Background Story Rewards

[Laundry Knight]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

Since I started this, perhaps, I should participate more. As far as rewarding an occasional skill or favor or whatever based on a story background, I would mainly be measure for cohesiveness. I don't expect everyone to be an English major, and on my part, I have appreciated games where I have received extra contacts and such that I could not afford even if the contact was never used. I had know idea how much or how little was given to the other players, but I didn't mind because I enjoyed my character the way he was.

 

As far as balance (especially within a supers campaign), that is up to how the story is written. As an example, let say you have two players. One wants to play the Silver Age Superman and the other wanted to play the Silver Age Atom. Superman would be built with a far greater number of points than the Atom and would have an advantage (I won't say unfairly disadvantaged because they freely choose their characters) in most scenarios, but let's say that the GM had a bias for the Atom or his player or against Superman or his player and was of the sort to let his biases be felt in his game. If so, he could write every adventure where the villain always had kryptonite and all of his schemes had flaws that could be exploited by micro-sized character. Based on GM bias, it is Superman who is being unfairly disadvantaged by the GM and not by differences in points.

 

Based on the example, granting extra rewards to one player or another does not in of itself create unfair disparity, and based on my personal example, as long as everyone is having fun with the character he is playing, there is no disparity.

 

As for the player who is unable or unwilling to come with a good story background, he is being reward by not having to create one and instead may jump into the game with little problem, and based on my experience, such a player would not get much kick out of the types of extra rewards I would offer anyway due to the fact that the main areas I would reward would be more useful for the roleplaying and detectiving parts of the adventure and my experience tells me that such players are more likely to set back and watch during such activities instead of participating.

[Christopher]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

The ability of characters to participate in many scenes is often largely dependent on character points. With' date=' say, 10 more points from writing a background, I can create a character exactly identical to yours, plus one overall level.[/quote']

So if you really, really try you can absue it. Isn't that something that can happen with every rule?

You yourself pointed out that point totals are only half the measure a fact to wich I agree. The way you expend these points is even more important. Knight makes a very good point regarding that.

 

That in turn means that a sufficient amount of times it will not be unbalancing and work out. All others are things were the specific GM with his specific Group has to find a solution.

 

Sure does. Or it sounds like judicisously applying the rules' date=' just like spending my cp and xp to achieve a desired result - say, buying a level with HTH combat rather than a 1d6 Blast for my martial artist.[/quote']

No. In the example you gave (keeping my XP just under the amount needed for the next level, so I am considered to be at that level for some big, XP-worthy encoutner) is gaming the way how XP are awarded. Metagaming, nothing else.

 

So what makes 5% to 10% the magic number' date=' or the background more valuable than the between scenarios fanfic[/quote']

Nothing. I never claimed them to be the "one and only right". Just a personal guess.

 

Since I started this, perhaps, I should participate more. As far as rewarding an occasional skill or favor or whatever based on a story background, I would mainly be measure for cohesiveness. I don't expect everyone to be an English major, and on my part, I have appreciated games where I have received extra contacts and such that I could not afford even if the contact was never used. I had know idea how much or how little was given to the other players, but I didn't mind because I enjoyed my character the way he was.

 

As far as balance (especially within a supers campaign), that is up to how the story is written. As an example, let say you have two players. One wants to play the Silver Age Superman and the other wanted to play the Silver Age Atom. Superman would be built with a far greater number of points than the Atom and would have an advantage (I won't say unfairly disadvantaged because they freely choose their characters) in most scenarios, but let's say that the GM had a bias for the Atom or his player or against Superman or his player and was of the sort to let his biases be felt in his game. If so, he could write every adventure where the villain always had kryptonite and all of his schemes had flaws that could be exploited by micro-sized character. Based on GM bias, it is Superman who is being unfairly disadvantaged by the GM and not by differences in points.

 

Based on the example, granting extra rewards to one player or another does not in of itself create unfair disparity, and based on my personal example, as long as everyone is having fun with the character he is playing, there is no disparity.

 

As for the player who is unable or unwilling to come with a good story background, he is being reward by not having to create one and instead may jump into the game with little problem, and based on my experience, such a player would not get much kick out of the types of extra rewards I would offer anyway due to the fact that the main areas I would reward would be more useful for the roleplaying and detectiving parts of the adventure and my experience tells me that such players are more likely to set back and watch during such activities instead of participating.

Very true points indeed.

[Greywind]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

Not all characters started as the same exact moment in time, regardless of whether or not they start together in the game. I often use background stories, giving the player XP for it. The characters aren't (always) in competition with one-another. One player doesn't like writing up character backgrounds and all answers are police-statement short. The same player often comes up with crazy ideas that work and is an excellent RPer, regularly getting an XP ahead here and there. This often makes up for the beginning bonus that other players are willing to write backgrounds for.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

A major question I typically come back to is whether this is intended as a bonus for those few players who take the time to write a background, a campaign expectation (in which case why not just raise the base points and say "a background is expected/required") or a way to "get" that one annoying player who ticks me off because he never bothers to write a background - as long as he persists in his wrongbadfun gaming, everyone else gets extra points he doesn't share in (so it's really a penalty for refusing to write a background, not a bonus for doing so).

 

I don't give extra points for complying with the ground rules of the game in any other way. If a background is expected, provide one. If it's not, then provide one if you want, provide it up front if you like or make one later if you prefer. If it makes the game more fun for you, you'll provide one. If not, you won't. I don't give extra points for providing a true blue Super for a Supers game, or a Fantasy character for a Fantasy game, for sticking to the point limits, or for remaining within the campaign DC, Defense, CV or other limits. Why would I change the character's point totals because the player does, or does not, write a background?

 

And what if the player says "fine - I'll write a $#*%ing background, then writes utter crap * or something that steps on the campaign assumptions as much as possible.

 

* OPTION A: After soundly thrashing Dr. Destroyer on live television, Mr. Magnificent was lauded by the governments of the world, and beloved by all the world's peoples. He recently moved to Campaign City where he hopes to join a superteam and continue protecting the people of Earth.

 

* OPTION B: [stolen from a buddy from some years back from a D&D game - in response to "that annoying guy who never writes a background"):

 

[state character's name] lives only to be the best [select one: fighter; spellcaster; healer; stealthy trap disarmer] he can possibly be. He has trained all his young life towards this goal. Being very introverted, his only real friends, contacts or colleagues are [name some or all of the other PC's]. His major interest is seeking our opportunities to enhance his [select one: fighting; spellcasting; healing; sneaking and trap disarming] skills. He seeks a bold band of adventurers so that he can test and hone his skills at [select one: fighting; casting spells; healing; disarming traps and sneaking], and earn or loot funds to better equip himself for [fighting; spellcasting; healing; sneaking and disarming traps].

 

When he is not adventuring, [state character name, preferably the one from the 1st para] spends his time practicing his ability to [select one: fight; cast spells; heal; sneak and disarm traps], seeking out new and better equipment to [select one: fight; cast spells; heal; sneak and disarm traps] and hoping to overhear rumours of new people he can meet, and places he can go, to learn to enhance his [select one: fighting; spellcasting; healing; sneaking and disarming traps] prowess, whether through training or equipment or both, and opportunities for gainful employment with those who value the skills of [select one: fighting; spellcasting; healing; sneaking and disarming traps].

[Christopher]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

I don't give extra points for complying with the ground rules of the game in any other way.

So players can take less complications, but still recieve the full points in your games?

[Bodkins Odds]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

That doesn't follow at all. He said he didn't give "extra" points for following the ground rules. That doesn't say anything about whether he'll penalize for not following them.

 

I could see giving a couple of points for going above and beyond the baseline assuming that it wasn't just an attempt to hog face time, but I'm inclined to agree with Hugh here. Don't give extra points for meeting expectations.

[Christopher]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

That doesn't follow at all. He said he didn't give "extra" points for following the ground rules. That doesn't say anything about whether he'll penalize for not following them.

What is the difference?

When you give 250 including 150 complcaitions.

Or 260, including 150 compclations and a background.

[Bodkins Odds]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

What is the difference?

When you give 250 including 150 complcaitions.

Or 260, including 150 compclations and a background.

 

A background is either a requirement to play, or its an optional play aid and should only be worth points if it exceptionally improved the game. Those two examples only make sense if:

 

A) The GM gives points for backgrounds, which Hugh has said he does not.

 

or

 

The background was so exceptional as to be worth points anyway. Which is the exact same as an xp award for exceptionally good roleplaying, except it happened before the session started.

 

Hugh doesn't give points for backgrounds. Therefore, comparing not writing a background to not taking enough complications makes no sense as a reply to his statement.

 

His position, as I understood it, was that if he as a GM wants a background from his players then it is a hard requirement on the same level as not making an Iron Age anti-hero for a Silver Age campaign. Otherwise it's just extra detail that the player gave to the GM because he felt doing so was rewarding enough.

[Christopher]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

A) The GM gives points for backgrounds' date=' which Hugh has said he does not.[/quote']

That is fine for him. But what is the difference between the following three things:

a) 200 + 50 from complciations

150+ 100 from complications

c) 150+ 90 from complciations + 10 from background

 

All three summ up to a 250 point game. In all three cases the player can decide to take less point, for less work comming up with background/complcations (and dealing with them in game respectively).

Yet C is somehow imbalanced, because it is not a complication that gives the 10 points?

[Bodkins Odds]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

The difference is that complications are a soft requirement. If he doesn't want any he looses out, both in roleplaying and on character points.

 

A background, if it's a requirement at all (lord knows I hardly ever know enough about a character to write a real background until after I've played him), is a hard requirement. Either you have one or your character isn't ready to play.

 

That's the difference. Now if you wanted to make a background a soft requirement for your game, that's entirely within your rights. But I personally don't see any benefit from doing so.

[Christopher]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

The difference is that complications are a soft requirement. If he doesn't want any he looses out, both in roleplaying and on character points.

The background is 10 point. Most complcations are 10 points or more. I don't see that background being any "harder" than any 10 point complication. It is "softer" than any 15, 20, 25, 30, or 35 point Complication.

 

And if you start picking 5-pointers, it's propably because you do it for the points. You want the points, but you don't want it to be a relevant issue.

[Bodkins Odds]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

I don't think you and I are using the word soft in the same way. When I say soft, I mean that while it's expected that you'll have X points of complications you don't actually need to take X points of complications if your willing to loose character points over it.

 

If I decide that I want to require a written background at all, then that is hard requirement in that it is not at all optional. Either you wrote a background or you didn't meet the requirements of play.

 

Now, your perfectly free to make a background a soft requirement, but I wouldn't.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

So players can take less complications' date=' but still recieve the full points in your games?[/quote']

 

I'd say the expectation in my games is that the character will have X points of complications. As no one in our group has ever experienced any difficulty having the full complement, the question of what to do if you have less than the full complement has never really come up.

 

Mind you, I'm also the guy who suggested 6e follow the trend of including "skills as powers" and "characteristics as powers" by adding a power called "Reduced Complications" You would not then have a game where characters have 325 + 75 Complications points. You would have a game where characters have 400 CP and 75 Complications, hard and fast. If you want to spend CP (starting CP or XP) to offset complications, you can buy Reduced Complications. Your total points are unchanged. You could even buy "Special Glasses" - removes 10 point Nearsighted complication, OIF, 7 points.

 

That is fine for him. But what is the difference between the following three things:

a) 200 + 50 from complciations

150+ 100 from complications

c) 150+ 90 from complciations + 10 from background

 

All three summ up to a 250 point game. In all three cases the player can decide to take less point, for less work comming up with background/complcations (and dealing with them in game respectively).

Yet C is somehow imbalanced, because it is not a complication that gives the 10 points?

 

Is the background a Complication? Will it have equal impact in the game as a 10 point complication? If no, then the points are awarded for creative writing, not character building. If yes, then take the complication(s). And the character with 150 + 100 Complications + 10 Background = 260. If Background is a form of Complication, why can it be used to exceed the maximum?

 

Oh, and there is nothing wrong with a 5 point complication. I see them on occasion. They are infrequent, and of limited impact - so what? Most I have seen are taken because they fit the character, and that is what they stat out to. Sure, I could make it higher point - but that's not the concept. I could remove them outright - but that's also not the concept. If that DNPC that's linked to my character's background works out to 0 points, well and good - that's what the issue is worth. Writing it up in your desired length, spacing, font size and margins does not change its value.

 

I often see players with more than the maximum complications because it fits the character (especially now that 6e lowered the numbers!). So what? if the player decides one of them is too problematic, out of character, or just not interpreted by the GM in the same manner as the player, he can lower it or dump it (it's still there but no longer comes up in game, or he got over it). If he has 100 points instead of 75, then the GM can just de-emphasize the one(s) less relevant to his game.

 

If you want to make a background a requirement, great. If you want to give me an extra 10 points for writing one, that's fine too. But as long as some players take the bribe and others don't, it differentiates character power, and it is a bribe. If everyone writes a background, there's no difference between "250 points + 10 for a background" and "260 points and a background is required".

[Christopher]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

Is the background a Complication? Will it have equal impact in the game as a 10 point complication? If no' date=' then the points are awarded for creative writing, not character building. If yes, then take the complication(s). And the character with 150 + 100 Complications + 10 Background = 260.[/quote']

Is there are rules definition for "impact"? There are values for frequency and severity, but they can mean many things for many GM's. They can even mean something different between GM and player.

There is no way to quantify "impact", hence "impact" can never be compared. You can guess, but any two guesses will differentiate.

 

If Background is a form of Complication' date=' why can it be used to exceed the maximum?[/quote']

It isn't increasing the maximum. 260 is the REAL maximum. Always has been.

The same way in a 100+150, 250 Total with 150 Complications is the real maximum

And in a game 150+100, 20 Character Points set aside for base and perks and 25 in pre-defined complciations 230 Total with 75 points of Complications is the real maximum.

 

Oh' date=' and there is nothing wrong with a 5 point complication. I see them on occasion. They are infrequent, and of limited impact - so what?[/quote']

They likely become so insignificant and rare, that they are closer to "Backgroundstory/Off-time-story" element than a complciation.

[Laundry Knight]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

My main concern with starting this topic was that sometimes when I am making a character I find myself either needing a few more points to actualize the character I have visualized, and it seems to me that viewing the starting points as a suggested average rather than as a hard and fast rule would help players who need to round out a well-conceived character.

 

As an alternative, I have considered allowing players start out at a point deficit that would have to paid off in play; so, what is the view on my second option?

[Christopher]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

As an alternative' date=' I have considered allowing players start out at a point deficit that would have to paid off in play; so, what is the view on my second option?[/quote']

I think you mean stuff "that is flavor, but does not have much game effect".

 

I personally think it should be allowed for players to write down PS, KS and SS at 0 cost. But those 0 cost ones allso will have little effect in game. They might be plot devices, but nothing you can use.

When the player finds more use than expected, he has to pay for it the next time.

 

But then again I think for team superheroes at least we should mostly abolish the rules construct of complcations. Complications make sense with heroes in thier own title. But in a team of 5-7 there is little time to show of (or even the viewers to remember) every weakness of every hero.

I saw that strongly in the Justice League Animated series (and now Young Justice):

Secret Identity problems? Where?

Archnemesis popping up*? When and how often did they even considered themself personal foes?

Entire storyarc of the single Character Comicbookseries are compressed to one or two part episodes.

 

*Luthor and later Grond were the exception, but here they hated the entire League. They were more of a "danger Plot device". From all the villains of the Leaguers, they were the most likely to make a team.

 

Instead just write it down:

Superman looses his powers and can die when exposed to kryptonite.

Superman looses his powers when exposed to red sun radiation.

Superman is vulnerable to magic

Superman dates Louis Lane is his heroic ID.

 

On the other side, write down thsoe skills, powers and equipment that only have use in specific adventures as plot device:

Superman has a "base" called Fortress of Solitude at the North Pole.

Superman has a spaceship.

Superman has a secret identity.

 

For GL the list might include "is part of the lantern corps". Afaik that only ever played a role in two storylines, out of 5 Seasons.

[strayth]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

I used to do this, but not anymore. The whole point is for them to have fun, and some of them differ from others in terms of how that happens. I do tell them that if they don't give me a summary or at least some vague points about their past, that they are allowing me to "write into it", in case I want to pull up an adventure seed and use them as a basis.

 

But even those aren't invasive, I just keep it simple.

[Manic Typist]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

Why not? It's just an extra complication when you put it that way. Or heck, it's just a narrative tying the complications you already have together.

 

So, fine, regard the background as a soft expectation. Write or or not, just don't claim to be penalized because you didn't do it.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

Is there are rules definition for "impact"? There are values for frequency and severity' date=' but they can mean many things for many GM's. They can even mean something different between GM and player. There is no way to quantify "impact", hence "impact" can never be compared. You can guess, but any two guesses will differentiate.[/quote']

 

Will you be running issues from the background to be as disadvantageous/problematic/complicated to the character as you would run issues arising from a 10 point complication? If yes, that is as functionally equivalent as "impact" ever gets. If no, then why is it worth as much as two 5 point complications or one 10 point complication (or stepping up 2 10 pointers to 15 pointers)?

 

It isn't increasing the maximum. 260 is the REAL maximum. Always has been.

 

Then we are back to a 260 point game with "background" as an expectation. And don't be unhappy when you get a background for a 400 point Super that provides a brief fluffy origin story, tells you how all those skills on his sheet were acquired (with implausible structures - "he reads a lot in the library and does well in science in high school" was good enough for Peter Parker), describes the rubber physics behind his super powers and spells out his complications in more detail, without actually adding any hooks (and perhaps even closing some off). You said x pages, y margins, z font was worth 10 CP.

 

They likely become so insignificant and rare' date=' that they are closer to "Backgroundstory/Off-time-story" element than a complciation.[/quote']

 

I suggest the breakpoint for complications which likely become so significant and rare that they are closer to "Backgroundstory/Off-time-story" element are the ones that math out to zero points or less. That's why we have a 5 point level - those are the ones just frequent and impairing enough to be a complication rather than a background element. And if background elements are not worth any points, why are you awarding 10 points for writing a background?

 

My main concern with starting this topic was that sometimes when I am making a character I find myself either needing a few more points to actualize the character I have visualized' date=' and it seems to me that viewing the starting points as a suggested average rather than as a hard and fast rule would help players who need to round out a well-conceived character.[/quote']

 

So raise the base points. I see no need to tie it in to writing a background, or to allow the points to only those players who are prepared to write a background. Often, the background identifies other areas where points should be spent.

 

As an alternative' date=' I have considered allowing players start out at a point deficit that would have to paid off in play; so, what is the view on my second option?[/quote']

 

If more points are needed to create the characters you want to see in play, increase the base points. There's no magic to 400 points (it was a different amount in each prior edition quite a ways back - 400 is no more perfect).

 

Why not? It's just an extra complication when you put it that way. Or heck, it's just a narrative tying the complications you already have together.

 

So, fine, regard the background as a soft expectation. Write or or not, just don't claim to be penalized because you didn't do it.

 

If every player but one always writes a background, and the GM and other players decide to award 10 points for writing a background, then it is a penalty. The decision was made to penalize "that guy" because he never writes a background - either he is penalized by loss of points available to the other characters (no, you can't take an extra 10 points of other complications instead - this is to teach you to write a background) or he is penalized by spending his time on an activity he does not find adds to the fun of running his character and playing the game.

 

Some players are getting extra points for doing something they always do anyway, others are being bribed to do the same and still others are denied those extra points for their refusal to do something that doesn't add to their enjoyment of the game (and I suspect you will find the reluctant background won't add much to anyone else's either). I don't see what else you can call that point denial - it is a 10 point penalty to the player who doesn't write a background (or who doesn't write one to your specifications).

[Greywind]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

So by that logic then, every player, every session receives the exact same amount of XP regardless of their contribution or lack thereof. Otherwise someone would be penalized.

[Manic Typist]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

If every player but one always writes a background' date=' and the GM and other players decide to award 10 points for writing a background, then it is a penalty.[/quote']

 

No, it's really not, but we've hashed that our pretty thoroughly in another thread.

 

To keep it relevant to this thread:

If every player but one always took the 50 points in Complications (and therefore the matching 50 CP associated with those Complications), is that one player penalized? I would say no, unless I wanted to say he was penalizing himself.

 

Restricting how the Complications are selected is common. "No more than X points from a single Complication" or "No more than Y points in Pysch Lims/Hunteds/Whathaveyou" or "No Casual Killers"

 

If you are willing to accept that type of behavior (I don't wish to presume you do, perhaps you reject the notion that the GM can require anything of the Complications), then this is the same. "No more than 50 points in regular Complications, no more than 10 points from a narrative that explains them/your character's past."

 

The decision was made to penalize "that guy" because he never writes a background

Again, no. You're inventing the "that guy" narrative. Assigning malicious intentions where there are none. If the decision is made "because I find Complications/backgrounds useful in running the game" then that motive doesn't exist, even if "that guy" does.

 

 

I "expect" a background in the same way that I expect players to come up with the Complications offered (and then I'm usually not surprised that they've come up with more, and accept that they are 0 point Complications). I don't require it, but I'd just be a little startled it if I didn't see it- just like I expect the character to have a name on the top of the sheet. "No, my character literally has no name. He doesn't even understand how to refer to himself yet- that's what I want to explore." I wouldn't reject a character out of hand for not having a name, no taking all 50 in Complications, or not having a background (which is, apparently, just another type of Complication).

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

If every player but one always took the 50 points in Complications (and therefore the matching 50 CP associated with those Complications)' date=' is that one player penalized? I would say no, unless I wanted to say he was penalizing himself.[/quote']

 

 

Is he? Some would say he is avoiding the penalty which would be imposed by another complication. A Vulnerability, Susceptibility or Unluck certainly seems a penalty, and a restriction in the actions you may freely take also seems like a penalty. If you don't want the penalty, don't take the character points.

 

I find the likening of a background to a complication is a poor analogy. What is the complication imposed by the background? If all it does is tie the character's skills, abilities and complications together, we would not award points for it. We don't award points for providing a good SFX structure for your power suite, nor for explaining why your character has an exceptional DEX or CON. Should we? Is that the award for a background? So what happens when one background doesn't provide these extra story hooks, cohesive whole of the character, links to the campaign world, personality sketch or whatever it was you wanted from the background? Does that character get less, or no, points because his background provides less, or none, of what it was intended to? Or was there some intrinsic purpose for demanding a page of FanFic?

 

If you are willing to accept that type of behavior (I don't wish to presume you do' date=' perhaps you reject the notion that the GM can require anything of the Complications), then this is the same. "No more than 50 points in regular Complications, no more than 10 points from a narrative that explains them/your character's past." [/quote']

 

So is the point to explain your character's past? Do I get the full 10 points for stating he was given up for adoption as an infant, grew up in an orphanage, never formed any real connections to anyone, at age 16 discovered his mutant powers (cue extensive description of how his mutant powers work, at least to his own knowledge) tie a bit of history in to his specific complications (already designed and awarded points) and closes with him leaving the orphanage at age 18 to seek his fortune?

 

Presumably, the player who writes a background making Wolverine's convoluted history, right up to present day continuity, seem pale and limited by comparison, has exceeded the 10 point requirement, but is capped at 10 points anyway. Seems reasonable as a "complication limit" (and we really don't WANT to encourage that much backstory, I agree, any more than we want a character with 350 points of Complications).

 

But what's the de minimis for 10 points, what's worth 5 points and what's not worth any? One line short of your full page requirement gets no points, so change his parents' names from Adam and Anne Green to Alexander Finnegan Fitzgerald and Elizabeth Josephine Montgomery-Fitzgerald to push the line break down and that tips the balance so 10 points has been well and truly earned? If that doesn't work, spell out "Doctor", "Missus" and "Mister"?

 

You're inventing the "that guy" narrative. Assigning malicious intentions where there are none. If the decision is made "because I find Complications/backgrounds useful in running the game" then that motive doesn't exist' date=' even if "that guy" does.[/quote']

 

I've seen the "that guy" scenario. It is one possible reason (because the GM wants that background, even when the player doesn't), and it is intended to penalize the player for failing to provide the desired background. You haven't said "a background is required to assist the GM in integrating the character into the campaign world", you've said "you get 10 points for coming up with a background, so if you can't be bothered, too bad - you get 10 points less than those who can be bothered".

 

If I take less complications, I have less points and less complications. There is a tradeoff, and I have made the choice to trade off those two items. Since we're not assessing the impact of the background on the character in any way, there's no similar tradeoff. Maybe that's why the game has complications, and not backgrounds.

 

I "expect" a background in the same way that I expect players to come up with the Complications offered (and then I'm usually not surprised that they've come up with more' date=' and accept that they are 0 point Complications). I don't require it, but I'd just be a little startled it if I didn't see it- just like I expect the character to have a name on the top of the sheet. "No, my character literally has no name. He doesn't even understand how to refer to himself yet- that's what I want to explore." I wouldn't reject a character out of hand for not having a name, no taking all 50 in Complications, or not having a background (which is, apparently, just another type of Complication).[/quote']

 

So how many points do I get for having a name, special effects for my powers and a typed, instead of hand scrawled, character sheet? Do I get points for describing my costume (or do I get to count that description as part of my background)? Do I get docked points if my background is handwritten? I'm not seeing the in game justification for awarding points for a background, any more than I see in game justification for giving a bonus if your math adds up and your character balances (of course, once I award the points, he doesn't balance any more, so that could be too complicated...), or if you bring your own copy of the rules instead of looking things up in someone else's book.

[Christopher]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

Will you be running issues from the background to be as disadvantageous/problematic/complicated to the character as you would run issues arising from a 10 point complication? If yes, that is as functionally equivalent as "impact" ever gets. If no, then why is it worth as much as two 5 point complications or one 10 point complication (or stepping up 2 10 pointers to 15 pointers)?

[...]

I suggest the breakpoint for complications which likely become so significant and rare that they are closer to "Backgroundstory/Off-time-story" element are the ones that math out to zero points or less. That's why we have a 5 point level - those are the ones just frequent and impairing enough to be a complication rather than a background element. And if background elements are not worth any points, why are you awarding 10 points for writing a background?

Don't the rules tell is somewhere that the Character sheet is NOT your tax delcaration?

(Edit: it's two paragraphs on 6E1 10)

 

What would be the proper, rules conform game involvement for a 60 AP Blast?

What about a 60 AP Blast in a mutlipower with other 60 AP attacks?

What about a 5 point detect?

What about a 3 point Life Support: No Need to eat?

What is the usability/unusablity quotient for every power?

 

Then we are back to a 260 point game with "background" as an expectation. And don't be unhappy when you get a background for a 400 point Super that provides a brief fluffy origin story' date=' tells you how all those skills on his sheet were acquired (with implausible structures - "he reads a lot in the library and does well in science in high school" was good enough for Peter Parker), describes the rubber physics behind his super powers and spells out his complications in more detail, without actually adding any hooks (and perhaps even closing some off). You said x pages, y margins, z font was worth 10 CP.[/quote']

So I already have:

Origin Story

Spends time in the library

Was in highschool (wich one?)

And some stuff about his power SFX.

 

Geez, how can you NOT work with that? It's basically a goldmine in front of you!

Please put on your reading glasses/glasses against shortsightedness, if you need them.

 

If every player but one always writes a background' date=' and the GM and other players decide to award 10 points for writing a background, then it is a penalty. The decision was made to penalize "that guy" because he never writes a background[/quote']

Could you please stop calling people you don't know a$$hole or moron?

Could you instead please asume that msot of the people you don't know use their brains in a regular fashion and are nice people?

 

So by that logic then' date=' every player, every session receives the exact same amount of XP regardless of their contribution or lack thereof. Otherwise someone would be penalized.[/quote']

Sean tells so.

Hugh says he has used it, but not what he prefers.

 

Of course everyone who uses it has not much to say to the thematic, aside from "I use a different system, that is it". And likely lacks any ground to argue, in lack of experience.

[Manic Typist]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

Is he? Some would say he is avoiding the penalty which would be imposed by another complication. A Vulnerability' date=' Susceptibility or Unluck certainly seems a penalty,[/quote']

 

Well, you could call them that, but then I feel as if you're trying to be slippery and use the same word to mean significantly different things without acknowledging that difference. Perhaps I'm mistaken, but I thought we were using "penalty" in the sense of "unfair" and Complications that a character takes (barring munchkinism or the like) are not unfair, they are storyhooks. But if you want to use the words interchangeably, then.... maybe a complication is a penalty? I would say it is a penalty taken in return for a reward, so it's more of a trade than a penalty in sum.

 

and a restriction in the actions you may freely take also seems like a penalty.

That might be true, but that has nothing to do with whether a player freely chooses to take (or not take) Complications or write a background. Now, I suppose it is a penalty that the GM forbids Casual Killers and sci-fi origins in his low fantasy game, at least by that definition.

 

If you don't want the penalty, don't take the character points.

Agreed, and that applies to the background.

 

I find the likening of a background to a complication is a poor analogy. What is the complication imposed by the background? If all it does is tie the character's skills, abilities and complications together, we would not award points for it.

 

Every background I've read has contained within additional hooks or unlabled Complications that could be invoked. Regardless, even if it just "tie together" all the bits of the character- the tradeoff is that there is now no wiggle room on certain details of the character. You can't suddenly define an aspect of your character's past mid-play that had previously been undefined or vaguely defined- it's been established.

 

 

I've seen the "that guy" scenario. It is one possible reason (because the GM wants that background, even when the player doesn't), and it is intended to penalize the player for failing to provide the desired background. You haven't said "a background is required to assist the GM in integrating the character into the campaign world", you've said "you get 10 points for coming up with a background, so if you can't be bothered, too bad - you get 10 points less than those who can be bothered".

"Hey Bob. I know you really hate writing backgrounds, but I really enjoyed gaming with you in the last campaign, and you seemed to enjoy gaming with the rest of us too- for the next game I'm running, I'm afraid I'm going to require a short background for your character. Around a page, and it's mandatory if you're gonna play. Tell you what though- I'll give you another 10 CP to offset some of the foul taste, eh?"

 

However, should the players would would write the background anyway NOT receive the 10 CP because it wasn't something they disliked doing?

 

So how many points do I get for having a name, special effects for my powers and a typed, instead of hand scrawled, character sheet?

Complete non-sequitur, and it seemed to ignore the points of the post. You don't get any points for a name. You get points for wanting to play the game.

[Bodkins Odds]

Re: Background Story Rewards

 

Psychologically speaking, doing something for a tangible reward is generally less motivating that doing it for other reasons. Offering points for backgrounds is going to result in more crappy backgrounds than if you had simply required a background in order to play.