Martial Arts Help!

[MrThou]

Uh, hello. Welcome to my first post on these boards ever!

But enough about me, i need a lil help.

 

Im running a Martial Arts game using hte ultimite MArtist, (and im new to heros) I have a couple rule questions/concerns.

 

Dodging. I need a way for this not to be such an arse saver. +5 ish DCV!? for only 1/2 and action and 1 END? Am i missing something? Or is that true. Should it be true, what do you guys recomend to make it less devistating? Ive been toying with the idea of a variable dodge. Spend end upto your dodge. So if you want to do a full dodge, 5END, if you think 2 will do it, 2 END. This will be done Before numbers are tossed around the room.

And the dodge DCV dosnt stack with whatever manuver you did correct? Example. Yu-Sool strike 0/+2, the dodge would only be -/+5 and not +7 correct?

But as an alternative, if i had 3 combat lvls (in all my martial art manuvers) i could instead have a 0/+6 using my strike right?

 

Also Blocking, I think blocking should be harder based upon how well your openite hits you. Say he needs an 11 to hit you, rolls a 9, your block diffaculty is harder by 2. So if i where blocking with a 15, id need a 13. anyone try that?

 

 

Any other suggestions for this kind of game?

 

Just for a lil more info, im running a 150pt game, 75/75.

and im new to the heros game, not to RPing and rule mangling

 

Thanks!

[MoonHunter]

It is not that tough to overcome

 

The Dodge DCV bonus is fairly self correcting.

 

First: Use the Dodge to your own advantage. If your players are saving their arses. Let your NPCs do the exact same technique. It sounds like the play style and tactics that your group uses is making dodge more effective than it is in most campaigns. Eventually someone will try a different tactic or focus on offsensive levels to keep up with the defensive abilities found in the campaign. Eventually this will even out over the course of the campaign.

 

To help things along... think of the following.

 

While you are dodging, you are not attacking. Take advantage of these phases to move your NPCs and Mooks into better positions. A few people with ranged attacks (guns or throwing stars, can keep a team dodging, while a horde of NPCs come towards them. Eventually you have people on all sides of them, with those bonuses, and eventually someone will roll lucky and take down the massive DCV character.

 

A martial manuver and one or two levels (with their one specialized manuver) and they overcome the Dodge advantage. This is good for low level types, as they will not be generally great martial artists, but one trick pony's. (We have seen them in the movies the guy with this one attack they do over and over again).

[MrThou]

Thanks

As for using hte same same move over and over, after the second time someone uses a manuver is a row. i apply a bonus to the defender, because he knows how it works now and sees it comming.

 

The bonus is lost after a nother manuver is tossed intot he mix.

[Roth]

As this is a subject near and dear to my heart I'll take a stab. I've been using the martial maneuvers in champions since Danger International came out with the original stuff in 87 or so... The martial dodge isn't that much higher than the regular dodge of +3 dcv. At +5 dcv your players are supposed to be using it to save their asses. That's what it's there for. If they are continously using as an excuse to not attack then have a high cv, high skill villain come in and take them apart as an object lesson. Or some kind of npc master who is there to help them.

The variable end dodge is interesting, but as most 75/75 characters will only have between a 30- 40 end this is not a good way to go, people will only buy their End up.

Blocking again is supposed to be a saver, and can be hard to pull off if your heroes and villains are fairly seperate on their OCV. If you want to use a better hit equals a harder block go head... it's really that way anyways. If the villain has a high enough OCV it's going to be harder to block... and is supposed to end your phase anyways.

[JMHammer]

Can't Dodge and Attack Simultaneously

 

MrThou said:

And the dodge DCV dosnt stack with whatever manuver you did correct? Example. Yu-Sool strike 0/+2, the dodge would only be -/+5 and not +7 correct?

 

The DCV bonus from a Dodge will stack with any levels applicable to that maneuver but will NOT stack from any DCV bonus from another manuever because it can NOT be performed simultaneously with another maneuver. A Dodge is a half-phase action that ends the character's phase, just as an attack action ends the character's phase. Therefore, your example is not possible unless you've house-ruled that it is. (If you have, that's what's causing your problem, I think.)

 

If a character has +1 with Kung-fu, +1 with HTH Combat, and +1 with All Combat, he can Dodge and set all three of his levels to assist his DCV. Assuming this character is performing a standard +5 DCV Martial Dodge, he will have +8 DCV vs HTH attacks and +6 DCV vs ranged attacks (because neither the level with Kung-fu nor the level with HTH Combat can add to DCV vs ranged attacks). But he can't Dodge and perform any other combat maneuver in the same phase.

 

Somewhat related: When a player in my games says, "I'm going to half-move to here [points on map] and then Dodge," I do assume the character is Dodging the entire phase and so is protected by the improved DCV for the entire movement portion of his action.

 

Anyway, as some others have already pointed out, don't worry about your players having their characters perform good dodges and blocks. Especially if you're playing a martial arts campaign, it's totally in-genre to do so. (Heck, if I were involved in combat I know that most of MY actions would be a Dodge or Block!) They'll get hit eventually, albeit not often, and area effect attacks - especially area entangles (nets, etc.) - will still allow the bad guys to grease them if you simply have to put them down for story purposes.

 

And don't forget that the bad guys can Dodge and Block, too!

 

John H

[Lord Liaden]

As JMHammer points out, make sure that your players are only getting ONE attack action per phase. Even though Dodge is a half-phase maneuver, it has to be the only attack action taken in a phase, like any of the other maneuvers, and the character can't perform any other type of action after it's been executed.

 

As to the more general issue of dealing with high DCV characters, try giving their opponents some Area of Effect attacks. All the DCV in the world makes no difference to these. A few explosive or gas grenades (in a modern setting) or blinding Flash bombs (an old ninja trick, hence appropriate for many historical campaigns) will whittle them down in short order.

[JmOz]

As has been pointed out, if you dodge YOU CAN NOT ATTACK, this is a big disadvantage

[Lord Liaden]

BTW, MrThou, Welcome! New blood is always appreciated around here (especially by the folks who also play White Wolf).

[MrThou]

Wha? If you dodge, you cant attack?

*snaps his fingers hoping his book magically appears, witch it dosnt...*

damnit, make me get off my ass....

So, you can abort to dodge, so you lose your next attack eh?

Problem solved

[JMHammer]

When Can I Dodge?

 

MrThou said:

So, you can abort to dodge, so you lose your next attack eh?

 

You can also just declare a Dodge as part of your regular phase so that it will remain in effect from that point until the beginning of your next phase or until you abort to some other maneuver, are knocked out, etc. But yes, if you Dodge in a phase - whether due to an abort or a regular use of a half-phase action - you can't attack in that same phase.

 

John H

[MrThou]

Well that is no longer a problem then

Huzzah to you guys on the boards!

 

If i allready didnt have my board addiction elsewhere, i would stay here