Ndreare

In my experience the players will instead use them for OCV to make called shots.

The only time I have seen a player do it I can recall was because I had a villain do it to him and so he tried it himself.

[i know we're off-topic, but hey it's my thread and I'll digress if I want to.] You wouldn't even have to do that. You can keep Killing Attacks, just remove Killing Dice. So a 12DC Killing Attack instead of rolling 4d6 K, rolls 12d6 like a Normal Attack - the only difference is that the BODY ignores Nonresistant Def. The math is slightly different, but not enough to be significant. You basically make it a very limited type of AVAD. (Maybe reduce the STUN by say -1 per die to balance it and call it a +0?) Everything else works the same but now you don't need a second set of rules for how [everything] applies to a different dice mechanic. Easy.

I like this idea. Reminds me of how Fuzion sorted them.

That is another topic altogether, but I think to remove killing damage from Hero would require very little effort.

1: Edit out all references to killing attacks

2: Edit out all references to resistant defence.

The system would work fine after that. Piercing, Penetrating, AVAD, AVLD, Hardened, and Impenetrable can cover everything killing attacks do.

As a GM I would accept that and exclude reduced endurance from the DC calculation making it 6d6 and 4d6+1 respectively. Because the offensive strike on the Armor Piercing killing attack is only +1 as each step is 6.25 points and it only provides 10 points not 13.

Okay I checked the book and martial arts are added directly as DCs so that is good.

But 6e2 Combat & Campaigns page 97 covers "Damage Classes of Advantaged Powers" covers the rest of the question.

So your total would be 4d6+1 killing for the 100 Active point attack and 3d6+1 for the armor piercing 92 Active Point attack.

This does not look right.

You are forgetting the 0-end changes it to 22.5 points per die and I think martial arts only add half to killing attacks. But I could be miss-remembering.

The AP makes it 26.75 points per killing dice.

I will check.

Sounds to me like a highly limited drain versus Speed.

I am not familiar with the game, but the effect you are describing can be built as a drain versus Speed with the limitation that all points return at the end of Phase 12.

My campaigns have Paladin's heavily influenced by David Eddings Sparhawk (I think the series was called Ellinium, but it has been 20 years or so).

They are the military/business end of the church making sure people stay calibrated.

To discribe him in better terms

Hands Jandus: A renowned scholar from the Library of Orin, Hands' knowledge of history and magic are legendary and he has built his career as a consultant for many of the Wizards living in Northern Lud. His clients have been known to travel hundreds of miles to consult him.

But not all things are meant to last. With the civil war and the burning off Orin. Hands now find himself out on his own.

Hands magical talents lay in the domain of biomancy and he is a highly skilled shapeshifter able to both make minor changes as needed as well as the greater aspects of the domain adopting wholly new forms.

He is basically an average person physically, however his intelligence is above what could be called normal human limits.

The most important game elements to be captured are;

1 Legendary Skill that he has used to make contacts across nations.

2 Shape change magic at will (charges would not be right, as he is useless in combat the other players have him scout, heal, think up tactics and perform those roles)

I did not intend it to seem I was attacking your build, perhaps there is a way to make him.

That was the nature of the topic. Hands is a 100+50 point character with 26 experience.

He is a perfect example of the type of character I can only build in Hero, GURPS, or Fate.

Other games just plain do not allow you to have legendary skills at the start. And the unlimited Shape shifting require Fiat on the part of a GM so it cannot transfer from group to group.

I have played Pathfinder and my experience felt like it would have been better titled Nofinder as any character concept that did not fit in a video game was invalid.

This was only my experience, your experience apparently was different, but your experience does not invalidate that Hero System let's players have characters they just plain could not in D&Dx or Pathfinder by the rules as written without relying on GM Fiat.

Sure, pretty close.  I know somebody's going to try to find some 25 point power that the following character build can't duplicate, but I'll try and build it in good faith anyway.

 

First, lots of ranks in Spellcraft,  That's the equivalent of KS: Magic.  You'll probably want a high Int, take the max ranks in the skill, get the +3 for class bonus, and then take some Feats and Traits that give you bonus skill ranks.  It's not really hard, you just have to figure out what you think 25- equates to.

 

For the VPP, take some levels in Druid to get the Wild Shape ability.  For a 25 point VPP, I'd say 6th level should probably be enough.  That'll let you change into large or tiny animals.  Maybe go to 8th so you get 3 uses per day.  Then load up your spells with things that let you change shape partially.  Spells like Animal Aspect (2nd level) or Bull's Str (also 2nd level) are your bread and butter here.  Ultimately, your magical abilities do have a charges limitation on them, but that's just part of how magic works in that game.  Within the context of the game, you've got that type of power.

But this may just be a matter of taste.

PS a 25- is what we consider legendary, the equivalents of +28 in Pathfinder what you would have with a 20 attribute maxed at 20th level.

Can I make a Pathfinder character who had the equivalent of a 25 point cosmic VPP limited to Shape Changing magic and is a lore matter with KS: Magic 25-?

I disagree that Pathfinder and other level based games can give me the same options without the GM using Fiat.

As for bailfire I think it can be built as a powerful attack or perhaps drain with "all or nothing" and a linked EDM to a work the person ceased to exist in X seconds earlier where X is the body rolled. But I would love to see someone else's build for it.

Not sure I understand what you intend to talk about. Can you give a couple examples?

I allow it.

But I do not allow players to slow the battle if they do not have a build ready then they only get a simple power without advantages.

Honestly my experience from most games is the players that slow the game down are the ones who ask a hundred questions because they are indecisive or where not paying attention. Those players can slow a game down regardless of if they are playing a brute fighter or a arcane master with a Defence VPP, a Offense VPP, and a Movement VPP.

I would just use Flash for all of these. They are single target perception denying effects.

Modifying them as needed such AVAD or Continuous+Uncontrolled. But in the end they all can be modeled very simply with Flash IMHO.

RISUS is roll high. But I do not know about Role Master.

My experience has actually been the majority of games I play use roll high. And all of the most popular system do (D&D X/Pathfinder, Story Teller, Fate, Palladium, & Savage Worlds). So for me it is a matter of taste some like roll high, others like roll low and I don't care which. But for my 7 year old roll high is easier.

Fuzion, Fate, Fudge, Savage Worlds and many more.

It is not a right/way wrong way type of thing. It is a preference thing. Honestly if it makes it accessible for my little girl then I will do it.

One system I have seen a lot of people use that is so easy my daughter could do it when she was 6 (last year) is to invert the numbers so rolling high is needed.

To hit a character you need to roll higher than the targets DCV+10, example Solomon has a DCV of 7 so all attacks of 17 or less miss.

Then the attacks OCV is simply added to the die roll. This makes the system a roll high system which seamed easier for my daughter.

A roll of 18 always succeeds

A roll of 3 always fails

The formula looks something like the following

If Roll+OCV > Target DCV+10 = Success

This is something that I will most definitely use. It makes a lot of sense.

 

;-)

You could add a Transform to your attack. The transform would be to exact same target with the Complication: X Wounds cannot be healed. Make it a total Complication and you are good.

But like all good things in Hero there is a counter as someone could remove the transform.

I am curious what name you decided on.

We could argue a lot on this one. Does every member of the team need the INT-based strategy component of the skill, or do we just need one strategic Captain America type setting tactics (INT based to determine tactics? PRE based to motivate his team?) which the team then works to coordinate towards (DEX based)? Does everyone need the Teamwork skill to follow the leader's orders, or only to coordinate their efforts to best effect?

 

 

Surrealone's formula allows each stat to have half their effect. It can be restated as 9 + [iNT/10] + [DEX/10] or 9+ [iNT+DEX]/10 or 9 + [Average of INT and DEX]/5. Allowing selection of the better stat and ignoring the other would benefit characters who have one good and one poor stat.

You are right, I missed that last divided by 2.

No house rule for it, but I definitely understand your logic.

However benefiting from two attributes will inflate the skill. Perhaps if you let the player select the higher if the two?

I agree with Hyper-Man. Neither is a focus.