iamlibertarian

Thanks, in my head I had it in the Sight group, lol, so will add that. As for the Focus, I meant that to be IAF glasses. As for the roll, I forgot to switch it to Skill roll (Sorcery). Basically I was glancing through Ultimate Mystic and had this cool picture in my head of how to tailor it to my character. Basically I am trying to use the Ultimate Mystic version as a base, convert it to 6E, tailor it to my character, and have it be a kind of "Sherlock Holmes glance across the room and gather a lot of info in a short time, but mystically boosted," kind of thing. i want it to remain inobvious, but have no problem with perceptive people getting the creeps for being stared at...hard... and having them react in whichever way is normal for them. I will make the changes you suggest for the reasons you suggest. Thanks again!

Ultimate Mystic 115. How would you convert that to 6E? Here is what I have so far: Know Personal Information: Detect A Large Class Of Things 9- (Unusual Group), Discriminatory, Analyze, Range, Rapid: x10 (28 Active Points); Concentration, Must Concentrate throughout use of Constant Power (1/2 DCV; -1/2), Extra Time (Full Phase, -1/2), Requires A Roll (11- roll; -1/2), Costs Endurance (Only Costs END to Activate; -1/4), IIF (-1/4), Gestures (-1/4), Incantations (-1/4) With notes: Ultimate Mystic 115. From across the room or face-face, the character can spend a moment (Phase) observing the person's actions, hear the person's speech, etc. to determine much about them. Real name or names they frequently use, occupation, where they live, other commonplace info. Thanks! DC

I am not sure why Detects (and other sensing powers) should not be allowed in Power Frameworks? Is it simply a Game Balance issue? It seems strange to me that Gil the Gadgeteer cannot have goggles (Multipower) with some Detects, Perception Enhancers, Radar, some Sense Modifiers, Maybe a Mind Scan (Scan for active minds), etc. If it truly is just game balance, ok. Though I am not sure how that would throw off the balance either.

Thanks Lucius, I think you already answered that for me in a previous response, and that it is finally beginning to sink into my head through my thick skull, lol.

Thanks! I have lots to absorb, but to respond to some of it right away: *If* (lol) you think in terms of D&D, priests pray for a relative few minutes a day and get their spells back right away. It is a -semi- common thread in fantasy in some like manner this happens, even if we don't all run it that way in a game. Gadgeteers make gadgets which can be taken away, yet. Potions can be taken away in the same manner, so should have the same limitation Mechanics for the same limitation Values, imho. Versatility of Magic VPPs compared to versatility of Gadget VPPs. The Gadgeteers I have played with are often more imaginative that the Mages I have played with, lol. They tend to get even more creative and versatile than the Mage players. But this is just My experience. Plugging into a wall socket for charging: I was only comparing the mechanics of different types of characters. Priest whose spells just Mystically reappear the next day, vs having gadgets which must be charged in a wall socket, vs a full re-brewing/casting of a magical potion: None is better or worse than the other, but the more limiting (more effort/time), is already handled by the system by costing fewer Real points for putting in more effort. Naturally recharging Priest spells, vs Gadgeteer having to plug in at a specific location, vs. Mage having to spend time/effort/materials to brew a potion, with the Potion being more limiting and therefor less expensive. As for VPP and switching, example Gadgeteer switching to a different gun with remaining charges: The easier you can switch powers, the easier you can switch, either the cost is significantly greater (leaving fewer points to spend elsewhere on your character) or the max level of the powers is significantly decreased (less to spend on Control Cost), again creating balance. But I can see where such would Not be appropriate for a Fantasy game but is common in a Supers game. A character buying a "Spell" as a separate power with Variable Advantage can afford to build said power with a higher, well, lets use DC for this example, than can a character with a Multipower, and a Multipower more than one who builds a VPP with its Control Cost being even more expensive. VPPs allow for more flexibility, but at a higher cost and lower max DC than a stand alone power. That brings balance in my mind. Example: Bruiser the Brick spends almost all of his power in STR and related advantages, and can maybe afford a 20D6 punch with the usual armor penetrating advantages, and high PD/ED resistant protection. But Gil Gadgetmaker with a gadget Multipower can afford only a 15D6 Blast and medium level PD/ED force field, but can also see through walls and detect/target some things with Radar, and has a cool car with special abilities. A little more flexible but with less max power than the Brick. Compared to Max the Mystic and his VPP, The VPP can only hold a 10D6 Magic Blast and lower PD/ED, but can have much greater flexibility than the Brick, but have many more lower powered things Max can do. Even then, it depends on the Type of game you are looking to play/run. Even Fantasy has a huge difference, if you compare High Fantasy to Low Fantasy, and Heroic Supers to Superheroic. I would expect a Doctor Strange to be able to do just about anything, including clever ways to either get away from say, a Thor type or to trip up or confound a Hulk type. But if Thor ever did manage to get a full-powered hit on Doctor Strange, the good Doctor would be a red mush after just one hit. And if Doctor Strange got one of his ED Blasts off on Hulk, Hulk would just shrug it off (and get more angry, lol). It all seems very balancing to me. Charges which never recover vs recover in limited circumstances (Restricted Recovery): (6E 372) Picking up a knife after a battle (out of combat) but only takes a few seconds or minutes to recover and can be ready for the next battle. More expensive but more flexible. Never recover, "a Charge might be broken or lost, in which case it must be recreated like normal Charges." Such as a scroll with charges that disappear completely and must be fully recast/re-written. Or a potion which is now completely gone, and has to be re-brewed. Again, to me, the costs of each are a sufficiently balancing factor. I do have a problem however, with how some GMs (and the examples in the rule books) treat Potions vs Scrolls. The typical -1/4 to re-brew a potion is often treated as, 'you must take 6 hours and expensive materials' to re-brew a potion, whereas gadgets, you can just plug them in and they recover while you sleep. You: " your premise is even correct that magic is regarded as more problematic, I'd guess it is that the gadgeteer has obvious restrictions built into their special effect, the priest has a God to answer to, and the mage is seen as more totally unrestricted." Gadgets with more restrictions built in cost less so can be more powerful. The limiting God limits circumstances under which a power can be used but doesn't necessarily limit the power level, the costs can be more or less expensive depending on how the God sets the limits, but again costs balance that out. The mage is less restricted on how things can be done and how many types of things can be done, but typically at lower power levels (because of costs) and at greater cost as the max power levels reach that of the Priest or Gadgeteer. It all seems very balanced to me, so I don't understand the idea of mages being more problematic which at least *I* have experienced. Again, I see the Mage VPP that can provide 10D6 in 20 things, compared to a Gadgeteer with a Gadget Multipower can provide 15D6 in only 10 things, compared to a individual powers character without Framework who can provide 20D6 in 5 things is not 'problematic'. Its just flavor. So I do not get the fear or dislike of mages with VPPs that *I* have experienced. Since I asked a lot of question of you, let me ask another question of you, or at least in a different way for clarification. -1/4 limitation for having to re-brew a potion vs a gadget you just have to plug in while you sleep to regain charges +0 limitation vs priest regularly keeping up devotion/prayers and charges mystically recharge at dawn +0. If a character did not take the -1/4 limitation on potions (making it more expensive), would a reasonable comparison to the priest and the gadgeteer be to, say, have an ever cooking cauldron which makes the potion overnight while the Mage sleeps, and the mage just scoops some up in a vial the next morning? Or a scroll (without the non-recoverable charges option) mystically re-write itself overnight (or the house demon re-writes it for him, or the like)? Thank you so much for your time and your thoughts. It is helping me to think/re-think/clarify my own thoughts! DC

In what way does it not match your experience? You or your GMs do not seem to get leery of magick with a VPP? At least not in comparison to the other types with a VPP? If that is the case, I need to play under your GMs, lmao. Any thoughts on what I said in #s 2) and 3)? If a Scroll with words that disappear (charges which do not recover) gets a -2 Limitation, should not Potions get the same treatment? And should not Potions which do Not have charges which do not recover be able to recharge in the same manner as other items with charges which automatically recover the next day? Thanks! DC

Thank you massy and mrinku. What you both say makes good sense. The (very) few times I have run a game (way back in 4E, lol) and since then as a player, I have had no problem with characters building an arsenal handing it out, as I see it being the same as casting powers directly on them being pretty much the same, -as long as the appropriate cost is paid' (useable by others)-.

I get that part. I have no plans to (nor have ever done so) randomly hand out gadgets etc. to other characters (unless it was intended that way with the power, in which case I bought UOO, or my character was just the excuse for someone else gaining and paying CP for a new power.) And I agree that Focus is a Limitation, if it is taken from my character, I can't use that power. But there is a reason there is a +0 difference between Personal and Universal Foci. If my character goes down, the nearest teammate can borrow my gun for that scene, but so can my enemy. I am just looking to clarify rules...If said character (enemy or friend) who picks up my Gun (Universal) when my character is unconscious, could either of them even use it, when I am unconscious (breaking LOS)? Or, If conscious and an enemy steals said Gun, or my (one time) hands said gun to a teammate while my character goes off to heal another character, can either of them use it when I leave LOS? According to UOO Focus, they cannot, IF I am understanding it correctly. That seems...odd.

UOO Focus (6E 360) states that giving another character said focus does not negate the need for LOS. And, Steve Long himself in a recent response to me in the Rules forum said that giving another character a potion to use still requires the LOS to be maintained by the Granting character (assuming no other advantages counter this rule, such as Time Limit for example). Does this mean that either: 1) My character gives another character a Gun, if I run around the corner breaking LOS, the receiving character cannot use the Gun? 2) An enemy NPC steals one of my OAF which is Universal meaning that NPC can use it, I can prevent said use just by leaving the scene or even just running around the corner so my character cannot see said NPC? That seems to defeating the purpose of Universal Foci (6E 380). Thanks!

(Background thought: Some GMs seem more afraid of Magick Pools than of Gadget Pools, even though they can do the very same things, just with a different flavor.) Think in superhero terms, not Fantasy Hero: Thoughts on these comparisons? A Priest has a God's Blast spell with charges. It simply recharges the next dawn. No GM has a problem with that. Gadget Pool blaster with charges which DO recover. The Gadgeteer simply takes the blaster with him after using all of its charges, the blaster absorbs natural energy from the surrounding world, and by morning it has fully recharged. Nobody seems to have trouble with this. Wand of Magic Missile in a VPP which has a blast and charges which DO recover. The Mage simply waits overnight as the wand absorbs naturally occurring Mana in the air and the wand is recharged. Again, nobody seems to have a problem with this. ----- Compare to: Priest has a God's Gifts VPP and a STR blessing with Time Limit and charges which his God naturally recharges overnight. No problem Gadgeteer's Suit of Powered Armor with charges and Time Limit granting bonus STR points with charges which DO recover. Gadgeteer again goes lets it recharge in the same manner as above overnight, and next day, fully charged again. Easy enough and GMs are cool with it. Alchemist who creates a Potion of STR with Time Limit with charges which DO recover. Should not the vials just mystically refill overnight, without the 're-brewing process'? To mollify the GM, the equivalent might be to have a cauldron at home continuously bubbling away. Next day more of the potion is ready to be scooped up into a vial without another lick of effort. That is still more effort than the Priest or Gadgeteer have to go through, as they never have to "go home and perform a task" to recharge. Even with the 'going home and refilling the vial,' GMs already begin to get nervous, but not too much. ----- Compare to: (I am leaving out Recoverable Charges, because those represent powers which can be Recovered in just minutes out of combat.) Priest's STR Blessing, charges do NOT just automatically recharge. Priest has to go to a shrine/temple, pray all day and make an appropriate offering to his God before the Blessing can be cast again. Doesn't seem to be a problem for GMs. This is much more than just, say, re-setting a trigger. Gadgeteer creates a blaster or suit of STR with charges which do NOT recover. When those charges are gone, to have that power in the pool again, he must rebuild the blaster or suit, or take a lot of extra time to tinker with it and put in a new power source, etc. Until then, he is without that power. Nobody seems to have trouble with that. Potion with charges which do NOT recover. Must go through lengthy re-cast / re-brew efforts, just like the Gadgeteer and Priest, but GMs start to get Very nervous and dislike it very much. 1) What is it about the Potion or Magic that bothers people/GMs so much but not the Gadgeteer or Priest? 2) Now compare it to a Scroll with writing which disappears after use (6E 372). Those charges never recover, but somebody created that scroll. You get a -2 Limitation for that. But *somebody* had to write that scroll. So I assume it should be ok for the character to be the one to re-write it, again taking prep time and casting/writing efforts, just as in the last 3 cases above. But some GMs have a problem with that, as if they think doing so unbalances the game in ways that the Priest and Gadgeteer do not? 3) If the Scroll re-writing / re-casting / extra time to create efforts are worth a -2 Limitation, should not the Potion re-brewing, Gadgeteer recreating / tinkering / replacing the power source extra time, and the Priest prayer time / offerings, all get the -2 Limitation? I don't get it. Thanks! DC

.Nevermind, lol, I figured it out

Now this makes sense! It sounds very..."ritual" to me as well!

So you are saying, for example in a ritual spell, lets use Summoning: A character has, say, Summon Lesser Dragon. With the assistance of cultists, they could have a small VPP with Assist Summon Dragon, which could add their points to my spell, allowing the character to summon a more powerful Dragon (Summon Dragon), and with enough assistance from more cultists, an even more powerful summoning (Summon Greater Dragon)? And if so, in what way could the cultists assist if the Summon Lesser Dragon was in a VPP and maxed out the Active Points (Control Cost)? Is there a way they could help increase the active points allowed? I know they could AID the VPP, but only to the max of the Highest level AIDer. For example, if they all only had AID 1D6, the max they could add is 6 points, no matter how many of them there are, and that would have to cover the increase of the Control Cost of the VPP and the Active Points of the Summon Dragon spell itself. I was looking to make cultist (coven) minions as low level followers. I want them to be able to assist in rituals, but not be very powerful themselves. They are minions who have to be taken care of in return for their loyalty to the coven. Thanks!

Well, I do want to have the mansion itself semi-public (it does strange things, like get summoned away sometimes). Adds flavor. However, off the base is a Gate with a Trigger where the character goes for privacy and some of her work.

Here in the store somewhere...I had to scroll a bit...

Woo, more posts with product placement! Well, I have been buying PDFs only so far (I prefer them because they are searchable), but in this case I bought the whole bundle. Can't wait until they get here I can't wait to see the House Haunt

But there is a way it can be built to add on to the main spell?

True, but if they all only had, say, 1D6 Aid, it could never go beyond 6 points of Aid, right?

And, if possible, I would like it something that is paid for by the Coven members themselves. To make them somehow...special...beyond just an average every day Normal.

LMAO, thanks.

Can the followers (Coven) learn the specific ritual as well, and have the total power of the spell increase, in the above case, summoning?

I knew I was forgetting something, lol. Thanks!

But only one of the casters can actually AID, or at least the one with the highest roll?

Has anyone figured out a way for other characters, a coven for example, to assist in a ritual casting? For example: A ritual spell that requires a coven to assist in a long ritual of a Summoning spell. The coven gathers around the magic circle. The coven leader (main spell caster) casts the Summoning spell. Other coven members want to AID (or other power) or otherwise boost the power level of the Summoning, whether through AID or some other method. Can only one member of the coven actually assist in the spell, or is there some other way that all other members of the coven truly assist in the spell casting? Thanks! DC

Thanks Dean, that is exactly the type of stuff I am looking for (the powers and such, to make the Mansion I am building have a Feel of its own. I don't suppose either of those also includes something about the building itself being alive, thinking and acting for itself? Either way, thanks again, and I will be obtaining Super-Mage. And I don't mind the 'illegal' stuff from Mystic, I am sure it will, as you say, at least be 'inspirational'. I don't suppose you have heard anything about a 6E version of Ultimate magery type of book? DC