rjcurrie

Re: Jack of All Trades

 

GMO you can buy a KS or PS with any skill for 2/2 at 11- and 1/2- at 8- fpr two and one character points' date=' respectively. I would suppose that the JOAT enhancer would make these even cheaper (perhaps 2 familiarities for one point? I don't know, we should ask Steve).[/quote']

Actually buying a familiarity at 8- is 1 point and increasing that familiarity to a real skill is 1 more point, at which point the +1 to the roll for 2 points kicks in. The rules explicitly state 1 point is the minimum cost for any skill with a Skill Enhancer and that the 1 point expenditure gives you an 11-.

Re: Jack of All Trades

 

So if a person had PS: Acrobat (18-) and no Acrobat skill, they are incredibly able to promote themselves flopping around on the ground?

 

The Three Stooges, but with injuries? (i.e. not enough skill to prevent themselves from being hurt!)

 

I LOVE that imagery!

I suspect he might be able to do the standard Acrobat tricks and could put on a good show but it would probably wouldn't be terribly effective outside the performance arena.

 

In short, a professional skill lets you do the activity in a standard setting for that skill whereas the "real" skill lets you apply it in an adventuring venue. And vice versa, Acting 14- is great for pretending to be a Viper agent but it doesn't convey any knowledge or skill in the actual business of acting -- for example, how to properly behave at an audtion or how to hit your light, etc.

 

Just my opinion,

 

Rod

Re: Why the heck not?

 

I'd make it a +1/4 advantage' date=' simply because EGO is cheaper than DEX. So it is easier to buy up your base EOCV. Obviously, it shouldn't be as much as Based on ECV.[/quote']Actually, if you sell back the SPD you get from DEX (or buy DEX with No Figured Characteristics), EGO and DEX cost the same.

 

This is how I always thought Green Lantern should work, physical manifestations airmed with Willpower (EGO) resisted by dodging it (DEX).

 

Rod

Re: Early "What do you want to see?" for Teen Champions

 

just as a thought the millenium city high school could be named after a hero who fought in the battle of detroit. schools could take there colours and put a memorial up.

I love this idea.

Re: Early "What do you want to see?" for Teen Champions

 

*We need Stereotypes for the type of kids in a high school, (Not another teen movie good place for stereotypes)

 

...

 

*Being British i dont want to see stereotypical exchange students (batgirl in batman and robin "oh hello can i have a cup of tea and a scone" bah) but i do want to see exchange students

Hmmm. So it's okay to stereotype every other type of student except exhange students?

Re: Early "What do you want to see?" for Teen Champions

 

Yeah, that's a good way of looking at it. I think it'll probably have more rules info... I need to sit down with it and make sure these ideas are worthwhile, but there're a couple things I want to play with...

 

Archetypes will be presented differently -- i.e.: jock, skater, burn-out, etc. will be the archetypes -- then recommended standard archetypes will branch from there -- i.e.: jock as brick, jock as energy blaster, jock as martial artist, jock as weapon master (i don't know, maybe he throws trick basketballs or something ) -- so this might require more space.

Other archetypes that you may or may not have already thought of: popular girl, shy/bookish girl, nerd, schemer (a la Zack Morris from "Saved By The Bell"), rich kid, fashion plate, rebel, etc.

 

Disadvantages will be "redefined" -- maybe further defined and explored is a better way of putting it -- something like that. Hunted: Clique (Watching), for instance. Also, Social Limitation: Under 16, and Social Limitation: Under 18. Rivalries has a lot of potential, I think, in an enclosed environment like a high school. In other words, many Disadvantages not so appropriate to regular Champs can be made relevant in the melodramatic world of teenagers. DNPCs also warrant discussion... anyway tons of stuff here to discuss.

Sounds cool. I can definitely see Rivalry being big in a TC campaign. A good discussion of Psych Lims for teens would be good too.

 

Also in need of space is proper purchase of skills -- teenagers, unless playing Curve-Breaker, the Boy Genius, shouldn't have as many skills as normal (at least, normal for published Champions characters) -- so there'll be some recommended limits or something.

I think I'd go with recommended limits as opposed to hard ones. And an appropriate list of Everyman skills is a definite must.

 

Also need to address how to build powers with flaws, how to have fun with limited powers, and recommendations for how to model getting better with powers vis-a-vis spending experience points.

There should be a definite emphasis on new and improved powers being discovered as part of a "story". Smallville is the best example I can think of for this.

 

Also need a general overview of parent/child relationship possibilities -- everything from superhero/villain for parent, to nosy parents, to negiligent parents, to abusive parents -- as well as a quick rundown of the law and minors. Maybe get into some gray areas, if I think there's potential for plot seeds -- for instance can Curve-Breaker, the Boy Genius apply for adulthood, and why not? Isn't he smart enough to go it alone? Is a character with a long-life, but who's slow-to-mature an adult at 18? Why not? More thematic elements to Teen Champions too -- more soap opera stuff -- so that'll need space.

Oh, yeah, I definitely want to see the soap opera stuff. It's one of my favorite parts of the superhero genre and it's even more important in a teen campaign: the angst of dating, etc.

 

There's other stuff -- just kind of throwing things out there -- but I do think there's going to be more sub-genre information than Galactic Champions.

Yeah! To me, that should be the meat of a product like this. As a GM who tends to run his own worlds, the sub-genre info is much more useful than the setting-specific info.

 

 

As for heroes and villains, and settings.

 

I've got the school situation broken down into four possibilities, each of which will be explored with heroes/villains and settings. Private school with secret superhuman program (Ravenswood). Private school solely for superhumans (Generation Viper). Public school kids (some Millennium City High School, unnamed as of yet). These three will be located in Millennium City, and have "interschool" rivalries -- public school kids don't like spoiled kids at Ravenswood, Ravenswood/Generation Viper have New Mutants/Hellions relationship, etc. The fourth possibility is kids on the run -- this will be covered with NOVA (from Champions Universe). General information and specific details will be provided for each setting, so a GM can run his own Teen Champions game in the setting. (Even the Generation Viper stuff would make for a good campaign setting, I think -- evil or deluded parents send good kid to bad school, and the good kids band together to make best of terrible situation.) At least one or two maps of facilities -- Ravenswood will definitely be mapped out -- we'll see about the rest.

I would definitely like to see the Public school mapped out too (or at least discussed in some detail) as the concept of supers in a normal school (a la Buffy or Smallville) has great possibilities.

 

Perhaps there should be a brief discussion of the idea of non-school related campaigns (for example, the New Teen Titans of the Wolfman/Perez era) where the members of a team may all go to different schools. In such a campaign, school-based stories would probably be sub-plots similar to stories in normal Champions campaigns that might involve a hero's workplace.

 

Somewhere in the book, maybe in this section, there should be a discussion of being a kid sidekick.

 

It'll probably be a little heavy on heroes for a Champions product. Normally I'm against that, but I think that'll be all right for this -- teen heroes always ended up in conflict with adults, including superheroes, because of either fanaticism, they're duped by the villain, or they're on the run like the NOVA team. Also the "boy hostage" scenario, and teen heroes often end up handing off the big stuff to adults. So, anyway, I think a GM of a more standard Champs campaign can find a use for superhero NPCs. (And teen hero PCs need rivals more than standard heroes, I think -- more likely to let jealousy, envy, hurt feelings, whatever stand in the way of common sense.)

I don't think this will be a problem. A lot of people seem to be looking for more heroes.

 

As for other villains... It'll have an overview of villain archetypes -- born evil, exploitive adults, victim of environment, too much power for too little maturity, rebel without a cause, etc. Each of these will have (at least one) corresponding villain. For those with DEMON, one will have been conceived in Boston in 1986 (hint, hint...). The Teen Dream, the perfect girl cum popstar. Generation Viper, mentioned above. Definitely some evil drug dealer guy. Plus it'll have notes on how to use published villains with Teen Champions campaigns -- specific plot seeds involving youth type stuff.

 

So anyway... Fifteen or so superheroes. Twenty - thirty villains. Something like that.

Cool.

Re: Ultimate Mystic Review

 

You don’t like the way it handles your religion. I accept that and I respect that but I don’t have a problem with it and as I don’t share those beliefs it seems pointless to inform me and others like me of the offence this causes you.

So people can say they don't like a book but not say why?

Re: Ultimate Mystic Review

 

Making out that DoJ should have steered clear of a topic (which they knew would be tricky to handle) because it might not suit everyone = not so fine.

I hope you are planning on being equally vehement against anyone who is critical of a Hero product because it doesn't meet their idea of what the product should contain. I really don't see Agent X's arguments about the fictionalizing of christianity to be all that different from people who are constantly arguing to see higher point characters in Champions products.

 

You want to know what they have lost by including a treatment of that God? They've lost readers who cannot accept that a game treatment of a subject doesn't mean that one must give up one's real world beliefs.

That's a tad extreme. Agent X described it as an "ick" factor not as something that threatened his belief system. I suspect it's not much different than the "ick" factor that some people get from extreme violence or sexuality in a work of fiction. Just something that doesn't sit right.

 

What have they gained? They've gained my respect for dealing with a thorny subject and not taking the ridiculous step of avoiding the whole issue and pretending it doesn't exist.

Well, I'm not sure that I'd call avoiding the issue a ridiculous step. But I will agree that they did likely gain respect from some customers (including myself) for dealing with it.

 

 

I should note that, in general, I am speaking of the inclusion of christianity and other religiions in the treatment of the mystical part of the Champions Universe and, not specifically, the Ultimate Mystic.

Re: Ultimate Mystic Review

 

Perhaps you should do something foolish like actually reading the sections of the book yourself before you go off on it. It's possible the reviewer's interpretations are incorrect and you're just ranting here for no valid reason. It's foolish for anyone to base their opinions on hearsay rather than fact.

Agent X said himself, he would consider buying the book if it didn't have Pseudo-Yawheh.

Re: Ultimate Mystic Review

 

Agent X you come across as very arrogant on this topic where is this supposed respect for the rights of others to believe differently from you that you claimed earlier.

 

It seems like you believe it is only acceptable to look at your religion the way you do. You seem to be saying that it shouldn't be seen from different points of view different interpretations and defiantly not from a secular, agnostic or atheistic stand point.

 

Obviously you have very strong beliefs in how your religion should be interpreted and treated but you have no right to demand others do the same.

 

Quite frankly I'd rather you kept your religious doctrine to your self there is just no reason for you to publicly display your faith.

Good grief. Doesn't anyone on this board have a decent reading comprehension level? All Agent X said was that he didn't like his religion being treated as fiction and for that reason, he wasn't going to be buying the book. He wasn't preahing that the author was a sinner and would burn in Hell for the treatment or callling for others to boycot the product. He just said that the treatment of Christianity would cause him (and possibly others) not to buy the book. This is no different than someone deciding they aren't going to buy UNTIL: Defenders of Freedom because the don't agree with the fictional treatment of the UN. Heck, he didn't go the over-the-top cliched route of declaring that he would never buy another Hero product again -- just the mystic-themed line as long as it included "Pseudo-Yahweh".

 

And just where did he spout any religious doctrine? Unless publicly admitting what religion you are is spouting religious doctrine. Does that mean I should be in trouble for publicly stating I'm an atheist?

 

I've seen a lot of people on these boards post a lot of stupid things that were more or less asking to be jumped all over, but a post by a Hero customer explaining why he wasn't buying a product (at a time when Hero is talking about soliciting information about customer's buying habits) is hardly one of those.

 

Rod

Re: An EB by any other name...

 

Are "ultra" and "multi" now gone???? I believe HERO Designer still puts a "u" or "m" in front' date=' doesn't it?[/quote']

In 5ER, it is still as Dust Raven says, the names "Fixed" and "Flexible" are used with "multi" and "ultra" given as well. The letters "m" and "u" are used in character write-ups and the Genre by Genre chapter contains the same sidebar found in most (if not all) Hero books with character sheets that explains the use of these letters.

 

Rod

Re: Ultimate Mystic Review

 

There are no write-ups of sample characters, but I expect those will be in the upcoming Champions mystic enemies book.

Are you perhaps referring to Arcane Adversaries, which has been out for several months now?

Re: An EB by any other name...

 

Random thoughts:

 

2. Why use just one name? There's no reason to assume one name is best, and, indeed, if we were to use several names you could pick the one that best suited the power that you are building. Using multiple names for a power would also, IMO, remove some of the pre-judgement of what a power does.

 

ENTANGLE

aka Arrest, Immobilise, Impede, Restrain

Can't say I care for the multiple name idea. I think that might be even more confusing. However, it did spark another idea. What about a one line summary that would describe the power's function.

 

<COMPUTER GEEK MODE>

For those of you familiar with UNIX or Linux man pages, think of the one line description that appears at the top of each command's man page.

</COMPUTER GEEK MODE>

 

For example:

 

ENTANGLE

Immobilize characters or create barriers.

Re: Answers & Questions

 

Q: Son, now I want you to tell the jury exactly who got you hooked on those evil role playing games.

 

A: I rest on my case.

Q: I've always wondered. What do you lawyers do if they don't put a chair behind your table in court?

 

A: The quick, the dead, and the ugly.

Re: An EB by any other name...

 

Giving the responses on this thread, I am willing to concede that "Stunned" does seem to be a troublesome term. "Dazed" is the best suggestion that I have seen. I use the term myself when I want to avoid "game-speak". For example, "Dr. Destroyer appears to have beeen dazed by that shot."

Re: An EB by any other name...

 

That might be the best explaination I've seen of why people say CON stunned yet. I still hate the term' date=' but maybe I'll see if I can start using Dazed.[/quote']

Yeah, I hate CON stunned as a term too. I've never understood how people could get confused by Stunned. It was certainly never a problem in the groups I played with.

Re: Viperia: Less Pow Than Champions??

 

The best move may be for the Champions to run away if they find themselves overpowered and return later with a plan to give them the advantage -- for example, keeping the ranged combatants spread out so Viperia can't effectively use her area effect attacks, or perhaps with the help of one or more NPC heroes or a squad of UNTIL or PRIMUS agents. This is often what happens in the comics; the heroes get their asses handed to them in the first encounter only to defeat the villain later when they are more prepared.

Re: Convention Character Write Ups

 

Don't be afraid to use cliches and stereotypes. The players have an hour to get into a character they've never seen before, so subtlety isn't always possible.

 

Under similar circumstances, a friend recommended that I make clones or melds of commonly known characters. You know, the stuff you hate to see your players hand in.

 

Ex: "This character 'Pshark' is kind of like 'Blade' in personality and general tactics but he uses mind powers instead of hand-to-hand combat." It gives them an easy handle on the character. If they're a good player, they can make it their own.

In some ways, I see this approach as being condescending to convention players. I think convention games should offer something special -- something that players wouldn't get back in their games at home. As a player, if I was given an obvious clone character in a convention game, it would immediately lower my opinion of the GM and I would begin to wonder if I could enjoy the game. And what if the player is not familiar with the character you are using as the template for the personality. For instance, you example would tell me nothing about Pshark because I nave never read any Blade comics or seen any of the movies.

 

Also, let them run with the personality. It's their character, and as long as they stay within the psych lims and breif description, let them play them how they want. And in saying that, letting people play your old characters, its hard to not 'correct' them.

 

I definitely agree with letting them run with the personality. However, I think that you can definitely let people play your old characters -- I do it all the time. I think the key is separating the two versions in your mind, but then again I am always interesting in differing interpretations of the same character by different writers or actors.

Re: If your character played an RPG...

 

Rick Davies the Resilient Rubber-Man has always been envisioned (from the time he was one of my PCs to his current role in the SuperSquad America convention game) as a geek. He has played role-playing games both before and after becoming a superhero. He tends towards games in which he can be a true hero -- superhero games, high fantasy, that kind of game. I've always envisioned him playing one of those annoying squeaky-clean paladins in a D&D game.

 

In a Traveller game many years ago, our characters often played D&D, that is, Dollars and Degrees, a role-playing game of being university students on 20th century Earth.

Re: Your Hero's Hero!

 

In the SuperSquad America convention team, there are the following examples of idols/heroes/mentiors.

 

Rick Davies, the Resilient Rubber-Man: While he idolizes all true superheroes, real and fictional, he particular admires the original Challenger (father of his teammate, Challenger) who trained him.

 

Challenger: While his lack of actual superpowers led his father to reject the idea of training him to be a sidekick, he is still hugely influenced by his father and tries very hard to fill his shoes.

 

Silver Bow: As the daughter of superheroes (the Silver Archer and Finesse), she is greatly influenced by the superheroic values (fair play, compassion, etc.) they taught her. However, due to finding her parents murdered in their bed by a 13 year old junkie looking for cash, these values are often in conflict with her desire to rid the streets of such scum.

 

Nightingale: Raised in a mystical Tibetan temple that was also home to original SuperSquad member, Brainstorm, she found herself enchanted by his tales of the Squad's adventures. And when she left the temple for America after his death, she took the last name of his secret ID as her own last name (she was left as a baby on a cathedral's doorstep and has no idea what her real last name is).

Re: Convention Character Write Ups

 

Oh, yeah, I haven't really seen any problems with telling players "no, your character's powers don't really work that way". I've done it and I've been in games where other GMs have done it.

Re: Convention Character Write Ups

 

As for skills, I go with the lengthy list of what I feel the character should have. But then I tend to improvise investigations -- that is, I know where the investigation has to lead them and just let the players do things to investigate and give out needed information when appropriate. In other words, no matter what they choose to follow up on, they will usually find themselves on the right path. However, I will occasionally spoon feed important information if the players seem lost.

 

I should also mention that I tend to see convention games as being about a particular group of characters. That is, I design the characters and then create an adventure for those characters. The characters are not designed for a particular adventure and thus, in my mind, need to be fully realized characters as opposed to simply designed to fit the adventure.

Re: Convention Character Write Ups

 

Personally, I feel that any convention player who states what they want to do with a VPP in anything but special effect terms should be given a solid whack across the side of their head. But that's probably just me

Re: Convention Character Write Ups

 

I know you played Friends of Justice, OddHat, did you play SuperSquad America as well? I have had very little trouble with the characters in that game -- you can see the characters at www.supersquadamerica.com. Almost all the characters have one or more multipowers and sometimes an EC as well - no VPPs. However, I have seen VPPs work in a convention game -- without an effect list -- the GM just asked the player to describe in special effect terms what they wanted to do and then worked out in her head what it would be in game terms.

 

In my opinion, you should bring one set of character sheets per run and an extra set for yourself to consult -- or use as extras just in case one gets lost.

 

However, I will say that in my events (particularly SuperSquad America), I am far more interested in how the players role play the personalities of the characters than I am in how they handle the powers and combat -- so, in truth, I think the back side of the character sheet with background and what they think of the other team members is far more important than the actual game statistics on the front. But what will work for you will depend upon what type of event you are running.

 

You can find out more about my philosophy behind the SuperSquad America event in Digital Hero 9.

Re: What should be DROPPED from HERO?

 

Sorry, the impression I had was that people wanted to have the "Five Powers" toolkit and then have the Hero System as sort of an example of that toolkit in action. In any event, other than my first somewhat tongue-in-cheek comment about Hero sales, my points are still valid if you start exposing some kind of metasystem.