shadowcats vehicular insanity shop: Orel Ulyanovsk Class CVN

[shadowcat1313]

this was the soviet attempt at building a carrier to match the Nimitz Class, it was actually scrapped when about 40% complete.

 

Orel Ulyanovsk

 

Player:

 

Val Char Cost

160 STR 0

11 DEX 3

 

64 BODY 24

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

3 SPD 9

 

 

 

 

0" RUN -12

13" SWIM 0

0" LEAP 0

Characteristics Cost: 174

 

Cost Power

Propulsion Systems

3 1) Combined Nuclear and Steam Powered : Swimming +11" (13" total) (11 Active Points); Surface Only (-1), Side Effect (propeller does KA 2d6 to anyone coming in contact with bottom stern of vehicle, occurs automatically, only affects environment around vehicle; -3/4), Limited Maneuverability (-3/4), Crew-Served ([3-4] people; -1/2) [Notes: uses the same propulsion system as the Kirov class]

13 2) Ships Generators: Endurance Reserve (32 END, 32 REC) (35 Active Points); OIF Bulky (-1), Crew-Served ([3-4] people; -1/2), Custom Modifier (Real Gear; -1/4)

0 3) Water Vehicle: Ground Movement -6" (already figured in)

35 4) Large Boat's Anchor: +100 STR, Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (150 Active Points); Partial Coverage (-2), OIF Bulky (-1), Custom Modifier (Real Gear; -1/4)

2 5) Heavy Anchor Chain: +10 BODY (10 Active Points); Partial Coverage (-2), OIF Bulky (-1), Custom Modifier (Real Gear; -1/4)

42 6) Fire Extinguishing System: (Total: 188 Active Cost, 42 Real Cost) Detect Unauthorized/Uncontrolled Fires 14- (no Sense Group) (8 Active Points); Only Within Affected Area (20" x 20" zone; -2), Costs Endurance (-1/2) (uses Personal END) (Real Cost: 2) plus Dispel Fire Powers 20d6, all Fire powers simultaneously (+2) (180 Active Points); Only Within Affected Area (20" x 20" zone; -2), 4 Charges (-1), Costs Endurance (-1/2) (uses Personal END) (Real Cost: 40)

15 7) Fire Extinguishing System: 7 more Fire Extinguishing Systems

Tactical Systems

82 1) SSN-19 Shipwreck Missile: Killing Attack - Ranged 8d6 (vs. PD), Autofire (3 shots; +1/4), Armor Piercing (+1/2), MegaScale (1" = 100 km; 550km max range; +3/4), Can Be Scaled Down 1" = 1km (+1/4) (330 Active Points); OIF Bulky (-1), Custom Modifier (must have active radar or sonar lock to fire; -1/2), Custom Modifier (Minimum range of 20km; -1/2), Extra Time (Extra Segment, -1/2), Real Weapon (-1/4), 12 Charges (-1/4) [Notes: Cross Sword FCS]

47 2) UDAV-1 ASW System: Killing Attack - Ranged 3d6+1 (vs. PD), Increased Maximum Range (4,375"; +1/4), Area Of Effect (One Hex; +1/2), 50 Charges (+1/2), Autofire (5 shots; +1 1/2) (187 Active Points); OIF Bulky (-1), Dropped (-1/2), Custom Modifier (Requires an active sonar contact; -1/2), Real Weapon (-1/4), Crew-Served (2 people; -1/4), Inaccurate 1/2 OCV (-1/4), Limited Arc Of Fire (180 degrees; -1/4) [Notes: Front Half]

5 3) a second UDAV-1 system: Custom Power (5 Active Points) [Notes: Rear Half]

Defensive Systems

93 1) SA-N-11 Grisom: Killing Attack - Ranged 4 1/2d6 (vs. PD), Semi-Armor Piercing (+1/4), Increased Maximum Range (6,550"; 8km max range; +1/4), Explosion (+1/2), 128 Charges (+3/4), Autofire (3 shots; +1 1/4) (280 Active Points); OIF Bulky (-1), Custom Modifier (Radar Guided; -1/2), Real Weapon (-1/4), Limited Arc Of Fire (180 degrees; Front Half; -1/4) [Notes: Hot Flash FCS]

5 2) a second SA-N-11 System: Custom Power (5 Active Points) [Notes: Rear Half]

19 3) SA-N-9 Gauntlet SAM Battery: Killing Attack - Ranged 3d6+1 (vs. PD), Autofire (3 shots; +1/4), MegaScale (1" = 1 km; +1/4), 96 Charges (+3/4) (112 Active Points); Extra Time (1 Turn (Post-Segment 12), -1 1/4), OIF Bulky (-1), Custom Modifier (Fires once per tun; -1/2), Custom Modifier (can fire up to 5 missiles per turn; -1/2), Custom Modifier (Radar Guided with secondary IR guidance; -1/2), Custom Modifier (Works versus Air Targets Only; -1/2), Real Weapon (-1/4), Crew-Served (2 people; -1/4), Limited Arc Of Fire (180 degrees; -1/4) [Notes: Cross Sword FCS]

5 4) a second SA-N-9 System: Custom Power (5 Active Points) [Notes: Rear Half]

8 5) Decoy Dispensers: Darkness to Sight and Radio Groups 1" radius, MegaArea (1" = 100"; +1/4) (19 Active Points); OIF Bulky (-1), Real Weapon (-1/4), 12 Charges (-1/4)

4 6) Systems Armoring: +8 DEF (24 Active Points); Partial Coverage (covers 600 Hexes; -5), Ablative BODY Only (-1/2)

16 7) EMP Hardening: Power Defense (20 points) (20 Active Points); Only Works Against Limited Type Of Attack (EMPs, electronic warfare attacks, and the like; -1/4)

5 8) ECM Systems: Radio Group Flash Defense (5 points)

79 AK-630 CIWS: Multipower, 179-point reserve, (179 Active Points); all slots OIF Bulky (-1), Custom Modifier (Real Weapon; -1/4)

1u 1) Defense Mode: Missile Deflection (all physical projectiles), Full Range (+1) (30 Active Points); OIF Bulky (-1), Requires 10 Charges Per Use (-3/4), Custom Modifier (Real Weapon; -1/4)

7u 2) Attack Mode: RKA 4d6+1 (vs. PD), +1 Increased STUN Multiplier (+1/4), Armor Piercing (+1/2), Autofire (10 shots; +1) (179 Active Points); OIF Bulky (-1), Limited Arc Of Fire (360 Degrees above the ship; -1/4), Custom Modifier (Real Weapon; -1/4) (uses Personal END)

15 7 more AK-630 for a total of 8: Custom Power (15 Active Points) (uses Personal END)

Sozbezie-BR ECM Suite

44 1) Wine Glass/Bell Push Jammer Package: Suppress Electronic Warfare 8d6, any Power one at a time (+1/4), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2), No Range Modifier (+1/2), Increased Maximum Range (11,250"; about 7.5 miles; +1/2) (110 Active Points); OAF Bulky (-1 1/2)

5 2) ECM Systems: Radio Group Flash Defense (10 points) (10 Active Points); OIF Bulky (-1)

Sensors and Commo

13 1) Top Plate/Strut Pair Radar Package: Radar (Radio Group), +4 to PER Roll, Increased Arc Of Perception (360 Degrees), Telescopic: +15, MegaScale (1" = 10 km; +1/2), Can Be Scaled Down 1" = 1km (+1/4) (55 Active Points); OAF Bulky Fragile (-1 3/4), Custom Modifier (Range Varies by Target Size; -1/2), Costs Endurance (-1/2), Crew-Served (2 people; -1/4), Custom Modifier (Real Gear; -1/4) (uses Personal END)

8 2) Ox Yoke Hull Mounted Sonar: Active Sonar (Hearing Group), +1 to PER Roll, Increased Arc Of Perception (240 Degrees), Telescopic: +2, MegaScale (1" = 1 km; +1/4) (24 Active Points); OIF Bulky (-1), Costs Endurance (-1/2), Crew-Served (2 people; -1/4), Custom Modifier (Real Gear; -1/4) (uses Personal END)

8 3) Electronic Support Measures: Detect A Large Class Of Things 14- (Unusual Group), Ranged (+1/2), MegaScale (1" = 10 km; +1/2), Can Be Scaled Down 1" = 1km (+1/4) (34 Active Points); OIF Bulky Fragile (-1 1/4), Extra Time (1 Turn (Post-Segment 12), -1 1/4), Costs Endurance (-1/2), Crew-Served (2 people; -1/4) (uses Personal END) [Notes: Detect Electronic Emissions]

3 4) Long Range Enhanced Optics: +5 versus Range Modifier for Sight Group (8 Active Points); OIF Bulky Fragile (-1 1/4), Custom Modifier (Real Gear; -1/4)

2 5) Sensor Control Systems: +2 with Systems Operation (4 Active Points); OIF Bulky Fragile (-1 1/4), Custom Modifier (Real Gear; -1/4)

6 6) Communications System: HRRP (Radio Group), Discriminatory, Analyze (22 Active Points); OIF Bulky (-1), Affected As Sight And Hearing Group As Well As Radio Group (-1/2), Costs Endurance (-1/2), Crew-Served (2 people; -1/4), Custom Modifier (Real Gear; -1/4) (uses Personal END)

2 7) Ships Tactical Data Net: Teamwork 11- (7 Active Points); OIF Bulky (-1), Crew-Served ([3-4] people; -1/2), Costs Endurance (-1/2), Custom Modifier (Real Gear; -1/4) (uses END Reserve)

7 8) Naval Tactical Data Link: Mind Link , Machine class of minds, Specific Group of Minds, Number of Minds (x16) (30 Active Points); OIF Bulky Fragile (-1 1/4), Only With Others Who Have Mind Link (-1), Costs Endurance (-1/2), Custom Modifier (Real Gear; -1/4) (uses Personal END)

Operations Systems

1 1) Bridge and Helm: +2 with Combat Piloting (4 Active Points); OIF Bulky (-1), Crew-Served ([3-4] people; -1/2), Costs Endurance (-1/2), Custom Modifier (Real Gear; -1/4) (uses Personal END)

5 2) Combat Information Center: (Total: 14 Active Cost, 5 Real Cost) KS: Enemy Forces and Target Profile Database (5 Active Points); OIF Bulky (-1), Costs Endurance (-1/2), Custom Modifier (Real Gear; -1/4) 12- (uses Personal END) (Real Cost: 2) plus KS: Sensor Profile Database (5 Active Points); OIF Bulky Fragile (-1 1/4), Costs Endurance (-1/2), Custom Modifier (Real Gear; -1/4) 12- (uses Personal END) (Real Cost: 2) plus +2 with Tactics (4 Active Points); OIF Bulky (-1), Costs Endurance (-1/2), Custom Modifier (Real Gear; -1/4) (uses Personal END) (Real Cost: 1)

4 3) Fire Control Systems: +2 with Ranged Combat (10 Active Points); OIF Bulky Fragile (-1 1/4), Costs Endurance (Only Costs END to Activate; -1/4) (uses Personal END)

Personnel Systems

2 1) Ships Environmental Systems: Life Support (Eating: Character only has to eat once per week; Safe in Intense Cold; Safe in Intense Heat) (5 Active Points); OIF Immobile (-1 1/2), Crew-Served ([3-4] people; -1/2) [Notes: Ships stores and consumables]

2 2) Ships Sick Bay: +2 with Paramedics (4 Active Points); OIF Bulky Fragile (-1 1/4)

2 3) Ships Maintenance Shops: +2 with Mechanics (4 Active Points); OIF Bulky Fragile (-1 1/4), Custom Modifier (Real Gear; -1/4)

2 4) Ships Maintenance Shops: +2 with Electronics (4 Active Points); OIF Bulky Fragile (-1 1/4), Custom Modifier (Real Gear; -1/4)

3 5) Ships Armory: +2 with Weaponsmith (Firearms, Missiles & Rockets) (7 Active Points); OIF Bulky Fragile (-1 1/4)

1 6) Damage Control Systems: +2 with KS: Emergency Damage Control (2 Active Points); OIF Bulky Fragile (-1 1/4), Custom Modifier (Real Gear; -1/4)

5 7) Cryptography Section: Cryptography 14- (13 Active Points); OIF Bulky Fragile (-1 1/4), Custom Modifier (Real Gear; -1/4), Crew-Served (2 people; -1/4)

2 8) Ships Administrative Support Systems: +2 with Bureaucratics (4 Active Points); OIF Bulky Fragile (-1 1/4)

Aircraft

5 1) Custom Power (5 Active Points) [Notes: 27 SU-27K, 20 SU-25, Yak-44 Radar Picket, 20 Helicopters]

Powers Cost: 633

 

 

 

 

Cost Talent

1 Absolute Range Sense (3 Active Points); OIF Bulky Fragile (-1 1/4), Custom Modifier (Real Gear; -1/4)

1 Bump Of Direction (3 Active Points); OIF Bulky Fragile (-1 1/4)

Talents Cost: 2

 

Total Character Cost: 809

 

Pts. Disadvantage

20 Distinctive Features: warship (Not Concealable; Extreme Reaction [fear]; Not Distinctive In Some Cultures)

Ship Statistics

0 1) Top Speed in Knots

0 2) Propulsion Type

0 3) Maximum Range

0 4) Crew

Disadvantage Points: 20

Base Points: 757

Experience Required: 32

Total Experience Available: 0

Experience Unspent: 0

[Egyptoid]

Re: shadowcats vehicular insanity shop: Orel Ulyanovsk Class CVN

 

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[shadowcat1313]

Re: shadowcats vehicular insanity shop: Orel Ulyanovsk Class CVN

 

thanks for posting that, I meant to post that or the dockyard art from Globalsecurity.org and hadnt gotten around to it

[Ian Mackinder]

Re: shadowcats vehicular insanity shop: Orel Ulyanovsk Class CVN

 

1) Ships Environmental Systems: Life Support (Eating: Character only has to eat once per week;

 

Thoughts about the alleged horrors of Soviet-era military rations somehow come to mind.

 

Otherwise, impressive. Never knew that the SU had ever considered anything like this. Interesting to note that, other differances aside, the flight deck looks VERY similar in general shape and design to the US's CVNs.

[shadowcat1313]

Re: shadowcats vehicular insanity shop: Orel Ulyanovsk Class CVN

 

it doesnt say they eat well....

[Vulcan]

Re: shadowcats vehicular insanity shop: Orel Ulyanovsk Class CVN

 

Thoughts about the alleged horrors of Soviet-era military rations somehow come to mind.

 

Otherwise, impressive. Never knew that the SU had ever considered anything like this. Interesting to note that, other differances aside, the flight deck looks VERY similar in general shape and design to the US's CVNs.

 

It's one of those cases where form follows function. The Nimitz class CVN is exquisitly well designed to put a mobile airbase onto a ship. It has evolved from nearly a century of aircraft carrier development. A Soviet version would naturally follow much of the same forms because it's the most effective way to do it. Unless you came up with a radical improvement, changing things would probably make it less effective.

[shadowcat1313]

Re: shadowcats vehicular insanity shop: Orel Ulyanovsk Class CVN

 

the soviet CVN carries fewer aircraft, but is far better defended, and has its own SSM battery also.

[Ian Mackinder]

Re: shadowcats vehicular insanity shop: Orel Ulyanovsk Class CVN

 

It's one of those cases where form follows function. The Nimitz class CVN is exquisitly well designed to put a mobile airbase onto a ship. It has evolved from nearly a century of aircraft carrier development. A Soviet version would naturally follow much of the same forms because it's the most effective way to do it. Unless you came up with a radical improvement' date=' changing things would probably make it [i']less[/i] effective.

 

True. Up to a point.

 

Whilst the CVN flight deck is the product of approximately 80 years of continuous development in naval aviation, it is not the last word in that field. It is one particular design that has evolved for one particular area of requiirements.

 

Furthermore, there is a huge gap between physically replicating the design (presumably using spy-plane photos and articles clipped from magazines) and getting it to work. In particular, it is about the people operating said item - that takes years of training, even when there is a significant backlog of experience to draw from. The SU operated several hybrid criuiser-carriers (notably, the 'Movska' and 'Kiev' classes), so they had some grounding in naval aviation, but this would be a BIG move up from that level.

 

As regards military technology, the Soviets were never slouches at innovation and problem-solving; it was usually quality-control that messed them up. On that basis, I would expect them to bring their own perspective to bear on this design. In other words, it might kinda look like a Nimitz knock-off, but I expect that, if it had ever been commissioned, the SU would have used it very very differently. NOT, for example, to stomp Yank CVNs - that is what their subs and long-range aircraft were for.

 

The apparent "ski-jump" in the bow is interesting. Royal Navy carriers had something like this for launching Harriers, but they didn't include catapults (as far as I know). This seems to be a combination of both ski-jump and catapult. Wonder if this was a compromise design (uncertainty whether their catapults were powerful enough?) or if there was another reason?

[shadowcat1313]

Re: shadowcats vehicular insanity shop: Orel Ulyanovsk Class CVN

 

my guess would be the ski jump on the long section of the deck, and the cats on the angled part, IIRC theres at least one current or on the boards design set up the same way

[Spence]

Re: shadowcats vehicular insanity shop: Orel Ulyanovsk Class CVN

 

 

The apparent "ski-jump" in the bow is interesting. Royal Navy carriers had something like this for launching Harriers, but they didn't include catapults (as far as I know). This seems to be a combination of both ski-jump and catapult. Wonder if this was a compromise design (uncertainty whether their catapults were powerful enough?) or if there was another reason?

 

The catapult is still one of the things that hasn't been replicated in a reliable deployable form by anyone but the US. I am sure that other countries have figured out the design in theory, but that is a different thing from adapting the theory to work within an existing warship design. US carriers are designed to support its launch/recovery system as well as powerplant from the keel up.

 

Try a search for CVN-21

[shadowcat1313]

Re: shadowcats vehicular insanity shop: Orel Ulyanovsk Class CVN

 

current catapults are steam powered, they are working on electromagnetic cats for the CVN-21

I thought the Angled Deck was a brit idea originally? the ski jump probably was

 

http://www.naval-technology.com/projects/cvn-21/

[Spence]

Re: shadowcats vehicular insanity shop: Orel Ulyanovsk Class CVN

 

current catapults are steam powered, they are working on electromagnetic cats for the CVN-21

I thought the Angled Deck was a brit idea originally? the ski jump probably was

 

http://www.naval-technology.com/projects/cvn-21/

 

Back in the beginning of Naval Aviation the "black sheep idiots" who believed in the aircraft were a pretty mixed bag of nationalities. I can remember reading where the mention of "angle decks" was mentioned in theory as early as the 30's. But without a functional catapult the angle deck is not feasible.

 

And while they are indeed steam powered and getting a steam powered catapult that can fire isn't that hard. Ensuring the catapult applies the exact needed energy to bring a multi ton aircraft to launch speed from a standing stop, not rip the attachment point/landing gear off, not blow the ram out of the end of the launch guide and be able to recycle the system for multiple continuous launches for literally hours is the problem.

[Ian Mackinder]

Re: shadowcats vehicular insanity shop: Orel Ulyanovsk Class CVN

 

I thought the Angled Deck was a brit idea originally? the ski jump probably was.

 

Pretty sure the angled flight deck was a British development. Think the steam catapult was originally one of theirs as well.

[Vulcan]

Re: shadowcats vehicular insanity shop: Orel Ulyanovsk Class CVN

 

current catapults are steam powered, they are working on electromagnetic cats for the CVN-21

I thought the Angled Deck was a brit idea originally? the ski jump probably was

 

http://www.naval-technology.com/projects/cvn-21/

 

Yes, the angled deck was a British idea, and I think the steam catapult was too... Americans took it and ran with it.

 

You may even be right about the ski jump, I know the Brits use it on their baby carriers. The Russians also used it on their aviation ships, but I don't know if it was a parallel development or a copy.

 

The reason for the angled deck (the biggest similarity between this one and a US CVN) is a matter of function. First, you can lauch planes off the bow and still have planes land across the angled deck. (In practice, this is rarely done because of the limited 'deck space' on even a CVN.) Second, a plane landing on an angled deck can miss the arresting wires and take back off - a 'bolter' as the US Navy calls it. On a straight-deck carrier the plane missing the wires could plow straight into the planes that landed before it. While there were safety procedures to prevent this in WWII, with the advent of the much larger and heavier jets these became inadequite.

[Yansuf]

Re: shadowcats vehicular insanity shop: Orel Ulyanovsk Class CVN

 

Pretty sure the angled flight deck was a British development. Think the steam catapult was originally one of theirs as well.

 

Both correct.

And the Royal Navy was perfectly able to operate modern carriers with catapults, they did into the 1970's. The decision to downsize to "jumpjet" mini-carriers was a political one for reasons of economy.

As I understand it, they plan to build a real CV again soon.

[Vulcan]

Re: shadowcats vehicular insanity shop: Orel Ulyanovsk Class CVN

 

Good for them, I'm glad to see the British getting back into the Navy business in a serious way again. It was kind of depressing watching them cripple themselves in the '70s and '80s. But the timing seems a bit strange.

 

Does anyone know the political reasoning behind this?

[Ian Mackinder]

Re: shadowcats vehicular insanity shop: Orel Ulyanovsk Class CVN

 

Good for them' date=' I'm glad to see the British getting back into the Navy business in a serious way again. It was kind of depressing watching them cripple themselves in the '70s and '80s. [/quote']

 

As I understand it (and I could be out of date on this), there are plans for the RN to get two CVNs. The hulls are to be built in France, I believe. Make of that what you will.

 

Worse news otherwise. I also understand that the British government will be cutting W-A-Y back on a lot of other surface units - halving numbers in the frigate / destroyer classes, for instance. Also heard that RN personnel promotions are to be mainly frozen for the next few years, also due to budget constraints. The Royal Australian Navy (amongst others) is expecting to get a sizable influx of ex-RN personnel out of this.

[Tom]

Re: shadowcats vehicular insanity shop: Orel Ulyanovsk Class CVN

 

Combined nuclear & steam propulsion? Sorry, but that caught my eye, and it's been a long time since I really tried to keep up with what the various navies were doing. Does that imply dual nuclear/conventional power plants, or a nuclear power plant feeding a steam turbine for propulsion?

 

(US nuclear vessels use the latter, by and large...)

[shadowcat1313]

Re: shadowcats vehicular insanity shop: Orel Ulyanovsk Class CVN

 

it has 2 completely different plants

[Ian Mackinder]

Re: shadowcats vehicular insanity shop: Orel Ulyanovsk Class CVN

 

As I understand it (and I could be out of date on this)' date=' there are plans for the RN to get two CVNs. The hulls are to be built in France, I believe. Make of that what you will.[/quote']

 

For those who may be remotely interested:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queen_Elizabeth_class_aircraft_carrier

[shadowcat1313]

Re: shadowcats vehicular insanity shop: Orel Ulyanovsk Class CVN

 

there going conventional propulsion with them actually, cost reasons among other things

 

The MoD decided not to use nuclear propulsion due to its high costs.[17] The carrier's propulsion system will be Integrated Full Electric Propulsion (IFEP) with Rolls-Royce Marine Trent MT30 36 MW gas turbine generator units.