Proposed Advantage: Transformative

[Dr.Device]

Transformative (+1): This advantage is available for the powers Density Increase, Growth, Shape Shift, Shrinking, and Stretching. Applying Transformative to a power is similar to applying Reduced Endurance (Zero Endurance), Persistent and Inherent. However, the possessor of the power must pay endurance (calculated from the powers active cost, as usual) to change the power's state.

 

Unlike a an Inherent power, a Transformative power can be affected by some adjustment powers. For the purposes of adjustment powers, a Transformative power is treated as if it were an instant power, much like Transform. Thus, while using a Dispel Growth on a character with Transformative Growth who was currently eighteen feet tall would not cause her to revert to normal size, a sufficiently powerful Suppress Growth could keep her from getting any larger. Similarly, a Suppress or Drain Shape Shift, could, if it suppressed or drained sufficient points, keep a character with Transformative Shape Shift locked in his current shape until its effects ended.

 

The endurance cost of Growth, Shrinking, Stretching and Density Increase is calculated proportionally from the amount of the power turned on or off. To change shapes with Transformative Shape Shift, the character must pay the full endurance cost of the Shape Shift power.

 

Reduced Endurance can be taken on the power to reduce or eliminate the endurance cost of changing states.

 

Example

: Spriggan can be any size between nine inches and twelve feet tall. No size in that range is more or less natural for him than any other size. This is purchased as

Smallness:

Shrinking (0.25 m tall, 0.1953 kg mass, -6 PER Rolls to perceive character, +6 DCV, takes +9" KB), Transformative (+1) (60 Active Points) (Real Cost: 60)

Bigness:

Growth (+15 STR, +3 BODY, +3 STUN, -3" KB, 800 kg, -2 DCV, +2 PER Rolls to perceive character, 4 m tall, 2 m wide), Transformative (+1) (30 Active Points) (Real Cost: 30)

 

Suppose Spriggan is currently 18 inches tall, and wants to be ten feet tall. He pays the endurance to 'turn off' two levels of shrinking (4) and turn on two levels of growth (2), for 6 endurance. Shrinking back to size feet tall would just cost 2 endurance (the endurance cost of two levels of growth).

At the GM's option, a character could be allowed to apply Transformative to the power Desolidification. It is recommended that this be allowed only if desolidification is taken with either or both of the limitations Does Not Protect Against Damage and/or Cannot Pass Through Solid Objects.

 

 

Questions? Comments?

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Proposed Advantage: Transformative

 

I'd rather just buy Costs END only to activate (+1/4) and Persistent (+1/2), then use the points saved (11 in your example) to buy limited Power Defense to protect my size/shape change powers as you describe than create a whole new advantage that doesn't really do anything new.

 

Given how "common" adjustment powers that act vs these powers are, I could likely live without the power defense and spend the points elsewhere, and take a limitation for "costs END to return to normal size" to further reduce the cost.

[Rapier]

Re: Proposed Advantage: Transformative

 

I'd rather just buy Costs END only to activate (+1/4) and Persistent (+1/2), then use the points saved (11 in your example) to buy limited Power Defense to protect my size/shape change powers as you describe than create a whole new advantage that doesn't really do anything new.

 

Given how "common" adjustment powers that act vs these powers are, I could likely live without the power defense and spend the points elsewhere, and take a limitation for "costs END to return to normal size" to further reduce the cost.

 

I'm with ya on that one. We already have Advantages and Limitations that can do that. If you want to lump them together (aka Spell Limitation in FH that is shorthand for Gestures, Incantations, etc) that's one thing, but I don't see the need to create an entirely new Advantage that, poorly, recreates the wheel.

[ghost-angel]

Re: Proposed Advantage: Transformative

 

Why not create a variant of Inherent that allows you to adjust the levels at which you've purchased a Power.

[Dr.Device]

Re: Proposed Advantage: Transformative

 

I'd rather just buy Costs END only to activate (+1/4) and Persistent (+1/2), then use the points saved (11 in your example) to buy limited Power Defense to protect my size/shape change powers as you describe than create a whole new advantage that doesn't really do anything new.

 

Given how "common" adjustment powers that act vs these powers are, I could likely live without the power defense and spend the points elsewhere, and take a limitation for "costs END to return to normal size" to further reduce the cost.

 

Well, a couple of points:

1. Persistent with Costs End Only To Activate is against the rules as written, so requires an exception anyway.

2. Using power defense to mimic the described effect is going to be very iffy as far as making sure you've take enough, and is going to require overly detailed limitations to make it behave in the fashion described.

 

Given those, I'd just as soon have an advantage that does the full package rather than kludging it.

 

Why not create a variant of Inherent that allows you to adjust the levels at which you've purchased a Power.

 

One could look at this as exactly that, just with the reduced endurance and persistent already rolled in. Part of my reasoning for proposing this was aesthetic. It bugs me to have a power with the Reduced Endurance (Zero Endurance) advantage, which, in fact, does cost endurance.

 

I'm with ya on that one. We already have Advantages and Limitations that can do that. If you want to lump them together (aka Spell Limitation in FH that is shorthand for Gestures' date=' Incantations, etc) that's one thing, but I don't see the need to create an entirely new Advantage that, poorly, recreates the wheel.[/quote']

 

First, a quick aside. The Spell limitation in Fantasy Hero isn't shorthand for gestures and incantations. It's a separate limitation that affects what maneuvers you can use the spell with, among other things.

 

If Hugh's alternative achieved the same results, I would agree with you, but, as I noted above, it doesn't. With the Power Defense, you have to guess the right amount for the campaign. Or you can leave the Power Defense off and hope it never comes up. If you've guessed wrong, you leave the character open to results that don't match the character conception.

[ghost-angel]

Re: Proposed Advantage: Transformative

 

One could look at this as exactly that' date=' just with the reduced endurance and persistent already rolled in. Part of my reasoning for proposing this was aesthetic. It bugs me to have a power with the Reduced Endurance (Zero Endurance) advantage, which, in fact, does cost endurance.[/quote']

Seeing as Inherent already involes the GM Option that if the Character wishes they can turn the power off by spending END to do so, I see no reason to start rolling out new Advantages to cover an already written option.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Proposed Advantage: Transformative

 

If Hugh's alternative achieved the same results' date=' I would agree with you, but, as I noted above, it doesn't. With the Power Defense, you have to guess the right amount for the campaign. Or you can leave the Power Defense off and hope it never comes up. If you've guessed wrong, you leave the character open to results that don't match the character conception.[/quote']

 

For 11 points, I should be getting at least 22 Power Defense, and a -1 limitation seems pretty low for the restrictions in question. That will block 6 dice on average. At -2, that's 33 Power Defense. I think that should cover it.

 

Alternatively, you can buy power Damage Reduction, similarly limited, so it will take considerable effect to get a level of either power removed. 50% reduction for 7 points + 12 Pow Def, limited, for another 4 spends the same 11 points and gets a highly effective resistance to the effects you're looking for.

 

1. Persistent with Costs End Only To Activate is against the rules as written' date=' so requires an exception anyway.[/quote']

 

A simple exception beats a new rules construct in my books. When in doubt, I'd use the approach that requires the least changes.

[Dr.Device]

Re: Proposed Advantage: Transformative

 

I'd rather have a simple power or advantage that achieves a reasonably straightforward effect than twist existing advantages in ways that require special exceptions. That's why I use 4th edition Regeneration instead of 5th in my games.

 

I appreciate the comments, though, and will keep them in mind when deciding whether to implement the advantage in my games.

[prestidigitator]

Re: Proposed Advantage: Transformative

 

I love it. I'm going to need to think about this some to see if I have any issues or proposals, but right off the top of my head: and rep!

[Dust Raven]

Re: Proposed Advantage: Transformative

 

I like it. However, I don't think it is useful enough to warrent such a highly specialized Modifier that can only simulate a narrow range of SFX. I'm happy with using existing mechanics to accomplish the same effect and see no need to steamline it.

[schir1964]

Re: Proposed Advantage: Transformative

 

A simple exception beats a new rules construct in my books.

Would the corollary be true then? (8^D)

 

A simple new rule construct beats a complex exception in my books.

 

- Christopher Mullins

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Proposed Advantage: Transformative

 

Would the corollary be true then?

 

A simple new rule construct beats a complex exception in my books.

 

I'd agree. This is the test 5e regeneration fails, IMO.