Help With Some Builds

[SCUBA Hero]

(This is a spinoff from the Runequest Spirit Magic to Hero thread in the Fantasy Hero forum.)

 

Forget Runequest; in general, how would you build the following:

 

1. A spell that provides extra damage for a sword on its next hit (that is, a successful Attack Roll) only.

 

2. As #1, but the spell fades after one day if no hit is made.

 

3. A spell that will provide an arrow with extra damage on the next shot (even if it misses, the magic is gone) only.

 

4. As #3, but the spell fades after one day if no shot is made?

[MitchellS]

Re: Help With Some Builds

 

(This is a spinoff from the Runequest Spirit Magic to Hero thread in the Fantasy Hero forum.)

 

Forget Runequest; in general, how would you build the following:

 

1. A spell that provides extra damage for a sword on its next hit (that is, a successful Attack Roll) only.

 

2. As #1, but the spell fades after one day if no hit is made.

 

3. A spell that will provide an arrow with extra damage on the next shot (even if it misses, the magic is gone) only.

 

4. As #3, but the spell fades after one day if no shot is made?

+xd6 hka [for sword or rka for arrow], trigger [a hit], fades in one day if not used: -0

[Mister E]

Re: Help With Some Builds

 

Trigger advantage, with "trigger can expire" 1/4 less advantage. Also the Usable By Other, advantage.

[bigdamnhero]

Re: Help With Some Builds

 

I'd go with either delayed effect or trigger, depending on how you see it working. Define the trigger as "next hit" for a sword or "next shot" for an arrow, give it one charge and a limitation "must be triggered within 24 hours" - not sure how much I'd give for that - and you're there.

 

bigdamnhero

"insert clever quote here"

[SCUBA Hero]

Re: Help With Some Builds

 

Does it require UBO, since it's cast onto a Focus?

 

(PS - Thanks for the quick responses!)

[Mister E]

Re: Help With Some Builds

 

I'd give it UBO so you could enchant other people's weapons.

[SCUBA Hero]

Re: Help With Some Builds

 

Ah. Makes sense.

 

Enchant Weapon: +1d6 HKA (15), Trigger (next hit, expires in one day) +1/4, UBO +1/4 (22), OAF (Weapon) -1 (11)

 

Okay, to crank up the level of difficulty:

 

To enchant multiple items at once, buy up the UBO level.

 

But how to make it the next two (or four, or whatever) hits/shots?

[MitchellS]

Re: Help With Some Builds

 

Ah. Makes sense.

 

Enchant Weapon: +1d6 HKA (15), Trigger (next hit, expires in one day) +1/4, UBO +1/4 (22), OAF (Weapon) -1 (11)

 

Okay, to crank up the level of difficulty:

 

To enchant multiple items at once, buy up the UBO level.

 

But how to make it the next two (or four, or whatever) hits/shots?

Resettable trigger with 4 charges.

[SCUBA Hero]

Re: Help With Some Builds

 

Elapsed time, four minutes.

 

I'm impressed!

[mallet]

Re: Help With Some Builds

 

I wouldn't use OAF for this.

 

The weapon (sword or arrow) is the target of the spell, not it's source. Foci are the source of the spell/power. So, if the charater casting the spell was using a magic wand to cast it then OAF would apply (take away the wand and he can't cast the spell), but since the target of the spell is just a sword/arrow and the enchantment only lasts for a short time, then the sword/arrow should not become/count as a Focus.

 

I would have to think about what limitation to use in this instance. In fact UBO pretty much covers the "weapon" part, I think that the spell enchants a sword or aroow is only a special effect of the spell, not a limitation.

[archermoo]

Re: Help With Some Builds

 

I wouldn't use OAF for this.

 

The weapon (sword or arrow) is the target of the spell, not it's source. Foci are the source of the spell/power. So, if the charater casting the spell was using a magic wand to cast it then OAF would apply (take away the wand and he can't cast the spell), but since the target of the spell is just a sword/arrow and the enchantment only lasts for a short time, then the sword/arrow should not become/count as a Focus.

 

I would have to think about what limitation to use in this instance. In fact UBO pretty much covers the "weapon" part, I think that the spell enchants a sword or aroow is only a special effect of the spell, not a limitation.

 

Well, I'd say that putting OAF (Weapon) on it is appropriate, but it limits the spell to only being usable on focuses that are OAF. If someone has an enchanted sword that cannot be disarmed or taken away while they are conscious (i.e. and OIF), then the spell wouldn't work for it.

 

The UBO lets someone else use it for one of their attacks, the OAF requires that it be an attack through a focus, and would also require that the focus is both obvious and accessable.

[SCUBA Hero]

Re: Help With Some Builds

 

Okay, inspired by the cover of the old Fantasy Hero Companion II and aided by the Herophiles in this thread:

 

The following ritual blesses ten arrows to provide additional damage on the next shot with a time limit of one day:

 

Blessing The Arrows: +1d6 RKA (15); UBO [10 people] +1-1/4, Trigger [next shot, requires one hour ritual, can set 10 times (1 per arrow only), expires in one day] +1/4 (37); OAF [arrows] -1, Arrows Only -1/4 (16)

 

I gave an extra -1/4 for Arrows Only since thrown spears, hatchets, etc, are not affected by the ritual.

 

 

As an alternate, the following ritual blesses a single person to provide additional damage on his next ten bow shots with a time limit of one day:

 

Blessing The Hunter: +1d6 RKA (15); UBO [1 person] +1/4, Trigger [next shot, requires one hour all-or-nothing ritual, can set 10 times, expires in one day] +1/4 (22); OIF [any arrows] -1/2, Arrows Only -1/4 (13)

 

I applied the OIF Limitation, as the recipient does need arrows to use the Power, but can use any arrows (as opposed to Blessing The Arrows, which affects ten specific arrows). The one hour all-or-nothing ritual combined with can set 10 times reflects one hour to set all ten times, but any disruption of the ritual during the hour cancels the entire Power (as opposed to ten six-minute consecutive rituals, each giving one set).

[MitchellS]

Re: Help With Some Builds

 

Okay' date=' inspired by the cover of the old [i']Fantasy Hero Companion II[/i] and aided by the Herophiles in this thread:

 

The following ritual blesses ten arrows to provide additional damage on the next shot with a time limit of one day:

 

Blessing The Arrows: +1d6 RKA (15); UBO [10 people] +1-1/4, Trigger [next shot, requires one hour ritual, can set 10 times (1 per arrow only), expires in one day] +1/4 (37); OAF [arrows] -1, Arrows Only -1/4 (16)

 

I gave an extra -1/4 for Arrows Only since thrown spears, hatchets, etc, are not affected by the ritual.

 

 

As an alternate, the following ritual blesses a single person to provide additional damage on his next ten bow shots with a time limit of one day:

 

Blessing The Hunter: +1d6 RKA (15); UBO [1 person] +1/4, Trigger [next shot, requires one hour all-or-nothing ritual, can set 10 times, expires in one day] +1/4 (22); OIF [any arrows] -1/2, Arrows Only -1/4 (13)

 

I applied the OIF Limitation, as the recipient does need arrows to use the Power, but can use any arrows (as opposed to Blessing The Arrows, which affects ten specific arrows). The one hour all-or-nothing ritual combined with can set 10 times reflects one hour to set all ten times, but any disruption of the ritual during the hour cancels the entire Power (as opposed to ten six-minute consecutive rituals, each giving one set).

Looks good. If I ever play a fantasy game I'll steal it.

[SCUBA Hero]

Re: Help With Some Builds

 

Glad you like it, as much Hero Help as you've given me.

[Blackberry]

Re: Help With Some Builds

 

I wouldn't use OAF for this.

 

The problem is, if you don't specify that the power requires a focus, then you can just add +1d6 HKA to your fist, which doesn't necessarily reflect what the spell does.

[SCUBA Hero]

Re: Help With Some Builds

 

I wouldn't use OAF for this.

 

The weapon (sword or arrow) is the target of the spell, not it's source. Foci are the source of the spell/power. So, if the charater casting the spell was using a magic wand to cast it then OAF would apply (take away the wand and he can't cast the spell), but since the target of the spell is just a sword/arrow and the enchantment only lasts for a short time, then the sword/arrow should not become/count as a Focus.

I think OAF is appropriate (it took me some time to digest your thoughts on this) - If the specifc weapon is not there, the spell cannot be cast (even though once cast, it hangs around for a while). And, once cast, if you take away that specific weapon, the Power is not usable (or, more likely, usable by the person that took the weapon away .)

 

Thank you for your comment; it helped me clarify my thinking on how the spell should work.

[Blackberry]

Re: Help With Some Builds

 

I think OAF is appropriate (it took me some time to digest your thoughts on this) - If the specifc weapon is not there, the spell cannot be cast (even though once cast, it hangs around for a while). And, once cast, if you take away that specific weapon, the Power is not usable (or, more likely, usable by the person that took the weapon away .)

 

Thank you for your comment; it helped me clarify my thinking on how the spell should work.

 

That's right. It's the same as a Brick with bare Hand Attack OAF written as grabbing a nearby lamppost/car/mailbox/enemy Brick and whacking their opponent with it. It's not a Focus like Green Lantern's ring, where there's only one and it generates the power that then emanates from it, but you must still have the Focus in order to use the power.

[SCUBA Hero]

Re: Help With Some Builds

 

Reviewing the rules in 5ER, I am not satisfied with the above builds: according to the rules on Trigger, the recipient would have to maintain line of sight with the caster, which is not the intent of the spell. In order to remove LOS and range requirements, the following are my current 'best' builds. Comments?

 

Blessing The Arrows: +1d6 RKA (15); Trigger [next shot, expires in one day] +1/4, 0 END +1/2 (26); OAF [arrows] -1, Arrows Only -1/4, One Charge -2 (6) [0]

 

Cast Blessing The Arrows: (6); UBO [ten people, 'persistent', 'uncontrolled'] +2-1/4 (19); Extra Time [one hour] -3, Gestures -1/4, Incantations -1/4 (4) [0]

 

Blessing The Hunter: +1d6 RKA (15); Trigger [next shot, expires in one day] +1/4; 0 END +1/2 (26); OIF [arrows] -1/2, Arrows Only -1/4, One Charge -2 (7) [0]

 

Cast Blessing The Hunter: (7); UBO [one person, 'persistent', 'uncontrolled'] +1-1/4 (16); Extra Time [six minutes] -2, Gestures -1/4, Incantations -1/4 (5) [0]

[ghost-angel]

Re: Help With Some Builds

 

I take it the UBO is a NakedAdvantage used to bestow the +RKA onto someone else? If yes, then looks good to me. Very nice.

[SCUBA Hero]

Re: Help With Some Builds

 

I used the method presented in 5ER under UBO to make the builds. I don't know if that comes out the same as a Naked Advantage or not...

[ghost-angel]

Re: Help With Some Builds

 

ah I get it ... there are two spells, one for you and one for someone else?

[SCUBA Hero]

Re: Help With Some Builds

 

Not quite; the actual spells are the 'Cast' builds. They give the recipient(s) the 'Blessing' builds. This is done because there are differing modifiers on the spell to cast the spell than the spell that is granted. This is covered in 5ER p. 276 'Differing Modifiers', or on FREd p. 177 under the same heading.

[ghost-angel]

Re: Help With Some Builds

 

I'll have to read that heading when I get home, because I'm just not grokking what you're doing here.

[Reln]

Re: Help With Some Builds

 

Reviewing the rules in 5ER, I am not satisfied with the above builds: according to the rules on Trigger, the recipient would have to maintain line of sight with the caster, which is not the intent of the spell. In order to remove LOS and range requirements, the following are my current 'best' builds. Comments?

 

Blessing The Arrows: +1d6 RKA (15); Trigger [next shot, expires in one day] +1/4, 0 END +1/2 (26); OAF [arrows] -1, Arrows Only -1/4, One Charge -2 (6) [0]

 

Cast Blessing The Arrows: (6); UBO [ten people, 'persistent', 'uncontrolled'] +2-1/4 (19); Extra Time [one hour] -3, Gestures -1/4, Incantations -1/4 (4) [0]

 

Blessing The Hunter: +1d6 RKA (15); Trigger [next shot, expires in one day] +1/4; 0 END +1/2 (26); OIF [arrows] -1/2, Arrows Only -1/4, One Charge -2 (7) [0]

 

Cast Blessing The Hunter: (7); UBO [one person, 'persistent', 'uncontrolled'] +1-1/4 (16); Extra Time [six minutes] -2, Gestures -1/4, Incantations -1/4 (5) [0]

 

 

OK I just read through this and from what I can tell you dont' have to buy the power it's self only the Casting part of it. I say because of the warning that it should not be allowed for chracters to use UBO to get powers for themselfs at a lower cost. If you had to buy the power and the UBO it would be more expensive.

 

The way I understand it is you build the power as the recipiant would have it and the cost of that becomes the base power on wich you put UBO and any other casting lims.

 

Looking this over I don't now if it needs trigger. Look at it from the recipiants point of view, as if he had bought the power for himself. Then use that as the base to buy the spell.

[prestidigitator]

Re: Help With Some Builds

 

OK I just read through this and from what I can tell you dont' have to buy the power it's self only the Casting part of it. I say because of the warning that it should not be allowed for chracters to use UBO to get powers for themselfs at a lower cost. If you had to buy the power and the UBO it would be more expensive.

 

The way I understand it is you build the power as the recipiant would have it and the cost of that becomes the base power on wich you put UBO and any other casting lims.

Yeah. You buy the complete power that is bestowed using UBO, including Advantages and Disadvantages, and this becomes the, "Base Cost," of the whole UBO Power--on top of which you can again apply Advantages and/or Limitations. Just be careful, because this can definitely turn into a munchkinism; the book even specifically warns about it under UBO.

 

Looking this over I don't now if it needs trigger. Look at it from the recipiants point of view, as if he had bought the power for himself. Then use that as the base to buy the spell.

I agree. The Charges already take care of this. Maybe the Trigger could be used in the case that the power/Charge only gets used when the attack hits (rather than when it is fired), but this could get too unbalancing, so I would consider such a build very carefully if I were GM.