Help with Growth: Footprint

[Gideon]

I am building a growth based character for a game (my first ever) and I came upon an interesting "problem".

 

My character has 9 levels (45 points worth) of growth which (according to the chart) makes him 8" high and 4" wide.

 

What I can't figure out is the shape of a 4" footprint.

 

2" is a triangle:

O

OO

 

3" is a hexagon:

OO

OOO

OO

 

What does 4" look like?

[Outsider]

Re: Help with Growth: Footprint

 

Take a normal foot.

 

It is (about) 30cm by 10 cm.

 

9 levels of growth makes for being 8 times as big in every dimension.

 

A 9 level grown foot is going to be 8*30cm by 8*10 cm = 240 cm by 80 cm = about 1.25 hexes by 0.4 hexes. For simplicity, I'd call it 1 hex by 1/2 hex.

 

 

Foe his special "stomp" attack, give him either a big OCV bonus, or AE Hex with an activation roll, since his foot doesnt fill the whole hex.

 

 

Back in the day, I had a bad guy (never played, but people had heard of him) called "Mile High Man".... now he had some big feet!

[Gideon]

Re: Help with Growth: Footprint

 

I meant "footprint" as in size and shape of the area on a battle map the character takes up. Not the size of his Shoes.

 

Sheesh

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Help with Growth: Footprint

 

See attachment.

[Gideon]

Re: Help with Growth: Footprint

 

Killer Shrike: Are you sure?

 

 

a 2" footprint is 2 hexes across in 3 directions:

 

O

OO

 

and a 3" footprint is 3 hexes across in 3 directions:

OO

OOO

OO

 

But the 4" footprint you posted is only 4 hexes across in 1 direction.

[Sean Waters]

Re: Help with Growth: Footprint

 

I meant "footprint" as in size and shape of the area on a battle map the character takes up. Not the size of his Shoes.

 

Sheesh

 

I'd say it was foot shaped.

 

Sheesh

[ghost-angel]

Re: Help with Growth: Footprint

 

From the AoE Templates in the Resource Kit:

 

2" -

 

XX

XYX

XX

 

3" -

 

XXX

XXXX

XXYXX

XXXX

XXX

 

4" -

 

XXXX

XXXXX

XXXXXX

XXXYXXX

XXXXXX

XXXXX

XXXX

 

Y is the Center Hex.

roughly. harder to draw Hex Maps in ASCII.

[Outsider]

Re: Help with Growth: Footprint

 

Oh, ok.

 

If you are, by definition 4" wide, then all you really need to know is how deep you are. Measuring myself, I am about 1/3 as deep in the torso as I am wide at the shoulders. Figure a comic book muscled guy might be a bit thicker.

 

4" wide, 2" deep, close enough. Use Shrike's outline, but trim off the back (or front) 3 hexes.

[ghost-angel]

Re: Help with Growth: Footprint

 

I would use Shrike's hex-footprint as is. 3" Deep x 4" Wide provides about the same space ratio as a person who is 1" Deep x 1" Wide (Normal Sized) does in a standard 2m Hex.

[Outsider]

Re: Help with Growth: Footprint

 

If a person were 1" wide and 1" deep, then you wouldnt be able to get more than one in a hex, nor would another person be able to move through an occupied hex, even if the occupant wasnt interested in trying to stop them.

 

I guess i've been interpreting 'footprint' as the physical space actually occupied by the character, not as that PLUS whatever room he needs to use weapons/maintain full DCV.

[ghost-angel]

Re: Help with Growth: Footprint

 

Right, a person really isn't 1"x1" (i.e. a Hex); but in Game Mechanics each person occupies 1 Hex in Size.

 

and even then, a 2m Hex is a good amount of space when compared to a human body, but when we map things each person is basically assumed to be in A Hex.

 

As you increase in Size your "Hex" increases, when you are 4" Wide you may not actually be All Four Inches, but your personal space is.

[Mister E]

Re: Help with Growth: Footprint

 

[All of the following are brainstormings determined using the new modifiers of +/-1 for doublings/halvings of size that I worked out on another thread: GAZZA's, "This Seems Busted." ]

 

Growing Hand-Prints vs. Shrinking Foot-Prints:

 

Growth 60 = AoE one hex (hex) = No Shrinking

Growth 55

Growth 50

Growth 45 = AoE 1/2 hex (sub1hex) = Shrinking 10

Growth 40

Growth 35

Growth 30 = AoE 1/4 hex (sub2hex) = Shrinking 20

Growth 25

Growth 20

Growth 15 = AoE 1/8 hex (sub3hex) = Shrinking 30

Growth 10

Growth 5

No Growth = AoE 1/16 hex (sub4hex) = Shrinking 40

 

Note: the fractional hexes aren't representative of actual area; e.g., "AoE 1/2 hex," is a 1/2 inched hex. For table-mapping, the juncture of three sub1hexes is the middle of one normal hex.

 

This is interesting. From this, we can deduce that a human-sized character can attack the sub4hex that a character with 4 levels of Shrinking is standing in, making it impossible to use its DCV (assuming its mobility is consistent with its size).

 

Targeting (sub)-Hexes:

 

AoE one hex (hex) = DCV 3

AoE 1/2 hex (sub1hex) = DCV 4

AoE 1/4 hex (sub2hex) = DCV 5

AoE 1/8 hex (sub3hex) = DCV 6

AoE 1/16 hex (sub4hex) = DCV 7

 

How cool is that? Hitting a sub4hex is as hard as hitting a character with DEX 21, with no other modifiers!

 

CV modifiers for size :

 

Shrinking 40 = +4

Shrinking 30 = +3

Shrinking 20 = +2

Shrinking 10 = +1

Normal-Sized Human = No Modifier

Growth 15 = -1

Growth 30 = -2

Growth 45 = -3

Growth 60 = -4

 

Mandatory Linkage of OCV size modifiers is how I would do it... though, a simplified version that just dropped them straight into size powers (or a Size stat) also appeals to me.

 

In conclusion: I don't think +/-2 is the way to go. It quickly creates disparities between size ranges that are irreconcilable; and I simply don't think it offers the kind of useful granularity that a +/-1 based method gives you.

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Help with Growth: Footprint

 

Killer Shrike: Are you sure?

 

 

a 2" footprint is 2 hexes across in 3 directions:

 

O

OO

 

and a 3" footprint is 3 hexes across in 3 directions:

OO

OOO

OO

 

But the 4" footprint you posted is only 4 hexes across in 1 direction.

 

I'm always sure, even when I'm not.

 

 

Seriously though, try not to over think it. The Depth isnt necessarily 4". And, also, you have some latitude even within the increments of growth as to precisely how large a character is. It's also not necessarily true that a character physically fills that hex area fully either, just as a normal sized human doesn't actually completely fill a 1hx area. Exact shape and proportion aren't factored either.

 

If you want your character to be round like a barrel and occupy the equivalent of a 4" column, you can. If you want your character to be more normal shaped and be less deep than they are wide then you can. And so on, within the vaguely defined size range indicated by Growth.

 

In short, you're trying to derive a precise measurement from something that is inherently imprecise.

[Gideon]

Re: Help with Growth: Footprint

 

Mister E: I'm sorry, but HUH? I don't understand.

 

Killer Shriek: The actual size of the character (IE hight, shoulder width, waist size, etc...) are not what I am talking about. Ghost-angle got it right when he said:

...a person really isn't 1"x1" (i.e. a Hex); but in Game Mechanics each person occupies 1 Hex in Size.

I am talking strictly about the shape of the area a 4" wide "person" takes up on a battle map. My GM uses a map a lot for combat, so I want to make templates for my character that represent the hexes he "occupies" while grown.

[ghost-angel]

Re: Help with Growth: Footprint

 

I am talking strictly about the shape of the area a 4" wide "person" takes up on a battle map. My GM uses a map a lot for combat' date=' so I want to make templates for my character that represent the hexes he "occupies" while grown.[/quote']

 

Yeah, I would definitely go with the foot print KillerShrike originally posted personally.

[Gideon]

Re: Help with Growth: Footprint

 

I intend to show my GM Killer Shriek's original foot print. I just wanted to make sure it is correct, because compared to the other foot prints it seems somehow off. However, since nothing else makes any bit of sense that is what I will go with.

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Help with Growth: Footprint

 

I intend to show my GM Killer Shriek's original foot print. I just wanted to make sure it is correct' date=' because compared to the other foot prints it seems somehow off. However, since nothing else makes [i']any bit[/i] of sense that is what I will go with.

 

It's Killer SHRIKE not Killer Shriek. Like the bird.

[Gideon]

Re: Help with Growth: Footprint

 

*bow's head shamefully* I'm sorry it won't happen again.

[Mister E]

Re: Help with Growth: Footprint

 

Mister E: I'm sorry' date=' but HUH? I don't understand. [/quote']

 

Sorry, I was just showing a way to relate the 'footprints' of shrunk characters with AoE attacks derived from the 'handprints' of proportionally enlarged characters.

 

For instance: a character with 60 pts of Growth is suggested to be able to do AoE (1" hex) attacks with its fists.

 

Thus, a 45 pt "growth-giant" should be able to do the same AoE (1/2" hex) to a 10 pt "shrink-dwarf"... say, by stepping on it... but stepping on a 1/2" Hex should be harder than stepping on a 1" Hex.

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Help with Growth: Footprint

 

Sorry, I was just showing a way to relate the 'footprints' of shrunk characters with AoE attacks derived from the 'handprints' of proportionally enlarged characters.

 

For instance: a character with 60 pts of Growth is suggested to be able to do AoE (1" hex) attacks with its fists.

Actually, this isnt true. It's unintuitive and illogical, but such a character has to buy AoE for their STR as a Naked Power Advantage.

 

I know this because I used to think the same thing until Steve said it ain't so.

[Tonio]

Re: Help with Growth: Footprint

 

It's Killer SHRIKE [...] Like the bird.

 

Oh really! I always thought it was the Hyperion Shrike your name made reference to!

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Help with Growth: Footprint

 

Oh really! I always thought it was the Hyperion Shrike your name made reference to!

 

Nope, and not the Marvel character either. Long time ago I needed a new handle for Mechwarrior, and picked it by flipping thru a bird watchers book my grandmother had. I was looking at the red and black african shrike which looks rather cool, and the impaling of things on thorns sounded cool (to an adolescent boy), and it fit my favored "death from above" play style. One thing lead to another, and I kept using it for other things, and eventually it just became my default "online" handle. Now at 33, in retrospect, I'd probably pick a less colorful name, but at this point it would be too much effort to abandon it.