Speedster Trick : Area Effect STR

[KA.]

Hey there,

I was just reading a Kid Flash story in one of the DC Archives volumes.

There was a landslide, and Kid Flash has to keep rocks from tumbling down on a trapped boy.

He was doing it so fast, that it was like he was pushing rocks everywhere around the boy at the same time.

Now I know that the offical Hero way to do STR at Range is Telekinesis, and I have no problem with that, but this was "Area of Effect" with No Range.

It looked sort of like a "line" to me, and everywhere along that line, Kid Flash was pushing rocks out of the way, with his STR.

Now I know that you could probably do something similar with Missle Deflection or Force Wall, but there are times when a speedster is being "everywhere at once", that buying Area of Effect for their STR looks like the right build.

 

What does everyone else think?

Has anyone done this?

Are there any other "valid" uses of this construct?

 

All comments are welcome.

 

KA.

[CorpCommander]

Re: Speedster Trick : Area Effect STR

 

I just read this trick in The Ultimate Brick actually. Naked Advantage Area of Effect (1 Hex) for up to X strength. See 'Arm Sweep', Pg. 51 TUB!

[Acroyear]

Re: Speedster Trick : Area Effect STR

 

As stated in another thread, my speedster used transform and AE transform (rearrange existing objects) for that sort of thing.

 

He also had a force wall (length limited by his half move as he ran back and forth destroying or deflecting projectiles).

 

He had missile deflect, too, but the usefulness of MD dimishes rapidly, especially when you see like "30 rock fragments" flying your way due to the penalties for repeated deflects. Secondly, it doesn't work very well vs explosions or area effects defined as "shrapnel" or something. So the powers aren't entirely redundant.

 

I was surprised, in another thread, to see TK no range was discouraged (because TK and STR function very differently) and would have probably taken that route. The naked adv on the STR works, too (AE, line, hex, area, whatever). You might even buy stretching and "sweep" or something wonky if you want to play with that idea.

[KA.]

Re: Speedster Trick : Area Effect STR

 

I just read this trick in The Ultimate Brick actually. Naked Advantage Area of Effect (1 Hex) for up to X strength. See 'Arm Sweep'' date=' Pg. 51 TUB![/quote']

 

Sounds like it is officially sanctioned then.

I haven't read The Ultimate Brick yet (still on my "To Do" list).

 

Thanks for letting me know.

 

KA.

[Guest Worldmaker]

Re: Speedster Trick : Area Effect STR

 

I'd allow it in my games.

[Dust Raven]

Re: Speedster Trick : Area Effect STR

 

The area effect STR really isn't the right mechanic for "catching/deflecting" is it though?

 

Could this character catch/deflect one boulder on his own? If so, then maybe. This might fall under normal catching rules instead of actual Deflection. But in that case, it might not be a real threat to whoever's gonna get burried (except for the burried part).

 

I'd do it using Missile Deflection with an OCV bonus to represent the being everywhere at once (perhaps PSLs to counteract the cumulative penalty), or FW (PD equal to STR Dice+v/5, trans to ED) to represent exerting the character's STR as a solid wall of protection.

[CorpCommander]

Re: Speedster Trick : Area Effect STR

 

The area effect STR really isn't the right mechanic for "catching/deflecting" is it though?

 

I think of it has holding back a wall of stone. The AOE makes a loose jumble of stones look like a wall of stone. The GM has to determine what the kilos per square meter are to determine if the character can actually do this with his own strength. Otherwise he gets crushed too!

[pinecone]

Re: Speedster Trick : Area Effect STR

 

I'd have no problem with it...I have a speedster who has AE:Radius on his str to model the "run around and cause a whirlwind" and the "spin like a top and push away everyone" things and it works just fine...the only oddity I've run into is Damage sheilds, because its my str instead of a TK I take damage! DS is so rare it not much of a problem though......

[KA.]

Re: Speedster Trick : Area Effect STR

 

Thanks for the replies!

 

Worldmaker - Glad to hear that! From what I have read you seem fairly "tight" which means that this should pass the "reasonable person" test.

 

Dust Raven - These were rocks about the size of a volleyball, not big giant boulders or anything like that. I agree that if you couldn't lift them or push them, that you would just be uselessly running around. But they weren't really "missles" in that sense. And I don't see anyone who wasn't really strong just swatting them out of the way like an arrow. Also, even though this is a weird "game vs. reality" distinction, they weren't an "attack" they were just an environmental hazard. If it was some sort of Earth Elemental, doing an Autofire Physical Energy Blast or something similar, I would see it differently. These weren't "directed" toward the helpless character, they were just rolling down the hill and he happened to be in the way. (I make this distinction as far as Life Support, also. If you have resistance to high temperature, you can walk through normal fire, but not Fire Fiend's Flame Blast. I would apply the same standard here. This would work on "environmental" threats, but not "attacks") And being buried by them seemed the major threat, but they looked big enough to take a BODY off a prone helpless normal, which means that a bunch of them hitting him would be somewhat of a threat.

 

Corp Commander - Interesting point. I guess if you apply your STR "all at once" then you need enough STR to hold back all the weight. Or is there a provision in Area of Effect that allows a certain amount "per hex" or something like that?

 

pinecone - I like that idea too! It does make sense that Damage Shields would hurt you, I guess, the same way that if the rocks were radioactive or something, Kid Flash would have been exposed to them.

 

Acroyear - Didn't mean to ignore your post. I also really like the Force Wall idea. For one thing, I like the way it would work as far as getting "broken". If one of the rocks slipped through, it would be "slowed down" a little by the character's attempt to catch it, but it could still do damage. And, it would take the character a tiny amount of time to "get back in rhythm" and put the wall back up. Did you buy it with Feedback? That seems like it could make sense, you are deliberately putting yourself in the way of things, and you may take some damage.

You could even buy an additional level of Force Wall for this, as a "heroic" option.

 

Force Wall 10 PD

+

Force Wall 5 PD with Feedback

"I can stop a lot more, but I have to put my body in the way of the damage!"

Self sacrifice is the true Hero's middle name!

 

KA.

[CorpCommander]

Re: Speedster Trick : Area Effect STR

 

Force Wall 10 PD

+

Force Wall 5 PD with Feedback

 

I like that a lot.

 

Missle deflection is nice in that it is a constant power and a defense power. Once you start deflecting you keep deflecting so long as you pay the END. The only problem is there is the caveat that you can't deflect attacks against your hex. However for cinematic reasons and drama I am sure a reasonable GM will ignore that. If you want to hold back lots of massive landslides (they are so common of course!) you may want to buy lots of extra OCV just for the purpose of missile deflect so that when those massive landslides come you have a decent chance of it.

 

For AOE STR as a defense, it all comes down to how the landslide is defined. I think a way of doing it (and there are lots of ways) would be to set it up as multiple attacks that are 1-hex accurate that have a SPD of 3. A light landslide might have 2 3D6 attacks. A moderate landslide might have 3 3d6 attacks. A heavy landslide might have 3 3d6 attacks and 2 5d6 attacks! Now then, the landslides could also be rated in cubic hexes of material. .1,1,2 respectively for each attack. That would be 1.87 metric tons for a light slide of granite, 18.7 metric tons for a moderate slide and 37.4 metric tons for a massive landslide! A light landslide would be totally deflected AOE STR 30 (I rounded down math geeks). A moderate landslide would be deflected by AOE STR 48 and a heavy landslide would need AOE STR 53!

 

Now if you don't have enough STR to hold it back its up to the GM how do deal with it. You might just take the raw percentage of what you could hold back vs. what was actually against you and then multiply that against the attacks, removing the lighter ones first. I leave it up to GM fiat in this situation.

 

Also, the volumes I chose are somewhat bogus and pulled from the air. One person might use smaller numbers and others might use much mightier numbers. YMMV!

[Acroyear]

Re: Speedster Trick : Area Effect STR

 

Did you buy it with Feedback? That seems like it could make sense, you are deliberately putting yourself in the way of things, and you may take some damage.

 

You could even buy an additional level of Force Wall for this, as a "heroic" option.

 

Force Wall 10 PD

+

Force Wall 5 PD with Feedback

"I can stop a lot more, but I have to put my body in the way of the damage!"

Self sacrifice is the true Hero's middle name!

 

I didn't add feedback. I assumed since he was zipping back and forth "blocking and missile deflecting", anything that was too big he just "got the heck out of the way." But, yeah, you get the idea.

 

I always assumed that, since FW is just a power use and not really an action, if there was anything that got through that he was determined to stop, he could interpose and take the hit (I'd also point out that his defense was not getting hit, he had like 4 PD normally). Usually the bigger hits were things like, I dunno, a rocket. He could missile deflect those, instead.

 

The addition to the FW is nice. I should work out a slot for it. I really got the most out of my VPP with that char. Once you reach a certain number of slots in a MP, it's often better to convert to a VPP.

[Dust Raven]

Re: Speedster Trick : Area Effect STR

 

Dust Raven - These were rocks about the size of a volleyball' date=' not big giant boulders or anything like that. I agree that if you couldn't lift them or push them, that you would just be uselessly running around. But they weren't really "missles" in that sense. And I don't see anyone who wasn't [b']really[/b] strong just swatting them out of the way like an arrow. Also, even though this is a weird "game vs. reality" distinction, they weren't an "attack" they were just an environmental hazard. If it was some sort of Earth Elemental, doing an Autofire Physical Energy Blast or something similar, I would see it differently. These weren't "directed" toward the helpless character, they were just rolling down the hill and he happened to be in the way. (I make this distinction as far as Life Support, also. If you have resistance to high temperature, you can walk through normal fire, but not Fire Fiend's Flame Blast. I would apply the same standard here. This would work on "environmental" threats, but not "attacks") And being buried by them seemed the major threat, but they looked big enough to take a BODY off a prone helpless normal, which means that a bunch of them hitting him would be somewhat of a threat.

Okay, that makes sense. I was imagining a full blown avalanch, not just some rocks rolling down hill. Well, maybe a lot of rocks rolling downhill, but certainly not flying perilously through the air and high speeds.

[Magmarock]

Re: Speedster Trick : Area Effect STR

 

Our UNIT 1 speedster, Autobahn, has the naked advantage, AE on STR for this purpose. It's worked well for him.

 

Mags