New Campaign Limitations

[Gandalf970]

I have taken your advice on this forum after playing for a year plus and understanding the game and power creep more.  Here are the limitations I am going to put on my campaign to keep it manageable and not have the "arms race"

 

OCV, DCV, OMCV, DMCV= 6 CAP

DC= 6 CAP

Skill Cap=13 

Armor Tiring Rules=Home Brew

Magic system will be the Fantasy Codex rules

PD, ED, rPD, rED= 8 cap (is this too high)?

 

I have one question, with these caps do you still allow purchasing of maneuvers from fighting styles and martial arts which pushes it beyond the cap or not?

 

Any more insight as to rabbit holes and traps I need to watch out for?

[archer]

Offhand, the Mental caps look too high since you're going to often be working with NPC characters with a 2 or 3 DMCV versus a PC with a 6 OMCV (a 3 or 4 point gap) while your physical and energy combat is going to more often be a 1-2 point gap or completely even. But I'm not very experienced playing in 6th in Fantasy Hero, maybe that's perfect.

 

 

The only real trap that I'd advise against is being married to the caps.

 

If they don't seem to be working like you want them to work, try something else rather than keep trying to put a square peg into a round hole.

[MrKinister]

Caps are good. They help shape a character's capabilities when they first start, and won't let one character outshine another.

 

However, in my games I remove the initial caps once the game starts and use a new set of caps that characters have to build to.

 

I tend to think in terms of how "powerful" or how much "epic scope" I'd like the game to have.

 

For example, this is how I think of combat competency among characters: a normal NPC will have a CV of 3, on the average, 2 if they are incompetent or just not focused on combat (not everybody is). A trained soldier may have +1 or +2 to their combat value. A veteran who keeps herself in shape might have +3 or +4. Where do your PCs fall into that range? Are they regular people? Are they heroic characters that outshine, outsmart, out-spell, and out-fight a common man?

 

Based on this I see initial PC combat values between 6 to 9. Armor values I keep in the normal range, but add the possibility of extraordinary materials or enchantments, as usual. This often comes to between 3 to 8, sometimes higher. Damage is by weapons + skill + talent, plus enchantment where present, to a regular 5 to 9 DC. 
 

And if these PC stats are the heroic level, what is the epic level? What is the demi-god level? And at what level should an antagonist be at to present a challenge to the PCs? (Especially if you are considering a solo opponent.)

 

In my perspective, these fantasy characters, at 175 points (6th Ed.) are strong PCs, roughly the equivalent of 7th to 9th level characters in D&D.

 

Of course, these are my preferences. You may not be running the same type of game I am. Your mileage may vary. I am merely presenting a different point of view to bounce your ideas off.

[Gandalf970]

MrKinister thank you for your insight.  It is exactly what I was looking for and provides me with food for thought.  I will be removing caps as the game is played and how it feels.  I like my start and my players are spending many points on none combat skills which pleases me.

[LoneWolf]

If you are going to have caps it should include everything a character can do.   Otherwise all your characters will be purchasing those things that allow you to circumvent the caps.  That being said your caps are way too low.   A cap of 6 DC means that a character with a 10 STR and an offensive strike is offensive strike is already maxed out.    It also means that any character using a battle axe or similar weapon is already maxed out.  I would probably raise the DC to at least a 10 maybe even to 12 with the understanding that is other than pushing that is the maximum damage a character can do period.  Anything that pushes their damage over that point is not allowed. 

 

The caps should be on what the character can purchase, not what they can use.  So if the character has a high STR and purchases a maneuver that adds +4 DC that is going to limit the number of combat skill levels they can have.  Adjust your cap on OCV, DCV similarly and limit the character on all aspects.  Don’t forget to factor in talents and free maneuvers as well.   Since all characters can perform a haymaker with any attack that means that all characters can add +4 DC.  About the only thing I would not factor in is pushing.  Pushing is supposed to allow characters to go above and beyond their normal limits.  Also in a Fantasy Hero game pushing is not guaranteed.  

 

One thing I would recommend is to use the characteristic maximums.   Using that a soft cap works better than most of the caps I have seen people posting.  Under that the maximum base CV are 8, if a characters wants to go higher it cost double.  Most of the time the players are not going to want to spend double so will start looking for alternatives like skill levels or martial arts.  

 

If you are trying to simulate the D&D concept of starting at first level I would recommend reducing the number of starting points.  MrKinster is correct that a 175 point character is a lot more competent than a 1st level character.  Try dropping the characters to 150 point or maybe even as low as 125.  Much beyond that it gets difficult to create a character that can actually do something.  
 

[Gandalf970]

I will raise the caps for sure and I do use skill maximums.  I just don't want the arms race that happened in a previous campaign.  Thanks for all of your help.