DEFCON Clown Posted July 24, 2006 Report Share Posted July 24, 2006 Would using slugs instead of shells in a shotgun remove the Reduced Penetration limitation? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thia Halmades Posted July 24, 2006 Report Share Posted July 24, 2006 Re: Another Shotgun Question DMO, but IMO, yes. I think solid slugs are illegal in the Geneva Convention. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEFCON Clown Posted July 24, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 24, 2006 Re: Another Shotgun Question Don't get me started on the Geneva Convention. And thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil Posted July 25, 2006 Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 Re: Another Shotgun Question Would using slugs instead of shells in a shotgun remove the Reduced Penetration limitation? Oh lord yes! And it'd have Increased Stun Mult, maybe Penetrating too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thia Halmades Posted July 25, 2006 Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 Re: Another Shotgun Question Hey, they don't make you a Lord Captain for being pretty. You have to have some skill, but I hadn't gone into details as Basil did, although I agree with him completely. If you're going to model Solid Slug shotty ammo, it should have Increased Stun, probably +1 DC, and probably Pen or AP or R.Pierce (depending on flavor, style & circumstances). I think of them all Pen is the most representative of the damage dealt, although I can make a strong case for AP simply by advent of overwhelming the target with sheer force. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vassoom Posted July 25, 2006 Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 Re: Another Shotgun Question Would using slugs instead of shells in a shotgun remove the Reduced Penetration limitation? Yes. Both the Dark Champions sourcebook and the HERO Equipment Guide have tables for the various Shotgun ammos, including slugs. Like all shotgun damage, "Standard" slugs vary based upon caliber/gauge, of course, but the most common are: [font=Courier New][u]Gauge[/u] [u]DAMAGE[/u] [u]STUN [/u][/font][font=Courier New].410 1[font="]½[/font][/font][font=Courier New]d6 1d6[/font][font=Courier New] 28,24 2d6 1d6 20,16 2d6+1 1d6 12 2[/font][font=Courier New][size=2][font="]½[/font][/size][/font][font=Courier New]d6 1d6 10 3d6 1d6 4 3d6+1 1d6[/font] Standard shotgun slugs have the Limitations Beam, LR(50"), STR Min 6-14, and 2H. "BRI" Slugs (which are more like bullets than standard slugs) lose the LR(50") Limitation. "Explosive" slugs lose the Beam Limitation (I guess because you can't bounce 'em since they tend to blow up when you do ), and gain the Explosion Advantage (+½). Since they don't spread like "shot" does, none of the slugs have the typical shotgun Reduced Penetration (RP) or Reduced by Range (RR) Limitations, nor do they carry the fairly common "shot" AE1 Advantage. They all have the standard shotgun +1 STUN Multiplier. The HERO Equipment Guide has several pages about exotic shotgun ammos. I highly recommend it. - Vassoom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gewing Posted July 25, 2006 Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 Re: Another Shotgun Question Hey' date=' they don't make you a Lord Captain for being pretty. You have to have some skill, but I hadn't gone into details as Basil did, although I agree with him completely. If you're going to model Solid Slug shotty ammo, it should have Increased Stun, probably +1 DC, and probably Pen or AP or R.Pierce (depending on flavor, style & circumstances). I think of them all Pen is the most representative of the damage dealt, although I can make a strong case for AP simply by advent of overwhelming the target with sheer force.[/quote'] Depending on what kind of slug, I would probably go to extra stun, extra damage. Most would not be AP, though some of the sabot varieties probably would be. Particularly the "Balle Souvestre Fleche" (IIRCsp?) SOme slugs open up hugely. IIRC some of the plain lead foster style turn into a "donut" of lead about 1" across. The Barnes x based slug that iirc Federal loads opens up to 1.5" across the "petals" Then there are the explosive fragmentation and HEAT grenades that can be fired by shotguns... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEFCON Clown Posted July 25, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 Re: Another Shotgun Question I know, one of the many reasons I LOVE shotguns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edsel Posted July 25, 2006 Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 Re: Another Shotgun Question The old Ithica MAG-10 shotgun (10 gauge) was developed, in part, for police use. It was also known as the "Roadblocker" since the slugs it used could disable the cars of fleeing suspects who might try to run a road block. And no, you didn't need to hit a tire you had a fair chance of cracking an engine block with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bismark Posted July 25, 2006 Report Share Posted July 25, 2006 Re: Another Shotgun Question I'd like to see the ordnance range that the new Russian 23mm ( ) shotgun can fire... It's probably not practical, but I would like to see a HAFLA round Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil Posted July 26, 2006 Report Share Posted July 26, 2006 Re: Another Shotgun Question At the risk of sounding like I'm emphasising the name at the expense of the meaning, I've always seen Armor Penetrating as "slipping" through the DEF, and Penetrating as just shoving damage through. Thus, I see a shotgun slug as Penetrating, since it "bludgeons" damage through any armor or such. YMMV. It's probably not practical' date=' but I would like to see a HAFLA round [/quote'] I remember the name HAFLA35 from Morrow Project, but have never been clear: is it a one-use flamethrower, or a one-shot incendiary-shell-firing "gun"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edsel Posted July 26, 2006 Report Share Posted July 26, 2006 Re: Another Shotgun Question The HAFLA35 was a single shot disposable weapon that fired an incendary shell. The shell burns at 1300 C for about 120 Seconds. At least that is what my Morrow Project rules book says. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEFCON Clown Posted July 26, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 26, 2006 Re: Another Shotgun Question Ow! How would you right that up in HERO? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sundog Posted July 26, 2006 Report Share Posted July 26, 2006 Re: Another Shotgun Question DMO' date=' but IMO, yes. I think solid slugs are illegal in the Geneva Convention.[/quote'] Just the opposite, actually. Solid slugs, provided they're not designed to deform on impact, are legal. Scattershot technically isn't (though that's yet another aspect of the "Geneva Suggestions" that's commonly ignored). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gewing Posted July 27, 2006 Report Share Posted July 27, 2006 Re: Another Shotgun Question I'd like to see the ordnance range that the new Russian 23mm ( ) shotgun can fire... It's probably not practical, but I would like to see a HAFLA round IIRC they claim there is an AP slug that will punch over 3/8" steel, and a shot load. Imagine 3-4 ounces of shot per blast! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remjin Posted July 31, 2006 Report Share Posted July 31, 2006 Re: Another Shotgun Question Hehe... shotguns rule... and if you really want to see some crazy stuff, just look up all the goofy rounds that are available for a standard pump-action shotgun. Everything from your basic pellets in plain old lead through special "hevi-shot" loads, then plenty of different kinds of slugs and sabots, then the exotics.... Among the exotics includes two slugs connected by a wire supposedly for cutting boat rigging, to slugs combined with pellets, flame-throwing shells, flechettes, expanding rubber, bean-bags, and all sorts of stuff. And, on a side note, hollowpoint slugs? SHEESH. Like the slug isn't big enough... =) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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