Random powers (falling, barriers)

[Guest Veavitdpoh]

I've been tweaking a few things to try and accomplish - stuff, and I'm having trouble accomplishing two powers I'm looking at.

 

Negate Velocity: something akin to Feather Fall, that prevents you from being hurled at speed into wall X or falling from a twenty-story building into thick and chunky salsa. It doesn't necessarily have to stop the character from actually taking the plunge, but should prevent nasty side-effects. So far what I've come up with is 10" of Gliding and Breakfall at 18+char. I'm not so sure I like it, because I have to set an arbitrary limitation for gliding (only useful for negating velocity). Any suggestions?

 

You Shall Not Pass: just a freakin' wall. I read through Force Wall a dozen times, and you know what? It prevents all sorts of attacks, but it doesn't actually stop someone from just waltzing through. I can accomplish that with Entangle, but that gets really frickin' expensive. Is there an adder to Force Wall I'm missing?

[Guest bblackmoor]

Re: Random powers (falling, barriers)

 

You Shall Not Pass: just a freakin' wall. I read through Force Wall a dozen times' date=' and you know what? It prevents all sorts of attacks, but it doesn't actually stop someone from just waltzing through.[/quote']

 

I am going to file this next to the equally-valid assertion that the Invisibility spell in D&D does not make something transparent.

[Guest Veavitdpoh]

Re: Random powers (falling, barriers)

 

I am going to file this next to the equally-valid assertion that the Invisibility spell in D&D does not make something transparent.

 

*pulls his 3.0 PHB* Well, whaddaya know.

[Rapier]

Re: Random powers (falling, barriers)

 

I've been tweaking a few things to try and accomplish - stuff, and I'm having trouble accomplishing two powers I'm looking at.

 

Negate Velocity: something akin to Feather Fall, that prevents you from being hurled at speed into wall X or falling from a twenty-story building into thick and chunky salsa. It doesn't necessarily have to stop the character from actually taking the plunge, but should prevent nasty side-effects. So far what I've come up with is 10" of Gliding and Breakfall at 18+char. I'm not so sure I like it, because I have to set an arbitrary limitation for gliding (only useful for negating velocity). Any suggestions?

 

You Shall Not Pass: just a freakin' wall. I read through Force Wall a dozen times, and you know what? It prevents all sorts of attacks, but it doesn't actually stop someone from just waltzing through. I can accomplish that with Entangle, but that gets really frickin' expensive. Is there an adder to Force Wall I'm missing?

I'd say just get 10" Flight (No Conscious Control, Trigger, Only to Prevent Damage from Impacts against Surfaces).

 

Someone throws you against a wall with 10" of velocity, you take no damage...but still hit the wall.

[Zeropoint]

Re: Random powers (falling, barriers)

 

The general consensus is that a Force Wall with PD will stop something trying to move through it, unless the object or character in question can do enough "damage" to break the force wall.

 

After all. the force wall will stop your fist when you punch it. It makes sense that it should stop the rest of you.

 

Zeropoint

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Random powers (falling, barriers)

 

How about a Teleport with the Position Shift and No Relative Velocity adders. Then give it the Usable as an Attack and Usable at Range advantages and a limitation of Only to remove velocity (-1.5 or -2 ?!?)

 

assuming 5" teleport minimum cost we get a cost of about 20-25 real points or more if you want to increase the mass it can affect.

 

This will remove ALL the momentum of any character who is falling.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Random powers (falling, barriers)

 

Another way would be to simply buy Telekinesis with enough STR to catch a falling character and give it a limitation of Only usable to stop momentum.

 

How effective it is depends on how much STR of TK is purchased.

[Rapier]

Re: Random powers (falling, barriers)

 

Another way would be to simply buy Telekinesis with enough STR to catch a falling character and give it a limitation of Only usable to stop momentum.

 

How effective it is depends on how much STR of TK is purchased.

Can't use TK on yourself. It would have to be Flight.

[jackalope]

Re: Random powers (falling, barriers)

 

Negate Velocity:Teleportation 1", No Relative Velocity, Trigger (When Moved By Any Outside Force; +1/4); Restricted Path (Remains In Original Location; -1) Cost: 7

 

or

 

Negate Velocity: Teleportation 1", No Relative Velocity, Trigger (Variable Trigger (When Moved By Any Outside Force, When Targetted By Move-Through or Move-By or any FMove Manuver); +1/2), Ranged (+1/2), Usable As Attack (+1); Restricted Path (Remains In Original Location; -1) Cost: 18

 

The second version allows a character to negate other people's velocity.

 

Force Wall will stop a Move-Through, and attempting to walk through a force wall is just a very low-powered Move-Through.

[Longshot]

Re: Random powers (falling, barriers)

 

How about a Teleport with the Position Shift and No Relative Velocity adders. Then give it the Usable as an Attack and Usable at Range advantages and a limitation of Only to remove velocity (-1.5 or -2 ?!?)

 

assuming 5" teleport minimum cost we get a cost of about 20-25 real points or more if you want to increase the mass it can affect.

 

This will remove ALL the momentum of any character who is falling.

 

Rapier is correct that you can't use TK on yourself. However, the above solution using Teleport would work. Plus, it is simple, elegant, cheap, and, in a word, Brilliant!

[Sketchpad]

Re: Random powers (falling, barriers)

 

I always did Feather Fall as Gliding ....

[Rapier]

Re: Random powers (falling, barriers)

 

Negate Velocity:Teleportation 1"' date=' No Relative Velocity, Trigger (When Moved By Any Outside Force; +1/4); Restricted Path (Remains In Original Location; -1) [b']Cost: 7[/b]

Don't have my book handy...but would 1" Teleport wiht NRV really do it? It seems awfully cheap. There is no upper limit on the velocity NRV can negate?

 

Course, it doesn't really have much of a combat effect does it?

[Guest bblackmoor]

Re: Random powers (falling, barriers)

 

Don't have my book handy...but would 1" Teleport wiht NRV really do it? It seems awfully cheap. There is no upper limit on the velocity NRV can negate?

 

I would strongly advise against that, personally. In my opinion, it is abusive. If you want to buy a power that resists movement, buy a power that resists movement. In this case, I would suggest either Flight or Gliding.

[Frenchman]

Re: Random powers (falling, barriers)

 

Don't have my book handy...but would 1" Teleport wiht NRV really do it? It seems awfully cheap. There is no upper limit on the velocity NRV can negate?QUOTE]

Yes it can, but I agree that this seems awefully cheap. I believe that it is for power constructs like this that the suggestion on page 68 of the book is made to enforce a minimum amount of a power, such as 5" of movement.

Using Jackalopes construct, 5" of teleport would cost 12 points, 10" would be 17 points (I did this math in my head, so it might be wrong). Still inexpensive, still effective. It pretty much all depends on how much the GM thinks it is worth. Personally, I'd go with 12 points.

[Guest Veavitdpoh]

Re: Random powers (falling, barriers)

 

I would strongly advise against that' date=' personally. In my opinion, it is abusive. If you want to buy a power that resists movement, buy a power that resists movement. In this case, I would suggest either Flight or Gliding.[/quote']

 

If it makes you feel better, this is going to be part of a multipower with a few amusing touches such as RSR - not a constant defense, and definitely not as an attack. Here's what I'd ended up with on my own.

 

55/28 Rune of Approach: Gliding 10" (variable trigger: +1/2) (usable by other: +1/4) (gestures: -1/4) duration (5 mins for constant powers: n/a), requires Runes skill check (penalty of -1 per 20 AP: -1/4) (only to negate velocity: -1) (AP: 18) (RP: 7) + Breakfall 18+(DEX/5=2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (usable by other: +1/4) (linked to Gliding: -1/4) (AP: 37) (RP: 21)

 

Applying the teleportation idea - which I really should've thought of, since I already used TP before for a Pass Through Walls thingy...

 

28/11 Rune of Approach: Teleportation 1" (no relative velocity: 10) (position shift: 5) (variable trigger: +1/2 (only for use to prevent impact against surfaces)) (usable by other: +1/4) (gestures: -1/4) requires Runes skill check (penalty of -1 per 20 AP: -1/4) (Remains In Original Location; -1)

 

The idea here is that the rune can be scribed on something and given to somebody as a one-shot Save Vs. Terminal Velocity, or just gestured on its own whenever appropriate. It can't be used against somebody else, nor can it be used when not, er, approaching something.

 

As for the Force Wall, reading generic movement as a move-through is verra nice. The problem is, there's no ablation possible - damn thing's got a BODY of 0 and no way to improve that. (Mind you, I don't intend for this to be a permanent barrier nor an impassable one, but I do like the drama of watching it get torn away phase by phase.)

 

Heh, while I'm at it: see the next post.

[Guest Veavitdpoh]

Re: Random powers (falling, barriers)

 

In fact - aw, hell. The AP of the multipower is going to depend on just what values I end up with for the individual powers. Enjoy. }

 

---

 

Runes Multipower (175): gestures (-1/4), duration (5 mins for constant powers: n/a), requires Runes skill check (penalty of -1 per 20 AP: -1/4) (AP: 175) (RP: 117)

... for linked powers, only one Runes skill check is necessary and activates both; all powers either use no END or have been Reduced to 0

 

RP (true), skill penalty at max use, AP/RP (figured)

1 -1 24/12 Rune of Recovery: Telekinesis STR 8 (reduced END to 0: +1/2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (only to bring an object closer: -1/2) (AP: 24) (RP: 12)

...your classic Force Yoink! power. Reaches out, snags something and pulls it in.

1 -1 28/11 Rune of Approach: Teleportation 1" (no relative velocity: 10) (position shift: 5) (variable trigger: +1/2 (only for use to prevent impact against surfaces)) (usable by other: +1/4) (Remains In Original Location; -1) (AP: 28) (RP: 11)

...well, we've covered this in painful detail by now. Used when falling or flying at something (bearing in mind the character has no flight).

2 -1 29/16 Rune of Secrecy: Concealment 17+(INT/5=3) (variable trigger: +1/2) (only usable to hide things: -1/4) (AP: 29) (RP: 16)

...makes nearly anything escape notice. Only usable to hide things: prevents from being used to search for concealed items as well.

2 -2 32/21 Rune of Conscience: Mental Defense 18+(EGO/5=2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (usable by other: +1/4) (AP: 32) (RP: 21)

...returns oneself or someone else to their right mind, on the assumption that they are currently outside of it.

3 -2 37/25 Rune of Triviality: Stealth 18+(DEX/5=2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (usable by other: +1/4) (AP: 37) (RP: 25)

...the Solid Snake version of the Rune of Secrecy.

2 -2 36/22 Rune of Velocity: Running (+6": 12) (reduced END to 0: +1/2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (usable by other: +1/4) (AP: 27) (RP: 18) + Leaping (+4": 4) (reduced END to 0: +1/2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (usable by other: +1/4) (forward movement only: -1) (AP: 9) (RP: 4)

...whoosh! Leaping enables making it across chasms when you're at speed, but no bouncing up and down like a Jack Russell terrier.

2 -2 37/20 Rune of Benificence: Extra Limbs (variable trigger: +1/2) (completely invisible: +1) (AP: 13) (RP: 8) + Telekinesis STR 8 (reduced END to 0: +1/2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (limited range 2" from reach: -1/4) (linked to Extra Limbs: -1/4) (AP: 24) (RP: 12)

...the ultimate handyman's helper. Not all the Runes are intended to be useful in pure action scenarios. The TK lets you snag things just out of reach.

3 -2 49/31 Rune of Vitality: Life Support (self-contained breathing: 10) (safe in cold/heat: 4) (diminished sleep: 1) (diminished eating: 1) (variable trigger: +1/2) (usable by other: +1/4) (AP: 28) (RP: 19) + REC 6 (variable trigger: +1/2) (usable by other: +1/4) (linked to Life Support: -1/4) (AP: 21) (RP: 12)

...for hazardous environments. Note it doesn't do anything for poison, pressure, radiation - it's not intended to be a catch-all, just an emergency lifeline.

3 -2 45/30 Rune of Substance: Density Increase (reduced END to 0: +1/2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (usable by other: +1/4) (1600 KG, +20 STR, -4 KB, +4 PD/ED: 20) (AP: 45) (RP: 30)

...this may be a bit overpowered. Rune of Metal Mario.

3 -3 53/26 Rune of Recognition: Univeral Translator (+10 to roll: 10) (variable trigger: +1/2) (usable by other: +1/4) (unable to respond: -1/2) (AP: 53) (RP: 26)

...read-only access to all languages, spoken and written. This is kind of a stretch since there's no provisions for talents as powers, but I figured the read-only limitation helps balance.

4 -3 58/38 Rune of Tongues: Mimicry 17+(INT/5=3) (variable trigger: +1/2) (AP: 29) (RP: 19) + Ventriloquism 17+(INT/5=3) (variable trigger: +1/2) (AP: 29) (RP: 19)

..."reactor leak, very dangerous".

3 -3 60/30 Rune of Dissolution: Drain BODY 2d6 (reduced END to 0: +1/2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (continuous: +1) (affects only inanimate objects: -1/2) (AP: 60) (RP: 30)

...I'm not sure if this is right, but the power is designed to gradually weaken an object or structure until it breaks down.

4 -3 70/43 Rune of Intuition: Missile Deflection (any Ranged attack that can be Deflected: 20) (variable trigger: +1/2) (usable by other: +1/4) (AP: 35) (RP: 23) + CSL Deflection +10 (variable trigger: +1/2) (usable by other: +1/4) (linked to Missile Deflection: -1/4) (AP: 35) (RP: 20)

...bullet-time.

5 -3 70/47 Rune of Dominance: PRE +40 (variable trigger: +1/2) (usable by other: +1/4) (AP: 70) (RP: 47)

...for making those spur-of-the-moment speeches.

5 -4 80/53 Rune of Release: Lockpicking 18+(DEX/5=2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (ranged: +1/2) (AP: 42) (RP: 28) + Security Systems 17+(INT/5=3) (variable trigger: +1/2) (ranged: +1/2) (AP: 38) (RP: 25)

...open a lock, any lock. Also something I had to read between the lines on. Skill used at range? Any suggestions for an advantage to make up for not having to use tools?

6 -5 95/63 Rune of Revelation: Enhanced Senses (Detect Heat Patterns/Traces, Sense: 7) (Enhanced Perception +4, Only To Counteract Darkness Modifiers -1/2: 5) (Detect Physical Objects, Targeting, Sense, Passive: 22) (Detect Supernatural Powers, Sense, Passive: 5) (Detect Mental Powers, Sense, Passive: 5) (variable trigger: +1/2) (AP: 66) (RP: 44) + Tracking 17+(INT/5=3) (variable trigger: +1/2) (AP: 29) (RP: 19)

...see eeeeverything in front of you. Maybe a little exhaustive, but it manages to still be less expensive than the Rune of Brilliance.

5 -5 99/52 Rune of Passage: Teleportation 5" (increased mass 400kg, 4 riders: 10) (no relative velocity: 10) (safe blind teleport: +1/4) (variable trigger: +1/2) (usable by other: +1/4) (only works through single wall or other solid mass: -1/2) (AP: 60) (RP: 30) + Enhanced Senses (Detect Empty Space, passive: 10) (targeting: 10) (sense: 2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (usable by other: +1/4) (linked to Teleportation: -1/4) (AP: 39) (RP: 22)

...pass through one wall, no waiting. My original take cost even more and involved Tunneling with complete invisibility. Does that Detect Empty Spaces sound right?

4 -4 90/36 Rune of Mending: Healing 3d6 (reduced END to 0: +1/2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (continuous: +1) (only works on inanimate objects: -1/2) (only works on physical damage: -1/2) (AP: 90) (RP: 36)

...fix broken stuff. I keep thinking there should be a better way of doing it - Transform or something - but since all objects have BODY, it seems appropriate. Think it'll resurrect something at 0 BODY?

6 -4 90/60 Rune of Somnolence: Ego Attack 3d6 (reduced END to 0: +1/2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (continuous: +1) (AP: 90) (RP: 60)

...sleep spell.

6 -4 90/60 Rune of Disruption: Dispel 10d6 (reduced END to 0: +1/2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (cumulative, up to x2: +3/4) (affect any magical effect power: +1/4) (AP: 90) (RP: 60)

...port blocking. Has anyone created a Permission Hero?

4 -5 96/42 Rune of Brilliance: Images (Sight Group: 10) (reduced END to 0: +1/2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (up to 5 hexes: +1) (usable by other: +1/4) (only to create light: -1) (no range: -1/2) (AP: 33) (RP: 11) + Flash 5d6, Sight Group (reduced END to 0: +1/2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (explosion: +1/2) (no range: -1/2) (AP: 63) (RP: 31)

...a big flashlight, and a bigger overload as an attack. You'll notice there aren't a lot of attacks - that's quite on purpose.

6 -6 120/60 Rune of Opening: Telekinesis STR 40 (reduced END to 0: +1/2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (only to open closeable entities: -1/2) (AP: 120) (RP: 60)

...a very, very big crowbar. TK strikes me as a very abusable power at higher levels.

7 -5 105/70 Rune of Animation: Healing 3d6 (reduced END to 0: +1/2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (continuous: +1) (applies to STUN and END: +1/2) (AP: 105) (RP: 70)

...provides a wake-up jolt. I considered calling this the Rune of Caffeine, but...

5 -6 118/55 Rune of Deception: Acting 18+(PRE/5=2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (usable by other: +1/4) (AP: 37) (RP: 25) + Mental Illusions 5d6 (reduced END to 0: +1/2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (usable by other: +1/4) (continuous: +1) (self only: -1) (linked to Acting: -1/4) (AP: 81) (RP: 30)

...instant Mission Impossible mask. Is there a way to make the Mental Illusions apply to everyone you encounter until broken? That's what I was going for with Continuous.

7 -6 141/84 Rune of Persistence: +10 DCV (variable trigger: +1/2) (usable by other: +1/4) (AP: 88) (RP: 58) + SPD +3 (variable trigger: +1/2) (usable by other: +1/4) (linked to DCV: -1/4) (only usable for defensive actions: -1/4) (AP: 53) (RP: 26)

...bullet-time mark two.

5 -7 150/50 Rune of Restraint: Entangle 5d6 (reduced END to 0: +1/2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (takes no damage from attacks: +1/2) (affects desolidified: +1/2) (set effect - feet only, unable to move, retains half DCV: -1/2) (does not prevent use of foci: -1) (AP: 150) (RP: 50)

...intended to seal a target's feet to the ground, and only their feet - it's a little silly that I have to pay so much for such a relatively limited use, but c'est la vie.

8 -8 170/81 Rune of Displacement: Energy Blast 5d6 (reduced END to 0: +1/2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (STUN only: -0) (AP: 50) (RP: 33) + Telekinesis STR 40 (reduced END to 0: +1/2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (limited range to Energy Blast: -1/4) (linked to Energy Blast: -1/4) (only to shove away: -1/2) (AP: 120) (RP: 48)

...I'm sure there's a better way to do this. One of the few offensive actions, basically an impact hammer that sends targets flying but does no true damage.

10 -9 172/105 Rune of Protection: Force Wall (5 PD/ED/MD/PD: 20) (5" long and 5" high: 16) (reduced END to 0: +1/2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (AP: 72) (RP: 48) + Entangle 5d6 (reduced END to 0: +1/2) (variable trigger: +1/2) (only to form barriers: -1) (limited size to Force Wall: -1/4) (AP: 100) (RP: 57)

...you shall not pass. Basically blocks whatever is in front of it until they tear through it. As mentioned before, the 0 BODY of Force Wall is making this annoyingly expensive.

122 total

[jackalope]

Re: Random powers (falling, barriers)

 

Don't have my book handy...but would 1" Teleport wiht NRV really do it? It seems awfully cheap.

 

0" of teleport would do it, since the character or target doesn't atually move anywhere, but you can't buy the NRV adder unless you buy some amount of teleport. Essentially the character is teleporting to where they already are.

 

There is no upper limit on the velocity NRV can negate?

 

Not according to the book.

 

Course, it doesn't really have much of a combat effect does it?

 

Well, it could be argued that a character with this power would never suffer knockback and couldn't be affected by movement powers bought UAA, unless those powers were bought with the advantage "Cannot Be Escaped With Teleportation".

 

I would allow this in my campaign, but I'd require the character to buy a lot of other powers as well.

[Longshot]

Re: Random powers (falling, barriers)

 

As for the Force Wall, reading generic movement as a move-through is verra nice. The problem is, there's no ablation possible - damn thing's got a BODY of 0 and no way to improve that. (Mind you, I don't intend for this to be a permanent barrier nor an impassable one, but I do like the drama of watching it get torn away phase by phase.)

 

If that's what you're interested in, then you could try something like:

 

An AOE Entangle, only to form barriers, with a higher Body and lower DEF.

 

Or

 

Instead of 1 Force Wall with 5 DEF, buy 3 Force Walls with 2 DEF each. It would provide about the same overall protection, but just about anybody could get through it eventually. I’m not sure about the legality of such a construct, but I would allow it.

 

Just throwing out the suggestions…

[Lightray]

Instead of 1 Force Wall with 5 DEF' date=' buy 3 Force Walls with 2 DEF each. It would provide about the same overall protection, but just about anybody could get through it eventually. I’m not sure about the legality of such a construct, but I would allow it.[/quote']

Explicitly denied per FREd.

 

However, I've allowed it, if the character has Indirect on the "outer" force walls (just like you need Indirect on an Energy Blast or other power to use it while your Force Wall is up).

[Longshot]

Re: Random powers (falling, barriers)

 

Explicitly denied per FREd.

 

However, I've allowed it, if the character has Indirect on the "outer" force walls (just like you need Indirect on an Energy Blast or other power to use it while your Force Wall is up).

 

A very good point. I had forgotten about the Indirect advantage being necessary.

 

However, and this is a matter of personal taste, but I think the Entangle would be the more elegant of the solutions, closer to the overall desired effect, and possibly cheaper.

[Guest Veavitdpoh]

Re: Random powers (falling, barriers)

 

However' date=' and this is a matter of personal taste, but I think the Entangle would be the more elegant of the solutions, closer to the overall desired effect, and possibly cheaper.[/quote']

 

The problem I'm having is neither power really covers it. Entangle is more elegant and provides the whole 'weakening' aspect - but enemies can hock powers right through it all they want. "Sure, I'll stay on my side. Here, have a fireball." Force Wall, especially if you read into the move through idea, does prevent the enemy from getting past with anything - but even when ablative is an all-or-nothing thing.

 

Maybe a high-BODY, low-DEF Entangle with some sort of wonky advantage that means it applies to all powers (except teleportation)?

[Guest WhammeWhamme]

Re: Random powers (falling, barriers)

 

The problem I'm having is neither power really covers it. Entangle is more elegant and provides the whole 'weakening' aspect - but enemies can hock powers right through it all they want. "Sure, I'll stay on my side. Here, have a fireball." Force Wall, especially if you read into the move through idea, does prevent the enemy from getting past with anything - but even when ablative is an all-or-nothing thing.

 

Maybe a high-BODY, low-DEF Entangle with some sort of wonky advantage that means it applies to all powers (except teleportation)?

 

Um, AFAIK, when Entangle makes a wall... it's a _wall_.

[TaxiMan]

Re: Random powers (falling, barriers)

 

The Rune of Restraint can be modeled as Suppress Running / Flying / Leaping ... ? I can't build up the power right now, but feel like it might be cheaper.

[Guest Veavitdpoh]

Re: Random powers (falling, barriers)

 

Um' date=' AFAIK, when Entangle makes a wall... it's a _wall_.[/quote']

 

Yeah, a wall 2" high. I want something tall as well as wide.

 

The Rune of Restraint can be modeled as Suppress Running / Flying / Leaping ... ? I can't build up the power right now' date=' but feel like it might be cheaper.[/quote']

 

Mm, probably. But then they're still free to run around at their regular pace. Heh, any reason why we can't use Drain on normal modes of movement?

 

-additional, the Rune of Restraint shouldn't be of any use against flying critters, but it should be able to prevent them from taking off if they're on the ground. Fun, no?

[Jhamin]

Re: Random powers (falling, barriers)

 

Yeah, a wall 2" high. I want something tall as well as wide.

 

Area of Effect?