aid and succor

[wowie]

My apologies.. i placed it in the wrong forum..

 

need advice on aid and succor

 

I'm working on a 50active point limit..

 

I'm wondering if i read this right, Aid and Succor are the same except Succor only works if you continue to pay end.

 

Well what if you have a succor power say 8d6 with +1/4 cost endurance to activate only. doesn't this mean that you gain the benefit of aid at a cheaper cost because aid only does say 5d6 worth of additional advantages but succor delivers 8d6 worth of advantages? at the same active point cost?

 

also, say you used up aid/succor already to increase a certain power, does this mean that you can use it again to increase another power or does this mean that its just like a power boost that allows you to increase 1 characteristic at a time and if you used it all up, you can't say cast it again unless you move the increased points to another power?

 

also can you distribute the points you get along a group? say i cast 5d6aid, giving me 25 points worth to allot, i have either 5 powers or 5 people i'd like to boost, can i give each a 5point bonus or i can only use it on 1 person/power?

[Super Squirrel]

Re: aid and succor

 

My apologies.. i placed it in the wrong forum..

 

need advice on aid and succor

 

I'm working on a 50active point limit..

 

I'm wondering if i read this right, Aid and Succor are the same except Succor only works if you continue to pay end.

 

Well what if you have a succor power say 8d6 with +1/4 cost endurance to activate only. doesn't this mean that you gain the benefit of aid at a cheaper cost because aid only does say 5d6 worth of additional advantages but succor delivers 8d6 worth of advantages? at the same active point cost?

It says that the +1/4 Costs Endurance to Activate is only for Constant powers. You would have to first buy it as a Constant power before you could use it and at that point you are back up to normal Aid's cost.

 

Instead, as a GM, I would permit Succor to be considered Constant as far as Uncontrolled as an advantage is concerned. I would permit a player to buy Succor (Uncontrolled) and dump in the END they want for it. It would raise the characteristic or power until the paid END is gone and then drop the power. That is probably closer to what you want in this case.

 

8d6 Succor with a +1/4 is 50 Active Points. Instead, you could go with 8d6 Succor and buy an END Reserve for the power. Endurance Reserve 40 END and 8 REC (Personal REC) costs only 8 points and for a SPD 4 character would keep a Succor going for 4 Turns plus two additional phases.

 

also, say you used up aid/succor already to increase a certain power, does this mean that you can use it again to increase another power or does this mean that its just like a power boost that allows you to increase 1 characteristic at a time and if you used it all up, you can't say cast it again unless you move the increased points to another power?

AID can be used over and over again. Succor can also be used multiple times but you the END cost stacks. So a 5 END Cost Succor for one target means you spend 5 END per phase but two targets you spend 10 END per phase.

 

also can you distribute the points you get along a group? say i cast 5d6aid, giving me 25 points worth to allot, i have either 5 powers or 5 people i'd like to boost, can i give each a 5point bonus or i can only use it on 1 person/power?

Aid alone effects a single characteristic or power determined at the time you create the power. If you take Variable Effect you can change where the points go. Remember though with AID that you have a single target per casting. So Person A gets it one Phase Person B gets it a the next Phase. Of course you could have Area of Effect or Autofire to try and use it on multiple targets at once. I personally would avoid this unless your are looking for some sort of Clerical Blessing type spell and then I'd use an Area of Effect with Selective Targeting.

 

I hope this helps.

[wowie]

Re: aid and succor

 

it does.. thanks a lot!

[Super Squirrel]

Re: aid and succor

 

Not a problem. It actually was a good way to pass some of my third shift. Saturday mornings are very slow at work.

[Zed-F]

Re: aid and succor

 

It says that the +1/4 Costs Endurance to Activate is only for Constant powers. You would have to first buy it as a Constant power before you could use it and at that point you are back up to normal Aid's cost.

Succor is a Constant power. If you buy Continuous for your Succor, it becomes a Continuous power, which is not the same as a Constant power.

 

As a Constant power, multiple instances of a Succor power can be applied to the same or different targets on successive phases; however, each such application requires an attack action. Of course you must pay END to maintain each instance of the Succor.

 

If bought as Continuous, the first use of the Succor power will cause additional applications of the power to be applied to the same target (each costing additional END) every phase the power is maintained. These additional instances of the Succor power don't require attack actions or attack rolls and are applied automatically as long as the target stays in LOS. Since you can't shut off the Continuous advantage, there will be severe limits to how long the Succor can be maintained.

 

Continuous + Costs END to Activate makes the power work more like a regular Succor as far as END costs go -- each phase you pay only the cost to activate the new Succor instance. That makes the END cost work out the same as if it were a regular Succor with no advantages on it.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: aid and succor

 

For those considering Succor that Costs END only to activate, I refer you to the rules board and the thread of the same title as this. Steve's ruling is that Succor is not a power on which "Costs END only to activate" applies. While I don't always agree with Steve's rulings, this one makes perfect sense to me.

 

I would also treat Succor and END similar to mental powers, as discussed in the FAQ:

 

Q: Can a character reduce the END cost of keeping a continuing-effect Mental Power from deteriorating?

 

A: At the GM’s option, if a character wants to reduce the END required to keep a Mental Power from deteriorating, he must buy Reduced END for the power with the Limitation Only Applies To END Spent To Maintain Effect (-0). This is separate from any Reduced Endurance bought to reduce the END for using the power in the first place, and requires GM’s permission.

 

Thus, the cost of eliminating the "maintenance END" on Succor would be a +1/2 advantage, rather than a +1/4 advantage. Your Succor would then cost END each time you used it, but would not cost END to maintain.

 

This doesn, however, raise another concern.

 

AID, costs END would cost 10/1.5 = 6.67 per d6.

Succor, no END to maintain, would cost 5 * 1.5 = 7.5 points per d6.

 

Is this an adequate cost differential for elimination of the cap, even given the power will shut off entirely if the user is stunned or KO'd?

[Nevenall]

Re: aid and succor

 

Another difference between the two Powers is that all the points gained from Succor disappear as soon as the power is turned off.

Points gained from Aid will fade at their normal rate, no matter what happens to the Aid power.

[Southern Cross]

Re: aid and succor

 

And it's possible to buy down the fade rate of an Aid power,which isn't possible with Succor.

[wowie]

Re: aid and succor

 

Aid, +1d6 Body. Self only (-1/2), Only to starting values (-1/2), Always on (-1/2), Continuous (1), Persistent (1/2), Inherent (1/4). - could i make this variable so it restores anything that might be drained and restore it to its original values?

[Sean Waters]

Re: aid and succor

 

Succor is cheaper, costs END, has does have a maximum to the number of points that can be succored as per any adjustment power, but multiple applications stack it has no fade rate but points remain as long as the power is maintained (then immediately diasappear), and it is constant and requires an attack action to use. It doesn't exist in that form in any game I run.

 

END to activate should generally only be bought for certain appropriate BODY powers (as it says in the description). I would not allow it for succor.

 

Sean 'No Fun' Waters

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: aid and succor

 

Aid' date=' +1d6 Body. Self only (-1/2), Only to starting values (-1/2), Always on (-1/2), Continuous (1), Persistent (1/2), Inherent (1/4). - could i make this variable so it restores anything that might be drained and restore it to its original values?[/quote']

 

Sure. BUt it caps at 6 CP, so you get 3 BOD back (or 6 CP of anything), after which you're back to losing normally (and those will mostly fade each PS 12). Plus, I believe Continous shuts off once you're Aided the maximum, and you need to activate it again.