Faster Healing rate on Transform

[Psylint]

Hey folks,

 

What do y'all think of an limitation on transform:

 

"Target heals back Body of the Transform every Turn at the same rate the target heals Body per Month"

 

Would you allow it in your campaign, and if so at what value?

 

Thanks

[schir1964]

Re: Faster Healing rate on Transform

 

From the [thread=42607]New Power Ideas[/thread] thread.

[thread=38248]Timechart Advantage[/thread]

 

Not exactly what you had in mind but certainly something to look at.

 

- Christopher Mullins

[Lucius]

Re: Faster Healing rate on Transform

 

I'd say the value should be based on how many steps you move up the time chart. Frankly, recovering that quickly sounds like quite a limitation. It makes your Transform attack a very temporary condition.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

Transform Palindromedary to Palinbactrian

[Psylint]

Re: Faster Healing rate on Transform

 

It's what I was thinking for getting effective short term Mind Control that avoids Breakfree rolls:

 

4d6 Major Transform (into "my personal slave"), heals back normally REC per Turn (8 steps up on the time Chart) -2. (Active Cost 60, Real Cost 20)

 

If I weren't worried about an Active Point Cap, I'd add BoECV +1, Line of Sight +1/2. (Active 150; Real 50).

 

Most of the Advantages of Mind Control and:

1. no breakfree rolls

2. Cumulative with infinite maximum

3. Much Longer Duration (the probability of even an extremely good roll on a Mind Control lasting a Turn is astronomically remote).

[ghost-angel]

Re: Faster Healing rate on Transform

 

Easily a -2 Limitation in my book.

[Sean Waters]

Re: Faster Healing rate on Transform

 

It's what I was thinking for getting effective short term Mind Control that avoids Breakfree rolls:

 

4d6 Major Transform (into "my personal slave"), heals back normally REC per Turn (8 steps up on the time Chart) -2. (Active Cost 60, Real Cost 20)

 

If I weren't worried about an Active Point Cap, I'd add BoECV +1, Line of Sight +1/2. (Active 150; Real 50).

 

Most of the Advantages of Mind Control and:

1. no breakfree rolls

2. Cumulative with infinite maximum

3. Much Longer Duration (the probability of even an extremely good roll on a Mind Control lasting a Turn is astronomically remote).

 

Well 4d6 gives you 14 points of effect, average, and so you would need 2-3 hits to make someone into your personal slave (so, 2-5 attacks, probably), and an average target would recover in 2-8 turns (depending on characteristics within a reasonable average range). A normal you could get and keep for a long time. Well, 10 turns, which is quite a while - a minute and a half. Superheroes are likely to be a lot less as REC tends to be proportionally higher against BODY.

 

I'd say, on an eyeball approach, that makes it quite a bargain at 20 points, but the cost is about right IMO for the limtiation. It is a bargain because transform is such an effective power, not because the limtiation is too great. It is for that reason as a GM I might conditionally veto the power (you can have it but I reserve the right to take it away and make you buy something else if I feel it is unbalancing in play. Well, the power itself is not unbalancing but the cost benefit is pretty good.

 

I'm not sure about your point 2: once the transform takes effect you can't keep the transformt opped up: the target just has to heal twice their Body - addiitonal applications do not make it take longer for them to recover.

 

As for Mind COntrol - don't write it off.

 

12d6 effect is 42 points average - so Ego+20 or Ego +30 on most targets. Say an average super has 15 EGO, you get +27 effect - Ego =20 can take someone out of combat completely, so that is pretty good, and you would get +1 against breakouts. Target has Ego roll of 12-, modified to 11- for the extra effect on their next phase, then 12- one turn later (not next PS12) and then 13- after a minute, 14- after 5 minutes.

 

No sure thing but you can certanily hold someone a lot longer with your mind control than your transform.

 

My main GM objection though is that it seems to be just using transform to circumvent inconvenient mind control rules. That would ring alarm bells for me. Might also depend on the sfx and backstory, and the rest of the build - but I would be lookign carefully.

[Sean Waters]

Re: Faster Healing rate on Transform

 

Actually it seems to me you'd be happier with a 6d6 cumulative mind control with double the max points (+3/4) for 52 points. It is a mental power, which sounds like what you want, it has max effect of 72 points, it has no active cost problems.

 

It can start affecting a lot of targets instantly (albeit at a low level of effect), and whilst you do have to worry about breakout rolls, by the time you've cranked the effect up to maximum, opponents will be making those rolls at -4 to -6, and you can therefore expect to hold them for between an hour and a day, maybe longer. 3-4 hits will see this at max effect, and 2-3 hits will see it affecting most targets at the Ego+30 level.

[ghost-angel]

Re: Faster Healing rate on Transform

 

It's what I was thinking for getting effective short term Mind Control that avoids Breakfree rolls:

 

4d6 Major Transform (into "my personal slave"), heals back normally REC per Turn (8 steps up on the time Chart) -2. (Active Cost 60, Real Cost 20)

 

If I weren't worried about an Active Point Cap, I'd add BoECV +1, Line of Sight +1/2. (Active 150; Real 50).

 

Most of the Advantages of Mind Control and:

1. no breakfree rolls

2. Cumulative with infinite maximum

3. Much Longer Duration (the probability of even an extremely good roll on a Mind Control lasting a Turn is astronomically remote).

 

Missed something, that Sean pointed out.

 

Number 2: Cumulative.

 

Yep, it's cumulative right up until you Transform someone. After that your Transform has no effect on them unless you're using it to Transform them into something else.

 

Number 3: If they miss their initial Breakfree Roll and their Next Phase Breakfree Roll your Mind Control automatically goes to the Turn level.

[Psylint]

Re: Faster Healing rate on Transform

 

Two things:

 

1. I'm not sure Ego +20 will take anyone out of combat for long, maybe it would be enough for "Hit somebody else! Pretty please", but I'm not sure it would be enough for "Stand around like a dope." and certainly wouldn't be enough to "Attack your fellow Terrorist!" or "Release the hostages" or "Surrender".

 

If I simply wanted to make someone stop, a Mental Entangle works much better.

 

2. Even at 11-, the breakout roll will succeed 65-ish percent of the time, and thus I get nothing for my endurance. At least with the transform, once it takes effect it'll work for at least 1 Turn.

 

You're right, I'm trying to get around the Breakfree roll, because I think it's a bad mechanic. A target shouldn't be able to absolutely negate a 50 or 60 pt. power 60% of the time, for 0 pts.

[Dust Raven]

Re: Faster Healing rate on Transform

 

It's what I was thinking for getting effective short term Mind Control that avoids Breakfree rolls:

 

4d6 Major Transform (into "my personal slave"), heals back normally REC per Turn (8 steps up on the time Chart) -2. (Active Cost 60, Real Cost 20)

 

If I weren't worried about an Active Point Cap, I'd add BoECV +1, Line of Sight +1/2. (Active 150; Real 50).

 

Most of the Advantages of Mind Control and:

1. no breakfree rolls

2. Cumulative with infinite maximum

3. Much Longer Duration (the probability of even an extremely good roll on a Mind Control lasting a Turn is astronomically remote).

 

So, you get all that, plus all that more, for 1/3 the cost? Count me in as against the idea of placing a value on this "Limitation". It's a -0 at best. You're just defining the heal back conditions, which could be anything.

 

Compare the two options: Mind Control vs your Transform. Which would you pick if you had the choice? Does the Transform make Mind Control obsolete? I think it does.

 

An alternative though: Instead of using Transform, use a regular Mind Control, but add in Ranged Negative Skill Levels to reduce the target's EGO Roll.