Blocking and deflecting

[Trebuchet]

Re: Blocking and deflecting

 

Actually' date=' characters [b']can[/b] reflect HtH based attacks back at an attacker based on the Grab and Redirect maneuver described in the UMA. The defender can make a Grab Weapon attempt on an incoming attack (provided he has some Lightning Reflexes, or beats the attacker in an opposed DEX roll) which is effectively handled like a block (I believe its an OCV vs OCV roll) then after an immediate STR contest, can use the opponents own weapon to attack him with!

 

Hand to Hand Reflection!

 

You can even attack people adjecent to you at a penalty. Cool stuff.

 

Anyway, the best way to simulate a Hand to Hand reflection power is with a Mimic pool bought with the Damage Sheild advantage. The attacker hits your character and wham! gets hit back with their own attack! Expensive, yes, but ultimately very satisfying.

 

I didn't know that. *rubs hands gleefully* Excellent, Smithers.

 

I'll have to give some thought to buying that for Zl'f. She seldom gets attacked with HtH weapons, but if anyone could pull a stunt like that it would be a DEX 43, SPD 9 martial artist. It would be completely plausible for her to be able to do something like that, and would be a wonderfully flashy trick to pull on some hotshot mook.

[badger3k]

Re: Blocking and deflecting

 

...but you have no problem with being shot from both sides 'simultaneously' and still deflecting both? Hmmmm...Do you think that's air you're breathing?

 

Considering I didn't read through other comments, I'm not sure what this refers too, but yeah. I'm not really thrilled by an idea of deflecting multiple attacks, unless they come from the same source. If it's from two different directions, then there better be a large penalty for the character to even attempt it (the -2 per successful roll is just the base to me). Sorry, just the way I play.

 

I just don't see the need to make missile deflection roll into the block manuever. Unless the character wants to abort his next action, I wouldn't let him mix defenses like that. If he wants to lose an action, then I'd probably have no problem with it, although there would still be a situational penalty (ie- if the defense is a shield covering one side of the body, that would be bigger than if he was using "magic bracers" or Battle-staves that can cover both sides - sfx plays a big part). I don't just go by what's in the books when making decisions.

 

As for what I'm breathing, it's a mixture of Oxygen, Nitrogen, some trace elements (CO2, etc since I don't want to look it up), and a lot of pollutants, particularly latex from the tile floor I'm installing between posts. I seriously doubt it's affecting my reasoning power, however . Edit - I think you want something along the lines of "whatever you're smoking, I want some...".

[Dust Raven]

Re: Blocking and deflecting

 

I agree with how you handled it from the first post. And thinking things thru, I'd probably do the same. It's actually quite rare for me to see Missile Deflection, but that's just in the games I've been in.

 

I would probably just roll Deflection and Blocking into the same manuever class. Meaning if someone shot at Target, he missile deflects. Someone throws a punch, he blocks at -2. Another shot comes in, deflect at -4.

 

So no additional adder needed for HtH. Though that does ignore the possibility of the levels from Missile Deflection. I'd make them buy 3 points that could be used for both.

This is exactly what I use in my games.

 

Even if the character only buys the bonus for Missile Deflection, he can still switch to Block, he just doesn't get the use the bonuses for blocking that attack. If he's attacked with another ranged attack again though, he still gets his levels.

 

I also allow characters to buy 3 point levels with Missile Deflection as part of the Power, as is done with the two point levels.

[rburroughs69]

Re: Blocking and deflecting

 

Along the lines of this thread, during a game a couple of weeks ago, I was inbetween two villians, and one of them attempted a move through on my martial artist. My idea was to sidestep that villian and hit them, basically redirecting that villian into the other that was standing on the other side of me. They weren't lined up at the time. My GM said I would need some kind of a redirect to pull that move off. Would that be another martial manuver, or is there an adder I can add to my strike manuver that will create the effect?

[Dust Raven]

Re: Blocking and deflecting

 

Along the lines of this thread' date=' during a game a couple of weeks ago, I was inbetween two villians, and one of them attempted a move through on my martial artist. My idea was to sidestep that villian and hit them, basically redirecting that villian into the other that was standing on the other side of me. They weren't lined up at the time. My GM said I would need some kind of a redirect to pull that move off. Would that be another martial manuver, or is there an adder I can add to my strike manuver that will create the effect?[/quote']

 

Interesting circumstance to bring up considering another topic currently under discussion: http://www.herogames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=31743

 

Basically it's about grabbing someone and hurling them into someone else. While in your example, you're just letting one target run into the other target himself, with just a little bit of help, it might be related.

 

By my figuring, the defender would need a Held Phase, and use that Held Phase to either Grab and Throw, or to Martial Throw the first attacker into the second. According to the official rules for Grab and Throw, you can't do this as a single action, but it doesn't make sense for you to have to wait. It should happen immediately. Definately sound like a case to ignore that particular rule, if only for dramatic sense. I'm not sure what the rules conserning aiming a Martial Throw would be though.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Blocking and deflecting

 

By my figuring' date=' the defender would need a Held Phase, and use that Held Phase to either Grab and Throw, or to Martial Throw the first attacker into the second. According to the official rules for Grab and Throw, you can't do this as a single action, but it doesn't make sense for you to have to wait. It should happen immediately. Definately sound like a case to ignore that particular rule, if only for dramatic sense. I'm not sure what the rules conserning aiming a Martial Throw would be though.[/quote']

 

If you want to be a stickler with Grab & Throw, you could require the character use a full (held) phase, plus the Sweep maneuver, to Grab and Throw at the same time. This would impose an OCV penalty, but it probably should be harder to redirect the target than to simply grapple him.

 

I suppose one could also aply the same penalty to a Martial Throw on the basis that this also doesn't generally allow targetting the throw at a second target.

[prestidigitator]

Re: Blocking and deflecting

 

Interesting circumstance to bring up considering another topic currently under discussion: http://www.herogames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=31743

 

Basically it's about grabbing someone and hurling them into someone else. While in your example, you're just letting one target run into the other target himself, with just a little bit of help, it might be related.

 

By my figuring, the defender would need a Held Phase, and use that Held Phase to either Grab and Throw, or to Martial Throw the first attacker into the second. According to the official rules for Grab and Throw, you can't do this as a single action, but it doesn't make sense for you to have to wait. It should happen immediately. Definately sound like a case to ignore that particular rule, if only for dramatic sense. I'm not sure what the rules conserning aiming a Martial Throw would be though.

Yeah. I might also allow things like an Abort to Move Through with only Casual Strength (if it is really being done to defend someone else).

[Dust Raven]

Re: Blocking and deflecting

 

Yeah. I might also allow things like an Abort to Move Through with only Casual Strength (if it is really being done to defend someone else).

 

Isn't that a Dive For Cover?

[prestidigitator]

Re: Blocking and deflecting

 

Isn't that a Dive For Cover?

No, because Dive for Cover typically doesn't give you an attack roll, and usually gives you Move Through damage on obstacles (usually to cause yourself damage) with 0 Str, not your Casual Str (Casual Str can be used by itself to push by things on which you don't want to waste an attack roll--and thus a Half Phase).

[Vondy]

Re: Blocking and deflecting

 

Because a hand to hand attack isn't a missile?

 

I kid, I kid.

 

By that token, why can't I use the block maneuver to stop a bullet?

 

I kid, I kid.

 

Missile Deflection is essentially the ranged equivalent of block in the Hero system, with various levels reflecting the differing SFXs it can affect. The cost differential is probably a result of play testing that was done decades ago.

 

In your specific situation:

 

The character should declare a block maneuver. The shield, even if its not bought as additional DCV or some such, should be sufficient SFX to justify the move even if you don't have martial block with the relevant weapon elements in your MA package.