Missiles as vehicles

[MisterVimes]

Originally posted by Syberdwarf2

After glancing through the description of the Nuclear Missile in SH, I have to say that personally, I like the writeup. Basically, the point I've been trying to make is that the Missile is not the attack. The Nuclear Explosion is the attack. The Missile part is just a means of transportation to deliver the attack. That same attack could be delivered by car, plane, motorcycle, or crazy nut with a backpack full of plutonium on a bicycle. The missile/rocket just gets it to the enemy.

 

It's all abou the sfx... and that's an excelent one.

[Aroooo]

Originally posted by Dr. Anomaly

3) With a missile-as-vehicle, you have a chance to outrun it, evade it, lead it back so it smacks into the launching vessel, etc. -- all classic literary and cinematic bits -- and you can't do that vs. a normal RKA, unless you want to define it as a really strange variant of Missile Deflect/Reflect.

 

You know, this is the most compelling reason I've seen yet to build a missile as a vehicle - no offense to everyone who's chimed in on this.

 

Originally posted by Syberdwarf2

Missiles ARE vehicles. Every 'Missile' (i.e. Rocket, not an arrow or bullet) consists of two parts.

 

True. But to play devil's advocate for a moment, that's not how Hero thinks. Its about the effect, not the mechanics - but you know that

 

Thanks again to everyone who chimmed in here.

 

Aroooo

[Aroooo]

missiles in a dogfight

 

Okay, in keeping with the thought that a missile is a vehicle (at least built as one ), how would you handle a missile in a dogfight?

 

Starfighter A is in a dogfight with Starfighter B. In one turn, B launches a missile at A. Now you have 3 vehicles the dogfight. How is it resolved?

 

This also begs the question, how do you handle a dogfight with multiple participants? 3 on 3 for instance... The writeup in 5E talks mainly about 1 on 1. I'm thinking that everyone rolls their combat piloting, and those numbers are compaired to each other as you figure out who is attacking whome - essentially the 3 on 3 becomes 3 1 on 1's.

 

Aroooo

[Syberdwarf2]

Re: missiles in a dogfight

 

Originally posted by Aroooo

Okay, in keeping with the thought that a missile is a vehicle (at least built as one ), how would you handle a missile in a dogfight?

 

Starfighter A is in a dogfight with Starfighter B. In one turn, B launches a missile at A. Now you have 3 vehicles the dogfight. How is it resolved?

 

This also begs the question, how do you handle a dogfight with multiple participants? 3 on 3 for instance... The writeup in 5E talks mainly about 1 on 1. I'm thinking that everyone rolls their combat piloting, and those numbers are compaired to each other as you figure out who is attacking whome - essentially the 3 on 3 becomes 3 1 on 1's.

 

Aroooo

Starfighters A&B are being controlled by a pilot,(be it a person or an AI). Such an entity will be able to make snap decisions of his own accord, reacting to conditions in a dogfight and maneuvering.

A missile, fired at said starfighter, will either be a smart bomb variant or a dumb missile. A dumb missile will pull an energizer bunny an just keep going, and going, and going....

A smart missile would have a computer in it with a very simple program; "Go to specified destination" (the target ship). It may also have other programs such as "Follow/Track last designated target". It would be able to maneuver after said fighter, but like any other vehicle, it might be outmaneuvered. However, it will only follow the instructions it is given prior to its being fired.

[Aroooo]

Vindicated

 

Okay, I'm not trying to sound like a jerk or anything, but I finally got my copy of TUV, and on page 130, it says you CAN build a missile as a RKA with the Extra Time limitation. I feel vindicated

 

On a serious note, as I've been working on my B5 ships, it makes more sense building missiles as RKA's instead of vehicles if you use the Dogfighting and Intercept Combat (instead of mapped combat).

 

Aroooo

[AnotherSkip]

Re: Vindicated

 

Originally posted by Aroooo

it makes more sense building missiles as RKA's instead of vehicles if you use the Dogfighting and Intercept Combat (instead of mapped combat).

 

Aroooo

 

 

Probably a good reason to do it differently, sometimes the Gm has to build things differently rather than how the book exemplifies it simply for ease of mechanics.

 

After all there is no right way in HERO!

 

 

[AlHazred]

Originally posted by AnotherSkip

After all there is no right way in HERO!

 

Sure there is.

 

I've got my Right Way. You've got your Right Way. They can be completely different Right Ways. The beauty of Hero System is they can all still work.

[Vanguard]

Also away of thinking is this. It's also depends on the TYPE of missle you're trying to build.

 

Personally, I would go with something like this. If the missile is something like a Maverick or a Sidewinder, I'ld build as a normal RKA with appropriate Advantages and Limitations. If it was something like a Tomahawk Cruise missle .. Vehicle all the way.

[Aroooo]

Originally posted by Vanguard

Also away of thinking is this. It's also depends on the TYPE of missle you're trying to build.

 

Personally, I would go with something like this. If the missile is something like a Maverick or a Sidewinder, I'ld build as a normal RKA with appropriate Advantages and Limitations. If it was something like a Tomahawk Cruise missle .. Vehicle all the way.

 

True. Something that takes a long time to target, or is really big, I would build as a vehicle. But for B5 anyway, most ship-to-ship missiles I plan on just making various RKA's.

 

Aroooo

[Syberdwarf2]

Originally posted by Aroooo

True. Something that takes a long time to target, or is really big, I would build as a vehicle. But for B5 anyway, most ship-to-ship missiles I plan on just making various RKA's.

 

Aroooo

 

I just wanted to clarify my earlier post. I see your point as well as Vanguard's. Big Stuff gets built as a vehicle (possibly with a computer etc) where a 'dumb' missile would be an RKA.

My point I was trying to make before was mainly concerned with ICBMs and the like. Sorry if I was unclear.... was just trying to make a point about the 'Big Stuff'.

[Armitage]

Re: Vindicated

 

Originally posted by Aroooo

Okay, I'm not trying to sound like a jerk or anything, but I finally got my copy of TUV, and on page 130, it says you CAN build a missile as a RKA with the Extra Time limitation. I feel vindicated

 

On a serious note, as I've been working on my B5 ships, it makes more sense building missiles as RKA's instead of vehicles if you use the Dogfighting and Intercept Combat (instead of mapped combat).

 

Aroooo

 

The previous edition of Star Hero had a -1/2 Limitation called Slow Missile.

An attack with the Limitation wouldn't actually hit until the end of the segment when it was fired. Anyone within range can use a Defensive action, i.e. Abort, to attempt to shoot the missile at any point along its flight path.

The missile's DCV equals the OCV at which it was fired and any attack with at least half as many damage classes as the missile will destroy it.

It could probably be adapted to 5th edition with additional Limitations as the travel time is shifted down the Time Chart. Using Extra Time as a guide, maybe -1/4 for end-of-segment and an additional -1/4 per step down the time chart. You can make additional attacks, making it better than Extra Time, but it's balanced by the interception capability.