complete is well supported. A couple of adventures right off the bat for early buyers would help a lot, methinks.

Re: [New Product] Champions Complete

I like CC as an abbreviation. Easier to type than adding in the superscript numeral.

Also, for computer geeks, "cc" is the "compile C" command. Much beloved by *nix command line freaks.

Re: [New Product] Champions Complete

I'll almost certainly purchase Champs Complete too, mostly out of loyalty but also because I should put my money where my complaining mouth has been.

I think I'd like to see a Fantasy Complete and a Pulp/Modern Complete book. I could see how examples tailored to a particular setting would help a lot (and I mean A LOT) of people. I think folks who aren't into superheroes would rather by a complete rule set tailored to their needs.

After a small number of complete rule books though, I think I'd like to see HG switch to a supplement approach. Thus, if say The Valdorian Age is ever updated to 6e, it should be a supplement to Fantasy Complete, not a "complete" book in it's own right. Then the fantasy mavens would be happy -- they have a complete rules book just for them, and other fantasy books from Hero Games don't repeat those special fantasy rules. (Although obviously a supplement could have rule enhancements, changes, or other alterations specific to that book or sub-genre.)

Ditto for Champions and say a Modern complete book. Once those "complete" rule books are out, don't make the customer re-purchase the rules for that genre. Always refer back to the relevant complete rule book for that genre.

However, I could see a generic book being published eventually. It would be helpful to those who are getting into the system later, and might also help HG publish some more niche products that did merit a "complete" book by itself. A few completists might also want an all-in-one book. But I think the idea of publishing "complete" books is still the way to go. Hero Games should be a game company, not a rule book company. That's a subtle distinction, but an important one I believe.

Re: [New Product] Champions Complete

For me personally, I prefer colour art. However, I can appreciate the economic realities too....

Just to provide a counterpoint: while I would personally agree that colour and glossy pages are better, as I look at my bookshelf, there is not one color book by Hero Games. So the color art wasn't enough to move me to buy. Also, I have very few color game books in general. The only one I can think of off the top of my head is Castle Falkenstein.

So while color is nice, personally I have to say it doesn't sell me on a game book.

Re: [New Product] Champions Complete

I get that you disagree with what I am posting but I will say this as politlely as I can knock it off.

I think it's fair to point out in return that 90% or more of the posters are saying the exact opposite of what you are saying. So your apprehensions appear to be greatly misplaced, at least, if not wholly fabricated out of your imagination. People have a right to post, sure. But you also have a right be be criticized, even taken out to the woodshed if you post things that enough folks consider silly. And your mopey doom-and-gloom is really quite silly.

Re: [New Product] Champions Complete

Cosmic both as in strange space-based stuff as well as power level.

 

Everyone involved will be experienced roleplayers, and I am an experienced GM, but most of us are pretty new to the HERO system.

I think that perhaps the best would be to get the new Champs Complete and one other book if it seems to fit well. Then start a thread in the Champions forum and ask for help. I'm focusing on the "we're all new to Hero" part and going cosmic as your first game might be a fair amount of work. Also "strange space" stuff doesn't immediately bring anything to mind, but Hero System excels at tool-kiting, so making new material shouldn't be a problem.

I also think we are getting a bit off topic from Champions Complete announcement. Time for a new thread about Claire's Cosmic and Strange Champions Campaign?

Hey all, for a long time, there were some sample pages of various 6e products available here. Well I don't see them, and I don't see them in the Free Stuff section either. Mainly I was interested in the sample character generator for the brick from the Champions 6e book.

Did I miss them? Could someone provide a link? Or is that now forbidden?

Re: [New Product] Champions Complete

I don't know exactly what a "Power Profile" is, but a rogues gallery of builds for say $3 to $5 would get my attention. Obviously, wait to see how the new product does, etc., but just thinking out loud, that would be something I'd probably personally consider "bang for the buck."

Re: [New Product] Champions Complete

Does that mean Naked Advantage is the exact opposite of Overall Levels?

*groan*

Re: [New Product] Champions Complete

Ah, ok, it's a third party service. Interesting....

Re: [New Product] Champions Complete

I'm just curious (and this is probably a question for Jason), how will the bit about "all brick-and-mortar sales get a free PDF too" work?

Coupon in the book? Serial code? Black magic? Honor system?

Re: Hero System Sixth Edition Concise

Oh.

HERO System 6^th Edition

978-1-58366-145-1

HERO2000

Author: Derek Hiemforth

Someone has been busy. I thought you'd been showing up around here less lately.

Re: Hero System Sixth Edition Concise

OK, nice. I've resisted picking up both the 6e rule books and 6e Champions (mostly owing to lack of current gaming), so this is a definite possibility to see how that book works.

Re: Ars Tactica

Just for the heck of it, I'll post about something besides Grabs/Squeezes. (Maverick!)

Is this legal? Two hand-to-hand combatants are in a melee with each other. One wants to strike his opponent and move away. So s/he declares a Move-By, makes an attack and moves elsewhere on the game map.

I'd rule that there's no damage bonus for velocity/movement (acceleration rules say you're not really moving (much?) until after the first hex). And there's a -2 OCV and -2 DCV for the whole maneuver regardless. Plus also strength bonuses are halved. Pretty brutal, but still legal?

Re: Interesting article about Sexism in Geek Communities

I had to get away from gamer culture

Yes. We're all geeks here, and I think to some degree we've all experienced this. I'd bet we've all had a little harder time than average being socialized to cultural norms.

I was going to suggest something like this, that one solution might be to get some of those geeks away from the gaming table where they can get a little experience at things besides gaming. Probably grandiose, but if it could be done I think it would actually help at least some folks.

Re: Interesting article about Sexism in Geek Communities

/derail

So what should we do about all of this.

 

Make sure that we start to make noise about this. Making sure that people know that this kind of stuff isn't acceptable. Perhaps then some of you nice guys will shut down the jerks (when we don't do it ourselves). Speaking up on forums like Reddit, RPG.net etc and telling the jerks there that acting that way isn't acceptable. If there are enough people shaming the jerks they will at least stop posting their bile, and perhaps make some of them think.

 

Not only not buying models that we find offensive, but also writing letters (emails) to the companies/ studios that make such figures telling them why we aren't buying their stuff. Respectfully asking for and then buying models that are good expressions of a strong female wearing clothing that makes sense.

I have a small problem with this in that I'm not actively gaming right now. Sure, I'd do it if there were an active FLGS or company I purchase from regularly, but Hero Games is the only store I buy from right now, and I don't think they have the problems you are describing.

I'd consider writing an email to a miniatures company saying "I won't by your sexist minis!!" but I'd feel bad about it, consider I'm not buying their minis regardless. Ditto for brink and mortar stores; I don't actually frequent any enough to have any real "pull" there. Actually I don't buy from any brick and mortar stores at all right now.

RPG.net... I tend to avoid. (I do have a decently high post count there, because of an ongoing thread about Girl Genius in the "other" section.) Reddit, I don't use at all.

Oh right, that's what I wanted to talk about.

You know, one of the best counters for sexism in the mainstream, imo, is the internet. Particularly how it gives unfiltered access to creators. I've found a lot of nice, woman drawn, non-sexist comics being produced on the internet. I don't read those comic because they're non-sexist, I read them because they're well done, well drawn, fresh and insightful alternates to 90% of the drek that the mass media produces.

So for now I'll just promote some distinctly non-sexist products.

College Roomeis from Hell -- one of the first comics I started reading online. I noticed something was "up" in the perspective of the comic right away. This was one of the comics that really opened my eye to how sexist many comics are, simply because it wasn't that way. The differences are subtle, but consistent, and add up to a strong contender for feminist, gender egalitarian comic.

The Zombie Hunters -- again, drawn and plotted by a woman. Super amazing artwork. (Hint: someone please hire this woman.) Several strong, prominent female characters. The protagonist is in fact female. Her two friends are both "sexy" but also keep their clothes on at all times, and have strong character development and skills the have nothing to do with their gender. (None, for example, are "sultry sirens" or thief-type characters.) No female character is ever "put in a refrigerator," in spite of numerous opportunities while fighting zombies; all characters remain resourceful and in control even "in the end."

Fey Winds -- another character comic drawn by a young woman. This is a really excellent fantasy. And it's a "young girl's fantasy" too. The main character is a half-fox girl, who is very pretty and wears clothing about the size of a postage stamp. Nevertheless, the comic avoids any sexist tropes, and the main character always stays in charge of herself and her destiny. She can be a ditz in social situations (one reason I call this a young girl's fantasy; the main character seems to reflect some insecurities of young people) but when her friends are in danger she goes all badass and prevails to save her friends. In addition, all the males in the strip are in love with her, yet she remains in control in social situations as well. Never is there even really a hint that she might be in danger from any other character. Even in fight scenes with the villains in the strip, there's always a sense she'll pull through.

Girl Genius -- kind of obvious really. Written in part by Kaja Foglio, Phil's wife. Fun, very adventurous romp through fantasy 19th century Europe. Agatha is not only smart but an active inventor, and never over shadowed by other male protagonists in the strip. Great comic overall.

So I'd like to promote these as examples other people can learn from. If you're trying to plot out your next fantasy adventure, and you'd like good examples on non-sexist writing, read through these strips' archives. It'll help you out immensely.

OK, wrote a Russian novel here. Back to you guys.

Re: Interesting article about Sexism in Geek Communities

Ok

 

Out in the lands of Warhammer 40k there has also been a discussion of sexism in the wargaming circles (which is frankly far worse than it is in RPG circles). Also, the discussion has moved toward the subject of "Sexy Models" ie miniatures that depict people but mostly women in a sexualized fashion. Thanks to the popularity of www.Coolminiornot.com there has been an explosion of companies that offer nearly pornographic nude models. There has always been a trickle of intensely sexualized female models from nearly all companies that make miniatures. Lately there has been an explosion of these kind of figurines. I see this discussion as being akin to discussions here about the Depictions of Women in RPG artwork.

 

it started with this review of models (Warning Nekked and partially nekked painted and unpainted figuring might not be safe for work). The comments are where it all began:

http://www.houseofpaincakes.com/2012/06/sexy-models-need-i-say-more.html#idc-container

 

Then a ton of blogs commented on their own sites.

http://warpsignal.wordpress.com/2012/06/25/the-other-sexy-models/

http://www.tentakelgames.com/post/25494912136/sexism-and-miniatures

kind of wraps up here with a ton of links to other blogs that talk about the miniatures and the way women are treated at gaming places.

http://warpsignal.wordpress.com/2012/07/13/sexism-in-gaming-art-final-words/

 

Enjoy

I wanted to toss out some quick thoughts on this.

1. First, I totally agree that the models depicted there with greatly exaggerated physical characteristics, and the fetish inspired models, are pretty darn (i.e., blatantly) sexist, if not misogynistic.

2. On the other hand, I didn't find many of the other nudes to be offensive. Maybe I'm wrong, but it naked people aren't bad.

3. The above point is aside from the characters where partial nudity was inappropriate. The female western figure with her blouse completely open for no reason other than to show off her brazier was pretty gratuitous.

4. Never the less I do notice that there were no equivalent male nudes. It seems unfair or unbalanced somehow.

5. Thinking about the culture of art for a moment, I do think there are a lot more depictions of nude females in the art world, and have been for hundreds of years. I don't want to make excuses, but a trained sculptor who makes these models might be biased towards female nudes by training. I'm still not excepting the obvious "not proportional anime characters" from that, nor the fetish wear.

6. Even so I notice more male nudes in classical art than I see depicted in models on those pages, so yes the hobby is still biased more than western culture in general.

7. Overall those links appear to support your claim of bias toward sexism in the gaming hobbies. I agree you've made a convincing point.

I'm not sure what comes next. Raising consciousness like you are doing is a good start. I'm not sure what more could be done however. Women owned business and women owned stores to cater to women and create a "critical mass" of consumers so that rest of the industry? I don't know if that's practical. But it seems like women get into the hobby, they see what it actually entails, and they get back out. There's never enough critical mass of consumers at any time to change things.

Re: Interesting article about Sexism in Geek Communities

In the funny coincidence department, Sinfest has been on an anti-sexism tear lately.

Re: Posted 27 Items From My 3 Year Fantasy Hero Campaign On My Site

BTW those are nice illustrations in the Spirit Storm main PDF. Who did those?

Re: Acquitaine [PDF] now available.

OK, an example illustration probably isn't helpful, skip this post.

Re: Acquitaine [PDF] now available.

This is rather off topic, but maybe the group could indulge me briefly (I'll try to be brief). Does anyone know the copyright rules on hand tracing or light box (literally shining a light under an image to make it easier to trace) an image? Because I thought that was legal for nearly any image. I'm thinking primarily of the Dover clip art books where Dover publishes copyright free material. Dover cleans those images up and therefore protects the image itself, but if the image is 200+ years old, they can't protect a hand drawing of the same thing, right?

Obviously, this doesn't apply to trademarks (so no tracings of Superman), or trade dress or "look and feel" sort of stuff. I realize some images are grey area. But in general I was just wondering for similar projects like Acquitaine what would be permissible.

OK if this is too far off topic let me know, I'll delete it and post it elsewhere...

Re: Interesting article about Sexism in Geek Communities

Well someone had to go there I guess.