Lack of Power coverage

[JmOz]

Re: Lack of Power coverage

 

My Regenreation Power

 

10 points per level: For each level that is purchased move the recovery rate of body (normaly per month) down one step of the Time Chart (10 points you rec your REC in a week not a month)

 

Bodyjacking as a power, with limitation that you do the freeky friday thing

 

Removal of Swinging & Gliding from the game (Both are forms of flight)

 

Instant CHange should be returned

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Lack of Power coverage

 

Diamond Lil from Alpha Flight. Her only real power is that she cannot be hurt.

 

At all.

 

Ever.

 

Unless you use some means to bypass her invulnerability, like a gas attack, or mental attacks. But until that point, forget about trying to damage her, because you won't and you can't.

 

Tell me again why you can't model this in Hero System?

 

You can. Buy huge amounts of Armor, Double Hardened, Always On. Done. Actualy, buy an Invisible, Hardened, 0 END, Persistent, Always On, Self Only, No Range Force Wall - that gets rid of STUN at a much lower DEF level.

 

That said, I'm not averse to simply moving up the Damage Reduction chain - for 80/120 (twice the cost of 3/4), you can have 100% damage reduction. That will cost Diamond Lil 240 character points, please - which seems both fair for the utility of the power and consistent with the fact she didn't have a huge amount of other abilities. But for 240 points, I suspect you could buy enough of the Force Wall construct to get a similar effect.

 

34/34 Force Wall with +1 hex for full coverage is 172 points x 3.5/2.5 = 241 - probably enough unless you'r well above a 12 DC campaign.

 

Hmmm...I could also buy Desolid, 0 END (+1/2), Persistent (+1/2), IPE (+1), Always On (-1/2), Only protects against damage (-1/2) and pay a paltry 60 points. And now I'm immune to attacks with exotic defenses too! Of course, the extra 180 points will be needed to put Affects Solid World on everything else I have.

 

With respect to specific character, I seem to recall a story where she was, in fact, hurt, but that's beside the point. I do recall an arc where she was dying of some illness which normally would be addressed by routine surgery but, hey, you can't cut her skin - hence, whatever her DEF, it is "always on".

 

EDIT: OK, the character who hurt her, I am told, was the Beyonder. There's a guy definitely well in excess of "campaign norms".

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Lack of Power coverage

 

My Regenreation Power

 

10 points per level: For each level that is purchased move the recovery rate of body (normaly per month) down one step of the Time Chart (10 points you rec your REC in a week not a month)

 

Bodyjacking as a power, with limitation that you do the freeky friday thing

 

Removal of Swinging & Gliding from the game (Both are forms of flight)

 

Instant CHange should be returned

 

In fairness, while I agree Gliding and Swinging can be viewed as variants of Flight, Regen is just as much a variant of Healing and Instant Change is arguable just as much a variant if Transform. I'd keep all four as inherent powers.

 

As someone already mentioned for a "shrink ray", what's the defense for Bodyjacking? The classic characters, Deadman and Jerico, both encountered people they couldn't work their magic on, so there is some defense. I don't like the mechanic suggested in USPD, but I think a Transform is a good starting point. And Freaky Friday is a side effect.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Lack of Power coverage

 

The problem I see with avoiding the use of Transform is that what other mechanic are you going to use as a defense against any replacement/NEW power? Shrinking usable against others describes the effect but not the defense. Transform has a very clear and well worked out mechanic for Power Defense and Body.

 

Unless a NEW power description has a simpler but still fair mechanic for defense against the power there is no reason to not just use Transform instead.

 

I think this is the most solid defense for use of a Transform-based mechanic for a lot of unusual constructs. Most such characters tend to be seen as "absolutes", but encounter characters their powers fail against on occasion.

[Captain Liberty]

Re: Lack of Power coverage

 

I think this is the most solid defense for use of a Transform-based mechanic for a lot of unusual constructs. Most such characters tend to be seen as "absolutes"' date=' but encounter characters their powers fail against on occasion.[/quote']

 

Just as there are other powers that use the same mechanic, even though they are distinct powers in the Hero lexicon, I am a firm believer that there is a need for more powers, just for simplicity in description. Since I think I invented the idea of how Transform is used (an early Champions version of Firestorm that used RKA for the transformation, used in games with the original Heroes), I am all for using a variation of the mechanic on all kinds of other powers.

 

Right now I am working on the Absorbing Man's Matter and Energy Duplication abilities...

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Lack of Power coverage

 

Just as there are other powers that use the same mechanic, even though they are distinct powers in the Hero lexicon, I am a firm believer that there is a need for more powers, just for simplicity in description. Since I think I invented the idea of how Transform is used (an early Champions version of Firestorm that used RKA for the transformation, used in games with the original Heroes), I am all for using a variation of the mechanic on all kinds of other powers.

 

Right now I am working on the Absorbing Man's Matter and Energy Duplication abilities...

Your post is a little confusing.

Are you advocating a different mechanic? If so I would hope that it is at least as simple in its USE which has far more gameplay effect than its descripion. But even if that requirement is met you run the risk of GURPifying the rules so they no longer form a toolkit for any effect to be created.

[Captain Liberty]

Re: Lack of Power coverage

 

No, I am advocating the same 15 points gets you 1d6 of effect mechanic that Transform (and RKA) uses.

 

In this case (Matter Duplication), one matches the roll against the Def of the substance. If the roll is greater (or maybe twice the #) then the user becomes the substance. Body doesn't change, but the character's PD and ED equal the matched DEF and are fully resistant (with allowances for some substances like matching cotton candy by mistake). The character's STR also equals the DEF x 5.

 

Duration is until the character absorbs some other material's characteristics. This is compensation for the fact this is a touch power, rather than ranged like Transform.

 

For duplicating Energy, I figure the Duplication matches the roll against the DC of the energy. The DC becomes the DEF, as before, the character can damage a target with a touch, and can essentially teleport, using the active points of the power as the points in Teleport. Limit, of course, is that he has to see where he is going.

 

Just rough ideas so far. I'll toss my Absorbing Man HeroClix at my players sometime soon and see if he does any better this way than he did using a VPP.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Lack of Power coverage

 

No, I am advocating the same 15 points gets you 1d6 of effect mechanic that Transform (and RKA) uses.

 

In this case (Matter Duplication), one matches the roll against the Def of the substance. If the roll is greater (or maybe twice the #) then the user becomes the substance. Body doesn't change, but the character's PD and ED equal the matched DEF and are fully resistant (with allowances for some substances like matching cotton candy by mistake). The character's STR also equals the DEF x 5.

 

Duration is until the character absorbs some other material's characteristics. This is compensation for the fact this is a touch power, rather than ranged like Transform.

 

For duplicating Energy, I figure the Duplication matches the roll against the DC of the energy. The DC becomes the DEF, as before, the character can damage a target with a touch, and can essentially teleport, using the active points of the power as the points in Teleport. Limit, of course, is that he has to see where he is going.

 

Just rough ideas so far. I'll toss my Absorbing Man HeroClix at my players sometime soon and see if he does any better this way than he did using a VPP.

Interresting construction. As a player I like it. As a GM I would look at and see that it forces me to define EVERYTHING in the environment. For a control freak type of GM this may not be a bad thing. Appreciate the post!

[Captain Liberty]

Re: Lack of Power coverage

 

First thing to do is realize you can't have everything listed, so just keep track of the important stuff. And, as a GM, if a player showed up with the power, insist on seeing a list of substances and their Defs MAINTAINED BY THE PLAYER. Let the player do the work.

 

But vet the list and keep a copy, just to keep the player honest.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Lack of Power coverage

 

In this case (Matter Duplication)' date=' one matches the roll against the Def of the substance. If the roll is greater (or maybe twice the #) then the user becomes the substance. Body doesn't change, but the character's PD and ED equal the matched DEF and are fully resistant (with allowances for some substances like matching cotton candy by mistake). The character's STR also equals the DEF x 5.[/quote']

 

Can you clarify this a bit? Object DEF isn't really that high (heavy wood furniture 4; 20 STR; concrete wall 6 DEF, 30 STR). Stats like that wouldn't be very competetive in most Supers campaigns. Maybe if they were additive, but then 2d6, Standard Effect of this power gets 38 points worth of effect (+30 STR no figured and +6/+6 Armor), limited by needing a 6 DEF object (call that -1/4 and I guess we're in the game).

 

Seems to me it would be easier to just buy the maximum STR and rDef, with a limitation (IIF, probably) reflecting the need for an object of the appropriate DEF, and simulate the EB powers with VSE attacks limited similarly. Even then, this approach doesn't allow water to flow, rubber to bounce or electricity to flow through wires, so the VPP seems the superior build.

 

ASIDE: a SMART Absorbing Man would carry a chip of Uru or wear a belt of adamantium, wouldn't he?

[Intrope]

Re: Lack of Power coverage

 

ASIDE: a SMART Absorbing Man would carry a chip of Uru or wear a belt of adamantium' date=' wouldn't he?[/quote']

Or get a an admantium filling in one of his teeth.

[Captain Liberty]

Re: Lack of Power coverage

 

Can you clarify this a bit? Object DEF isn't really that high (heavy wood furniture 4; 20 STR; concrete wall 6 DEF, 30 STR). Stats like that wouldn't be very competetive in most Supers campaigns. Maybe if they were additive, but then 2d6, Standard Effect of this power gets 38 points worth of effect (+30 STR no figured and +6/+6 Armor), limited by needing a 6 DEF object (call that -1/4 and I guess we're in the game).

 

ASIDE: a SMART Absorbing Man would carry a chip of Uru or wear a belt of adamantium, wouldn't he?

 

Absorbing Man never got anywhere absorbing the structure of wood or concrete, but you may have a point. It might have to be additive or have a multiplier in there somewhere. Perhaps that's the base power and multipliers are available just as they are for movement. Absorbing Man, after all, is the epitome of the power. Amazing Man from the old All Stars Squadron is probably not in the same league (though a lot faster).

 

As I said, I am working on it, and not exactly full time.

 

Another modifier would probably be something like "Duplicates other effects."

 

There are a lot of possibilities, and I really hate VPPs unless they are being used for a situation where the user can literally do anything.