Any tips for high point characters?

[nexus]

As you all may know I am running the Seeds of Change PBEM (Hopefully to be starting soon!). Its about the highest post game I've run and I was wondering did anyone have any tips or suggestions for high power/point Champions characters. I'm used to the 250-350 point level with character generally retired about 450-500 point level.

[Metaphysician]

Re: Any tips for high point characters?

 

Playing or GMing?? Design or usage??

[nexus]

Re: Any tips for high point characters?

 

Mainly gming. Usage and design. Any tips at all would be welcome.

[Derek Hiemforth]

Re: Any tips for high point characters?

 

Your original post refers to "high power/point Champions characters." The first thing I'd suggest is to decide whether you want both of these things to be true or not. High point does not necessarily equal high power. (At least, not proportionally... if 350-point characters average 12d6 attacks, that doesn't necessarily mean 700 point characters average 24d6 attacks.) Decide how much you want the increased point totals to drive up power levels, vs. how much you want them to increase character flexibility and depth.

 

Also be wary of fixed-cost powers. They become more attractive buys the more points you have to spend. If the points will be very high (say, 500+), it may be worth increasing the cost of Powers like Desolid and Invisibility.

 

Obviously, the scope probably needs to be broader than in a typical Champions campaign. Foes that can challenge 700 point heroes probably don't spend lots of time purse-snatching or focussing on a single city.

[Guest WhammeWhamme]

Re: Any tips for high point characters?

 

Your original post refers to "high power/point Champions characters." The first thing I'd suggest is to decide whether you want both of these things to be true or not. High point does not necessarily equal high power. (At least, not proportionally... if 350-point characters average 12d6 attacks, that doesn't necessarily mean 700 point characters average 24d6 attacks.) Decide how much you want the increased point totals to drive up power levels, vs. how much you want them to increase character flexibility and depth.

 

Also be wary of fixed-cost powers. They become more attractive buys the more points you have to spend. If the points will be very high (say, 500+), it may be worth increasing the cost of Powers like Desolid and Invisibility.

 

Obviously, the scope probably needs to be broader than in a typical Champions campaign. Foes that can challenge 700 point heroes probably don't spend lots of time purse-snatching or focussing on a single city.

 

Okay, while this is nice, Nexus has the PCs finished stats.

 

Here's my advice (but frankly, I need it as much as he does... my campaign is slightly newer. )

 

1) Think Big.

You know all those villains you looked at and said "No way man, that's just obscene..." - well, run a sample combat. Realize your PC's apesmash him. Wince.

 

2) Think Bigger.

Bad Guys are Elemental Forces, Evil Dictators in the Doom Model, and mutants whose powers would make Superman jealous.

 

3) Impact.

If the Players are realistic, their characters should impact the world immensely. Depose dictators. End wars. Use Mental Powers to forcibly end age old hatreds. Whatever happens, they should change the world so much that this time next year, a new player goes "wtf? how did all THAT happen?"

 

Or not. If they don't, then rationalize it. Keep them busy. Hope their psych lims make them like the status quo. Avoid whacking them over the head with the Good Guy NPC stick.

 

 

4) Think OTHER stuff bigger.

It's not just the challenges that need to be larger than life. The bad stuff needs to be epic too. Superman isn't just an orphan; he's the last member of his race. And the good stuff - it's not just an innocent bystander you saved, you brought water to the whole of the Sahara.

 

5) Don't forget the good old Mirror.

It never hurts to have them fight themselves, or an equivalent.

[Metaphysician]

Re: Any tips for high point characters?

 

Number one bit of advice I'd give: don't push the players. Let them, IC and OOC, decide where they are going to go. If the players would like to, say, hunt down Eurostar, then give them an opportunity. If the characters themselves have specific reasons to hunt down Eurostar in particular, than keep in mind they may not *need* an opportunity; just enough available time to apply their own capabilities.

 

Conversely, keep in mind how other people in the world respond to what they do.

[Guest Champsguy]

Re: Any tips for high point characters?

 

Number one bit of advice I'd give: don't push the players. Let them, IC and OOC, decide where they are going to go. If the players would like to, say, hunt down Eurostar, then give them an opportunity. If the characters themselves have specific reasons to hunt down Eurostar in particular, than keep in mind they may not *need* an opportunity; just enough available time to apply their own capabilities.

 

Conversely, keep in mind how other people in the world respond to what they do.

 

Hey, we did that once!

 

We were sitting around, and somebody mentioned: "Hey, isn't Eurostar still out there? Let's go get 'em." So in about 5 minutes, we tracked them down to some beach house in southern Italy (large scale mental powers rock). Five minutes after that, we zipped out of the sky and knocked the crap out of half their team. They never even knew what hit 'em.

[OddHat]

Re: Any tips for high point characters?

 

While I agree with almost all of the above, let me add:

 

In 1989 or so, I started a Champions campaign that lasted untl 2001, when one of the original players passed away. That pretty much ended that. Even at the start, I knew that Captain Kaos was gong to become the world's strongest man, Harlequin the most powerful Mortal mage (important distinction), Paladin the most bad ass gadgeteer, Captain Robot the Mightiest Mecha, and Mindflair the Earth's Most Powerful Mentalist. Over the years they quickly grew into those roles, and in the last few years of the campaign it was often very hard to find challenges that would even slow them down. Armies of Amazons? No problem. Vampires? They laugh at Vampires. Godzilla? Paladin one shotted Godzilla on his second adventure with a laser bolt to the eye.

 

The adventures and scenes that we still talk about are the funny ones, and the ones with human content, and the bits that became running jokes. Captain Chaos missing on move throughs and causing massive property damage. Paladin finally outsmarting Invictus and getting him transfered to Antartica. The Illusionist's Alien Penguin Army. Mindflair realizing that Harlequin was no longer emotionally human. Every pair of UNTIL and PRIMUS agents asking Paladin if he'd built Captain Robot, and exchanging money after the bet was settled.

 

Many others.

 

The point of all that is yes, have the big battles, let the character have fame and let them change the world. However, remember that the drama and comedy aspects of the campaign become even more important. Superman II is fun to watch for the Amazing Powers, but the scenes between Chris and Margot (and Gene Hackman) were at least as important to the story as the effects.

[Rapier]

Re: Any tips for high point characters?

 

I ran the same Champions campaign from 1991 until earlier this year. Towards the end I was getting really tired of champions. When you have 8 1000pt characters its hard to bring up real challenges. "Oh gee, save the world again? Let me just finish my cocoa."

 

I would urge you to set, in your mind, what your goals are for the campaign. How long do you plan on it lasting etc. While my players were still having a blast, it took more and more out of me to get ready for each game...and I wasn't enjoying it as much as I used to.

 

Don't fall into my pit and just let things drag on endlessly. Oh, I'm being a downer. It wasn't all that bad, and I wasn't hating it. Heck, it last 13 years.

 

Just keep in mind the growth progression and consider how you are going to bring new characters into play. If 6 months into the game somone wants to retire a character it REALLY sucks to be the guy built on 350 points when everyone else is running around with 800.

 

Best of luck to ye, and have yourself a blast.

[Guest Worldmaker]

Re: Any tips for high point characters?

 

Don't be afraid of running multiple stories at once. Right now the Guardians team is fighting the GGU's Hulk-equivalent's rampage against the logging industry, an alien invasion that's sent their orbital headquarters spiralling into the Earth's atmosphere, a war between two rogue mentalist factions, and a plot by Lord Doom to clone various politicians from around the world to help him gain control.

 

All without being able to talk to each other because of the communications disruption caused by the loss of their HQ.

 

Basically, I suppose what I am saying is that its okay to dilute the team's strength if you avoid doing it in a ham-handed manner.

[GoldenAge]

Re: Any tips for high point characters?

 

I've been GMing Champs since the late 80s. I've done everything from 100 point low level games and up, from Sci-Fi to full 4-Color superheroes... Not that I've done a great job all the time, but I have learned a few things.

 

First, rather than setting point levels alone, you'll need to set power levels too. A clever player can take 250 points and create a monster! It's just as Derek said above.

 

Second, keep the heroes guessing. Like Worldmaker says, sub plots and stories that run beneath the main plot line are the meat and potatoes that keep your campaign moving along smoothly.

 

In addition, mix up your villains and their power levels. Many GM's match their villains with their heroes or make them much stronger. This leads to very exciting and drawn-out battles... fun stuff. But lets get a bit more sophisticated...

 

There's no reason why a 150-point wannabe villain can't look REALLY menacing or dangerously influence the world. What then happens when the heroes let loose with all of their awesome might against this very impressive foe... only to accidentally KILL him in one blow. Wow, what a conundrum... now they're murderers. So, maybe next time they'll be more cautious... and that hesitation could be their downfall! Mix it up and be creative. Point levels will seem to dissolve and pure characters will emerge.

 

Remember... points are only creation tools. The real campaign should be about characters. 2000-point characters in one game are still run by the same people who played in that 150-point game. It’s just as easy to enrage, frighten, and confuse them in one game as it is in the other. Work off of the PLAYERS feelings as well as their characters disadvantages.

 

When I play a large campaign (say 400 points plus) I ask a bit more from the players. These characters are huge and should come with some baggage. Have them participate in the construction of their own environment. Complete histories including associations with people, places and things are a must. Usually, if the players put some time into it, they'll provide enough material to last a lifetime and in so doing will help you customize the campaign to them. A game is SO much better when the story is directly tied to the characters involved. Save the world… blah. Save your daughter from a bloody fate worse than death (and, perhaps, the world at the same time?)… now you’re getting somewhere. Tug on those heartstrings!!!

 

Lastly, play loose. Know your world inside out and be able to adapt! These guys will have the power to significantly influence their environment. You’ll have to balance that with a bit more work and attention to detail. What is happening across town when the heroes choose to go the other direction? If the heroes defeat a significant threat who/what rushes in to fill the void? These guys aren’t operating in a vacuum. Your world is a living animal. It breathes and grows despite what the characters do to influence it.

 

Oh, and as far as power becoming an issue over time… it can happen, but comic book characters are always in an evolutionary state. Often they loose or gain new abilities and motivations. Try this once in a while to keep them on their toes. But, if you do, remember to hold on the character's original concept… It’s their character, they’ve worked hard to make him/her and it’d be a shame to bastardize someone’s favorite creation in order to promote your own megalomaniac machinations.

 

Enjoy!