Abilities Discussion

[ajackson]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

Yeah, Viper-X hits like a truck; I think I've seen him do 3000+. Someone with super-con and invulnerability or 8 stacks of defiance could probably survive a hit without blocking, but that's not me. I also had a lot of trouble telling when he was about to go nova on me, though the fact there were ten players, plus pets, beating on him may have contributed to the confusion.

[Certified]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

I also had a lot of trouble telling when he was about to go nova on me' date=' though the fact there were ten players, plus pets, beating on him may have contributed to the confusion.[/quote']

 

Yeah, it takes a lot to bring him down. I wonder if it would be so bad if Viper-X spit out half damage and double the number of big attacks.

[Steve Long]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

I also swapped out Smoke Grenade for Killer Instinct. SG was a good effect, but its long cool down was just too much. When I have time to play its for relatively brief windows of time, so my play style favors go go go; powers that I might feel the need to wait for before jumping into something are a detriment. I can't really tell if Killer Instinct is working or not because its really subtle, but my energy management seems a bit easier so maybe it is.

 

I got Killer Instinct relatively early on with Harbinger and have really enjoyed it; I kept it in the respec. It really helps keep the energy flowing in so I can pop off another round of Two-Gun Mojo when I need it. In the respec I added Accelerated Metabolism to 2GM and Gunfighter, and they both seem good too, though I need to give them a real workout on missions rather than isolated encounters.

 

Otherwise in the respec, I dropped some powers I wasn't using much and replaced them with Lock 'n' Load, Sniper Rifle, and Frag Grenade. So far so good; looking forward to trying them out a bit more. Also reworked the Advantages and ranks for several Powers that I kept to better suit my style of play.

[ajackson]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

To sum things up' date=' for Regeneration characters if you're going in against some of these big guns bring meat shields... uh... I mean friends.[/quote']

Given the aggro system, even that doesn't really help.

[Certified]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

The though there is to give some kind of forgiveness if you miss a block and to give something other than Invulnerability a chance to work.

[Zed-F]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

Given the aggro system' date=' even that doesn't really help.[/quote']

They are supposedly fixing the aggro system so that it's somewhat less chaotic. That said, I think their intention is NOT to make it behave like WoW where a tank can nearly always guarantee being able to hold aggro. Support characters and glass cannons should expect to have to take fewer hits, but still take the occasional hit, so bear that in mind when designing your support characters and glass cannons.

 

Regen users should keep that in mind as well, and consider supplementary mitigation/debuff powers if they intend to go toe to toe with heavy hitters.

[freshrod]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

Greetings

 

I've been doing well with Uncle Samson, my Martial Arts/Constitution brawler. I say if you want to solo, you need massive Constitution (I have around 63 at level 18) Endurance, and Recovery.

 

You also should keep enough strength to be able to throw medium sized objects. This can be done with talents and gear. It really help to be able to throw an object, then fly in with some ranged attack, and then start beating away. Usually the first guy is almost down before you get there.

 

As for passive, Regeration gets my vote. In most instances, unles you got yourself in a bad spot with multiple villians, you can just block and still manage to heal with everyone beating on you. At least this way you build power for a quick attack (hopefully something with a stun or hold), smack one down then go back to blocking until you're healed enough for the next guy.

 

As for travel powers, nothing beats flight in my book. You can avoid aggro, and still see what you are getting into before you commit. I have Jet Boots. I know it sucks for some characters wanting to stay with a theme, but hey, you get what you get.

 

And about the "Bullet for Bissle(sp?) Mission. What the heck is up with Sniper-X?!?! He's impossible. Ok, maybe not, but I wouldn't try without at least a group of 5. I tried last night with 2 others and could barely scratch him. Tough.

[SvZurich]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

I had no issues with the Snipers in Bullet for Bissle (Invuln/Might build) although those tough foes did lower my health. Viper-X however, well, I stood the best chance of going toe to toe with him but couldn't dent his health.

 

I have over 3700 health at L20 as the tank build, the second rank in Retaliation (block), maxed Invuln, and even block he once hit me for 1200. Normally he hit for 127-150, but he has a strong hit that was much greater. I tried Roomsweeper, Thunderclap, Havoc Stomp, and Beatdown, but could barely move his health. With a lot more DPS he would have been okay.

 

One thing I did like, is the advantage in Reliation that I took instead of the third rank. It says I have a 20% chance to kick when receiving damage while blocking, and it procs often. It doesn't do much damage, but it does keep the foes from attacking for a bit and gives me another tool to control them. When I kick it knocks all the foes around me away for what it says is up to 39'. It knocked Medusa and Psimon back when they did their big attacks, and made things much easier. Yes, I have to chase a foe down, but they are not able to attack for a few seconds which you can use to attack another foe or bring down a henchman for possible health.

 

I try to focus on Villains in fights and smash the henchmen down first only when my health dips significantly. I think Invuln is a damn good power. Sure I miss Regen's constant heals, but my Str/Con focus pays off in spades with Invuln. 32% bonus resistance coupled with 30 flat damage reduction currently.

[Zed-F]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

Invulnerability and Regen are certainly the two most popular defensive passives at the moment, from what I've read. But another important thing to remember is to pick a build where you can actually see to block when you need to. My own invulnerability character is pretty tough defensively, but I have noticed a decline in her survivability when she uses Micromissiles because the effects are so busy that I sometimes can't see to block properly.

 

I'm probably respeccing her to Celestial / Gadgeteering anyway once the Celestial set is out, though, so I'm not really too concerned about it. I may make another Invulnerable character later.

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

A) Celestial Power Set?

 

Are there other proposed new sets? Where is such information to be found?

[SvZurich]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

Here are all the details we know.

 

http://www.champions-online.com/promo/bloodmoon/bloodmoon.html

 

Celestial is supposted to be a support (healing) set. That's all we know at this time.

[Zed-F]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

From the latest dev chat, IIRC Celestial is supposed to have 2 aspects to it, and many powers will behave differently depending on which aspect is dominant. We also know all powersets are supposed to be capable of soloing with minimal delving into other trees. So I'm guessing the two aspects in question are something like mercy (support) and wrath (damage.)

 

I've made SuperMouse to be a re-attempt at what Cyber Angel was originally intended to evolve into -- that being a melee-oriented Invulnerable character with some ranged attacks and a ranged energy builder. Since I was so underwhelmed with power armour I went with Force this time around (which is also fitting for a Mighty Mouse tribute character since the original also had some odd TK-like force powers.)

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

Hmm. Celestial - Seraphim / Nephilim: smells like the squid alien unlocks from CoH.

 

I'd much rather see them work thru "hard" sets that should be in a supers game -> Growth, Shrinking, Stretching, Shapeshift, and so forth.

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

Anyone have any thoughts on the various Block powers? Are they necessary, or even just really good? I see a lot of min max builds utilizing the energy-returning shield for instance.

[ajackson]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

Anyone have any thoughts on the various Block powers? Are they necessary' date=' or even just really good?[/quote']

Block gets rather important at higher levels, and an improved block helps a lot there. Other than that, the lingering block powers grant quite substantial benefits.

[Steve Long]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

I'd much rather see them work thru "hard" sets that should be in a supers game -> Growth, Shrinking, Stretching, Shapeshift, and so forth

 

I think a lot of what HERO calls Body-Affecting Powers are unlikely. Some may be feasible, but from my discussions with Cryptic folk I understand that Growth, Shrinking, and Stretching all present certain programming and game performance problems that probably cannot be overcome.

[ajackson]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

Some may be feasible' date=' but from my discussions with Cryptic folk I understand that Growth, Shrinking, and Stretching all present certain programming and game performance problems that probably cannot be overcome.[/quote']

Um... the animation for growth (up to x2) and shrinking (up to quite a lot) are already in the game (look at the gadgeteer miniaturization device, or the growth effect on enrage). Now, adjusting the reach of melee powers to compensate for growth and shrinking might be tricky, and stretching would also require new animations. However, making persistent size change actually look good in game would likely be harder.

 

In general, the melee power sets could use some help.

[SvZurich]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

I have Retaliation ranked to 2 with Punitive Pummeling. It really does help when I can turn a 8000 point alpha strike into 1200. For Might, Retaliation adds to my next attack's damage, and Punitive Pummeling is a 360 degree kick that knocks all foes around me away giving me a breather. Looks sweet when it triggers for free damage while continuing to block.

[ajackson]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

I have Retaliation ranked to 2 with Punitive Pummeling. It really does help when I can turn a 8000 point alpha strike into 1200.

*cough*. Yes, some of the open missions really teach you the virtues of blocking. I think the first one where you're likely to being one-shotted if you don't block is Viper-X in A Bullet for Bisell, though he generally doesn't seem to go over 4k or so in one hit.

[Phil]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

Well, I'm enjoying the fighting claws power set, but I probably wouldn't recommend it. Damage doesn't seems to be any more than my Mentalist character with telepathic and telekinetic ranged attacks, and of course you get the big hits on you by being in melee. Plus Telepathy attacks tend to have a hold linked to them, which are great for taking on groups of 4 or 5 baddies, especially when Telepathic Revurburation increases the damage you dish out for every NPC you have in a hold!

 

Regen seems a good power, particularly so long as you're not getting really REALLY big hits on you, as you can hide behind a block and allow your END to recharge for a nice hefty counter-punch. Lightning Reflexes don't have such an obvious benefit, but the high Dodge chance must have some impact - it's kinda hard to compare my two characters tho, as one has EGO/DEX and the claws character has CON/REC, so they have very different tolerances for taking hits!

 

I do LOVE Telekinetic Shield though, and am a bit sad that there's no shield-like power in the Fighting power set. Unless I'm missing something, which is entirely possible!

[Certified]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

 

I do LOVE Telekinetic Shield though, and am a bit sad that there's no shield-like power in the Fighting power set. Unless I'm missing something, which is entirely possible!

 

It's a video game that means video game martial arts right? Why not throw in some elemental powers, you know add a little Hadouken to your Karate and all. Mix and match a few Elemental shields and pick up some range. Sure you could do this with any power set but who can resist a Wave Motion Fist? Now I leave you to debate if that's a Fire Power or Force Power.

 

- - -

 

So joking aside, I've only done custom Frameworks since I started playing. I can't seem to bring myself to commit to a pure powerset. For those doing a powerset are you able to dip into other groups for something like a block or ranged attack?

[Netzilla]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

So joking aside, I've only done custom Frameworks since I started playing. I can't seem to bring myself to commit to a pure powerset. For those doing a powerset are you able to dip into other groups for something like a block or ranged attack?

 

Yes. All powers have 2 potential qualifications:

 

Tier 0: no qualifications

Tier 1: 2 from same Framework or 3 others

Tier 2: 3 from same Framework or 5 others

Tier 3: 5 from same Framework or 7 others

(caveat: those numbers are off the top of my head)

 

So, TK shield being a T1 power would require you to either have 2 TK powers or 3 from another power set before you could purchase it. Only powers not tag as 'Energy Building' count for these purposes.

 

Most of my characters end up doing this since a single Framework doesn't usually fulfill the entire concept. For example, Neutron's an old character of mine that was linked to a primordial black hole giving him Density Control and Gravity powers. So, in CO, I started him off as a pure Might character for the DI and at about his mid-teens branched him into a couple TK powers to simulate the gravity control.

[ajackson]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

So joking aside' date=' I've only done custom Frameworks since I started playing. I can't seem to bring myself to commit to a pure powerset. For those doing a powerset are you able to dip into other groups for something like a block or ranged attack?[/quote']

If you don't dip into any other power sets, you can get tier 2 abilities at level 8 and tier 3 abilities at level 14. Each dip delays you by 3 levels, though you will always be able to get tier 2 by level 17 and tier 3 by level 26.

[Zed-F]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

And while having access to T2 and T3 powers early can be somewhat helpful, it's by no means necessary. A lot of the really useful energy management powers, blocks, slotted passives, and so forth are T1-T2 powers so it's usually not hard to find stuff that you will eventually be wanting anyway.

[Phil]

Re: Abilities Discussion

 

It's a video game that means video game martial arts right? Why not throw in some elemental powers' date=' you know add a little Hadouken to your Karate and all. Mix and match a few Elemental shields and pick up some range. [/quote']

 

Well, I would, but unfortunately I'm slavishly restricting myself to my character concept. Gila Monster not understand Hadouken. Gila Monster not understand Elemental shields. Gila Monster slash with Gila hands. Then bad guys no come back. Nice people buy Gila cheesecake with flies on top. Gila happy