Variable Power Pools

[Coriendal]

Can someone explain VPP's for me?

 

60 point pool, 60 point control cost.

 

Any one or combination of powers of 60 points total?

 

Changeable with time.  So if I am going against someone with cold powers or mental powers I can construct powers to counter them within the limits of the power pool, correct?

 

You are paying to be able to craft your powers to counter expected opponents powers or take advantage of their weaknesses?

 

Looking at doing a combat mage type character.  Most of the ones in the villain books have VPP's but no real examples of what one might actually do.  Am I understanding it correctly?

 

Thanks.

[bigdamnhero]

Can someone explain VPP's for me?

Tldr: Yes, you're on the right track.

 

60 Point Pool means you can have up to 60 Real Points worth of spells going at any one time.

60 Point Control means any/all of those spells can be up to 60 Active Points.

So you could have one 60 AP Spell with no Limitations on it, or two 60 AP Spells that each have -1 worth or Limitations (ie 30 Real Points), etc.

(Note that in 6ed, the Pool and the Control can be different numbers; in previous editions they're the same number.)

Changeable over time, cost varies depending on how fast and how easy is it to change slots.

By default, yes you can make up any spell you can dream up within the point limits. In practice, many (most?) fantasy mages will some restrictions such as "Fire Magic Only" or what have you.

It's also common to see mage VPPs limited to "Only Spells In My Spell Book," which limits your ability to just invent any new spell you want. That may seem to defeat the point of a VPP, but it's still a relatively cheap way to get a wide variety of spells.

Also note that if there are any Limitations that all your spells have - like they all require Gestures and Incantations - then you can put those Common Limitations on the VPP itself to reduce its cost.

 

 

Hope that helps. Feel free to post any follow-up questions.

[steriaca]

By default, yes you can make up any spell you can dream up within the point limits. In practice, many (most?) fantasy mages will some restrictions such as "Fire Magic Only" or what have you.

It's also common to see mage VPPs limited to "Only Spells In My Spell Book," which limits your ability to just invent any new spell you want. That may seem to defeat the point of a VPP, but it's still a relatively cheap way to get a wide variety of spells.

The above is usaly true for mages in Fantasy Hero. Champions super mages tend to be more like Doctor Strange, Doctor Fate, Zantana, or Jon Consitane. They can basically do almost anything.

 

Strange can do almost anything by chanting and concentration (depending on who is writing him at the time). Same with Fate. Zatana has a intristing limitation of having to speek backwards to use her magic (she doesn't have to...it is simply much more easy for her...her father Zantan has to speek backwards to cast magic by the way). Consitine's magic is not exactly as strong as thoes mentioned. He is more careful in how he cast magic because he has sold his soul a few many times for various reasions (and not all of them heroic).

 

Champions mages tend to start out rather low powered compared to comic book mages. They tend to have more of a Multipower over a Variable Power Pool.

[steriaca]

Comic book magic can usaly be divided into three different "power fields"; personal, universal, and dimensional.

 

Personal magic uses the caster's will and 'energys' to power his magic. Common limitations for spells in this cattagory include Increase Endurance Cost, Requiers A Roll (usaly an EGO roll), Concentration, and Side Effects. Spells tend to not be long lasting, and usaly tend to only extend to the caster's own body.

 

Universal magic uses 'loopholes' in the laws of the universe. The mage needs to rely on knowledge of how to bend the rules of the universe to do magic. Common limitations include Requires A Roll (usaly an INT or Knowledge Skill). Spells can have a long lasting effect, and a lasting effect upon the world. But watch it. The universe doesn't like to have the rules bent.

 

Finally there are dimensional magic. Tne mage basically asks "the powers" for the ability to cast strong magic. "The powers" can be demons, angels, deites, or even personifications of cosmic forces (like Death, Chaos, Creation, Infinity, ect...). Common limitations include Requires A Roll (PRE), and Limited Power (Only Useable If It Suites The Powers Interest. There is no way in heck a power is going to grant the mage the spell which is going to attack him with).

 

There are branches of magic (Necromancy, Nekomancy, Cryomancy, ect), but that is merly special effects.

 

And knowing is half the battle.

[bigdamnhero]

The above is usaly true for mages in Fantasy Hero.

[checks which forum we're in] Huh. I somehow could've sworn this was a Fantasy Hero question. Never mind, my bad.

[Hyper-Man]

Here is an example of a non-magical special effect VPP that is otherwise functionally equivalent to Vancian Magic from D&D.

 

From this rookie version of a famous comic book character.

 

46    The Utility Belt: Variable Power Pool (Gadget Pool), 30 base + 30 control cost, Powers Can Be Changed As A Half-Phase Action (2 or more slots with a combined Real Cost of 30 Real Points can be active at any one time; +1/2), No Skill Roll Required (+1) (67 Active Points); Limited Class of Powers (Gadgets) Operates like a Multipower with a Dozen or so different slots ALL with the Extra Time (Half Phase) to Activate Limitation (The specific set of slots carried at any one time can be swapped out at the Batcave; -1/2); all slots Restrainable (Must be able to reach individual compartments; -1/2), IIF (The Belt is IIF (worn) Individual active slots are IIF at a minimum but can be OAF, OIF or IAF (in hand); -1/4)

[Notes: This is just a small sampling of what is typically carried.  For inspiration to create more slots see the example Utility Belt Multipower in the Hero System Equipment Guide (6e) on pages 186-187.]
0    1) Batarangs: Blast 6d6 (30 Active Points); OAF (-1), Range Based On Strength (-1/4), Beam (-1/4), 2 clips of 6 Recoverable Charges (-0) Real Cost: 10

[Notes: Up to 8d6 with Batarang Fu Basic Shot.] - END=[6 rc]
0    2) Taser Knuckles: Hand-To-Hand Attack (vs. Energy Defense) +6d6 (30 Active Points); OIF (-1/2), Hand-To-Hand Attack (-1/4), 4 clips of 8 Charges (-0) Real Cost: 13

[Notes: Up to 12d6 with Bat Fu Martial Strike.] - END=[8]
0    3) Flash Pellets: Sight Group Flash 4d6, Area Of Effect (32m Radius Explosion; +1/2) (30 Active Points); IAF (-1/2), Range Based On Strength (-1/4), 16 Charges (-0) Real Cost: 13 - END=[16]
0    4) Batlines: Swinging 30m, x4 Noncombat (30 Active Points); OAF (-1), 4 clips of 12 Recoverable Charges (+1/2) Real Cost: 12 - END=[12 rc]
0    5) Bat Bolas: Entangle 2d6, 4 PD/4 ED (30 Active Points); OAF (-1), 2 clips of 6 Recoverable Charges (-0) Real Cost: 12 - END=[6 rc]

 

 

 

HM

[Hyper-Man]

Most GM's will prefer that players pre-build most of the slots for their character's VPPs ahead of time.  Nothing else quite slows a game down as much as waiting for a player to build 'the right slot' during a combat.  That's not to say it's not appropriate once in a while (ex: Green Lantern, Dr Fate, Reed Richards, Tony Stark, Dr. Strange).

[Coriendal]

Yes, the question was for champions.  I was looking at a magic character using a staff(possible OAF) with some powers(blast, etc.) plus a VPP(for emergencies) and a more normal multipower with a few martial arts techniques.  I wanted to make sure I understood the VPP as examples of slots for the VPP are few and far between.

 

Thanks to everyone, even the person in the wrong forum, lol.

[Coriendal]

Quick question.  Is the control cost total available based on the active cost or the real cost?  Looking at the utility belt above left me wondering(for magic) if the total I could have active was the active cost or the real cost listed.  All the slots in the utility belt were 30 active points(30 point VPP).  Does that mean I could use one at a time or if I had 2 slots with 15 points I could use two?  Or is the control cost the total of the real cost?  If I had 3 slots with 10 points of "real" cost could I have all of them active

[steriaca]

Pre 6ed, thw control cost was half the cost of the VVP, modified by advantages and limitations, and nothing more. The cost of the main VVP decided on the cap of how many points can be in the power built for it itself.

 

In 6ed, the control cost is how much real cost a power can cost in a VVP. This was proably someone's house rule befor this edition. In any case the cost of the VVP proper govens how many active points a power can have. Also, the combined real cost of all powers in a VVP which are active cannot excede the total cost of the VVP proper (that is VVP, not VVP and control cost). Hope this helps.

[Hyper-Man]

Quick question.  Is the control cost total available based on the active cost or the real cost?  Looking at the utility belt above left me wondering(for magic) if the total I could have active was the active cost or the real cost listed.  All the slots in the utility belt were 30 active points(30 point VPP).  Does that mean I could use one at a time or if I had 2 slots with 15 points I could use two?  Or is the control cost the total of the real cost?  If I had 3 slots with 10 points of "real" cost could I have all of them active

 

See the highlighted section.

 

46    The Utility Belt: Variable Power Pool (Gadget Pool), 30 base + 30 control cost, Powers Can Be Changed As A Half-Phase Action (2 or more slots with a combined Real Cost of 30 Real Points can be active at any one time; +1/2), No Skill Roll Required (+1) (67 Active Points); Limited Class of Powers (Gadgets) Operates like a Multipower with a Dozen or so different slots ALL with the Extra Time (Half Phase) to Activate Limitation (The specific set of slots carried at any one time can be swapped out at the Batcave; -1/2); all slots Restrainable (Must be able to reach individual compartments; -1/2), IIF (The Belt is IIF (worn) Individual active slots are IIF at a minimum but can be OAF, OIF or IAF (in hand); -1/4)

 

 

Since all the slots are built with a Real Cost of 15 points or less he can have any 2 active at one time.  From a special effect standpoint this lines up nicely since it's reasonable for him to have 1 item in each hand.

 

HM

[Coriendal]

That is what I needed.  Thanks for the great replies.