Sharing Charges? Regenerating Charges?

[TrickstaPriest]

Test. It threw an error last time I tried, and I don't want to retype three paragraphs again for no reason.

[TrickstaPriest]

Here we go...

 

Alright, sorry about that.

I've been fairly new to Hero, or rather, new to the Hero System. I used Champions a long time ago, and recently decided to pick up the Fifth Ed. Hero System book. For practice, I've been converting some of my characters from other games to it, and as you can imagine I've already hit some snags.

 

A few of the characters have a special set of powers powered by their own ability points. Since none of these powers use normal END, Charges would be very useful in this. However, there is nothing mentioned about powers Sharing Charges in anything other than Multipowers, and none of these powers will work within a Framework (for a variety of reasons). Furthermore, there are ways for these characters to steal or regenerate these points, which normally recover at 1 per hour. This recovery rate itself shouldn't be a big issue, since it'll take at least 12 hours to fully recover a set, up to 20 hours for those with a lot. Furthermore, I get into situations where some of the powers use multiple Charges. I considered dividing the Total Charges by the Used Charges to figure out the "Charge Range" it would be on the chart, but I still lack a way of sharing them, as I am not sure how much of a Limitation that is, or how exactly to handle it.

 

I considered using an END battery, but it will get awkward for some of the powers, especially since there isn't an exact control for the cost of the powers the way there is with Charges (Some of the powers are powerful but exceedingly cheap, just with Limitations to even it out.).

 

Even if someone finds another method of doing this, knowing how to make powers share Charges would be exceedingly useful anyway, so that is really two questions in one. The other ones would be "Does the method I'm using for multiple charges sound acceptable?", and "What kind of power could be used for recovering/stealing these charges?" The only thing I could think of for stealing is using the power that recovers them linked to a power that removes them from another.

[Hugh Neilson]

You mention already looking at END batteries, but this seems the most effective means of accomplishing what you're looking for. "Multiple charges" equate to higher END costs from the battery, it gradually recovers and you could use Aid, Absorb, Healing and/or Transfers to boost its END stealing points from others.

 

If you also want to slap a limit on how many times a day the power(s) can be used, each power could have its own charges, or the END battery itself could be charged simulating a limit to the number of times per day you can draw on it.

 

My general approach is not to try to duplicate other games' mechanics too precisely, especially when it gets exceptionally complicated under the Hero system. If I want to play a D&D wizard, I'll play D&D. In Hero, I look for something different from what I can play in whatever other game.

[TrickstaPriest]

Hmm...

 

Yes, I do tend to play different RPG games depending on the type of character I want to play. This was mainly an exercise in learning the finer points of HERO (and sadly enough, the characters in question work BEST in HERO! Let's not get into the crap I pulled out of my *** for the original game...), and to get used to doing various "tinkering." The main problem with the END battery is the lack of control over END costs. Although, I am wondering if you could buy "No END Cost" over only part of a power...? Actually, there's a whole other question, could someone by an Advantage on an Advantage? I know you can buy Limitations on Advantages, but...

Also, if anyone had seen an example in a book somewhere on someone using a Shared Charges Limitation, that could be very helpful as a general rule. I can think of a lot of other character concepts it could be useful for, even if this one doesn't need it.

[SCUBA Hero]

Re: Hmm...

 

Originally posted by TrickstaPriest

The main problem with the END battery is the lack of control over END costs.

You can buy different levels of Reduced or Increased END on parts of the Power. Klunky, but it does let you force the END costs to where you want them to be.

Originally posted by TrickstaPriest

Although, I am wondering if you could buy "No END Cost" over only part of a power...?

Yes! See above.

Originally posted by TrickstaPriest

Actually, there's a whole other question, could someone by an Advantage on an Advantage?

Not sure I understand this one. More info?

Originally posted by TrickstaPriest

Also, if anyone had seen an example in a book somewhere on someone using a Shared Charges Limitation, that could be very helpful as a general rule. I can think of a lot of other character concepts it could be useful for, even if this one doesn't need it.

I haven't seen one, but I'd handle it as if the Charges were in a Multipower: apply the Charges Advantage to each Power, but they all draw off of the same Charges 'reserve'. Yes, it's more costly than buying the same amount of Charges for each Power - just as it is in a Multipower.

 

Although I do recommend using and END Reserve, not Charges.

 

Example: Generic Energy Blast:

6d6 EB (30); 0 END (+1/2) (45)

plus

4d6 EB (20); 1/2 END (+1/4) (25)

plus

2d6 EB (10)

plus

2d6 EB (10) x2 END (-1/4) (8)

 

The character can throw 6d6 all day without draining the END Reserve, 10d6 for 1 END, 12d6 for 2 END, or 14d6 for 4 END.

 

Flavor to taste.

 

Helps?

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Hmm...

 

Originally posted by TrickstaPriest

The main problem with the END battery is the lack of control over END costs. Although, I am wondering if you could buy "No END Cost" over only part of a power...?

 

You can buy partially limited powers - why not partially advantaged? The "partially limited powers" description on FREd p 180 is a good example of a character who has variable END costs on different levels of power. Just apply Reduced End to the first 4d6 in the example.

 

Some advantages are clearly absolute, but a lot could work on the basis that you forego the advantage entirely if you choose to use the non-advantaged dice.

 

Actually, there's a whole other question, could someone by an Advantage on an Advantage? I know you can buy Limitations on Advantages, but...

 

So, like, AP is 0 END? Again, I can't see why not. Someone will doubtless show up to tell me exactly how I'm giving away the farm here, but let's say you had an 8d6 AP blast. That costs 60 points, of which 20 is the AP. It should cost 6 END, of which 2 is for AP. For 10 points, make AP cost 0 END and the entire attack costs 4 END. [Mind you, it would be more efficient to make the whole attack 1/2 END for 10 points, so it costs 3 END]

 

A lot of advantages clearly need to apply to the power as a whole (eg. you can't Trigger just the AP portion of the attack).

[Lord Liaden]

You can indeed (with GM permission) buy an Advantage on an Advantage, if the Advantage is Naked (see "Naked Advantages" in the 5E rulebook and the online FAQ). A Naked Advantage is treated as a separate Power in terms of its END cost and any Advantages and Limitations applied to it. So for example, you could buy an Energy Blast with Armor Piercing as a Naked Advantage (if there's a GM-acceptable reason for it to be separate from the base Power) and purchase Reduced Endurance just for the AP Advantage.

[Locnar]

I too was recently looking for a way to have a "pool" of charges for powers to draw off of. This is better than an END reserve for some effects. The problem with and END reserve is that is comes back too fast.

[JmOz]

So you buy the REC with a limitation

[Hugh Neilson]

Originally posted by Locnar

I too was recently looking for a way to have a "pool" of charges for powers to draw off of. This is better than an END reserve for some effects. The problem with and END reserve is that is comes back too fast.

 

Not if you move the REC up the time chart.

[TrickstaPriest]

Originally posted by Lord Liaden

You can indeed (with GM permission) buy an Advantage on an Advantage, if the Advantage is Naked (see "Naked Advantages" in the 5E rulebook and the online FAQ). A Naked Advantage is treated as a separate Power in terms of its END cost and any Advantages and Limitations applied to it. So for example, you could buy an Energy Blast with Armor Piercing as a Naked Advantage (if there's a GM-acceptable reason for it to be separate from the base Power) and purchase Reduced Endurance just for the AP Advantage.

 

Alright, I was wondering what a "Naked Advantage" was. Perhaps I missed something when I read through that part, so I couldn't quite understand it. And now that I've gone through both Charges and END Reserve, I think that END Reserve would work better in the end, although I can easily think of some uses for knowing how to group Charges. I'll probably have to make another topic at some point for some of the trickier things, but I think I can figure most of it out as a general rule now.