Building robot henchmen

[Tryskhell]

Hey guys, I'm quite new to the HERO system, but I want to GM for it with my pals

 

One of the villain factions in my (totaly homebrew) setting is the Kureiji Warai, a very Yakuza-esque league of villains that aren't afraid to kill led by a super named Laughing Dragon. In the Kureiji, there is a super gadgeteer who builds weapons and robot henchmen -nicknamed Bunrakus- for the gang, Red Pupeteer, so I'd like to create a bunch of different bunbrakus for my players to "kill", but I have a whole lot of questions.

 

My players will start with 400 points (75 complication points) characters, normal SPD between 3 and 5, up to 8 or 9 for speedsters.

I want multiple levels of bunrakus, from simple grunts that fall in one hit to commanders that are just bellow them in terms of firepower. I would also like different types, from quick and agile ninjas to tanky samuraïs and deadly snipers.

 

I don't know how many points I should give them, tho. I would imagine something like 150 for the grunts and maybe 350 for the more powerful, but I tried making a grunt ninja and I ended up being extremely short on martial manoeuvers and equipment.

 

So, how many points should I attribute them ? Should I give them complications like any characters ? Should I account equipments in character points ?

 

I tried to find references, but I couldn't find a lot. I'm short on money, so pricey PDFs are a no-no (unfortunately). So if some of you could share your work on the subject for me to get references, I would be soooo happy

 

PS : I'm French, so my english might be broken as frick, sorry for that :x

[Ninja-Bear]

Welcome Tryskhell! Ok since these robots are for villains, you don’t have to hold to a point budget. The points you posted are a good guideline, but say your basic robot is 163 cp no problem. I would focus more on building them to how you expect them to give damage and take damage rather than total points.

[Gnome BODY (important!)]

For NPCs, ignore points and focus instead on their CV, DCs, and defenses.  How they perform in combat is important.  How much they cost is irrelevant. 

What you really need to care about is how often they'll hit the heroes and how hard, and how many attacks it'll take the heroes to take them down.  You can math it out by taking your PCs average damage and CVs and seeing how many attacks result in hits against a given DCV and then how many hits it takes to KO a given STUN and defense.  Or you can run a fight against your PCs and just keep track of who hit who for how much while saying "around now this one should drop" and then using those damage numbers to determine defensive traits. 

 

Likewise, give them whatever complications you think are fitting.  Focus on things that will make the game interesting, such as a weakness the heroes might be able to exploit. 

[Tryskhell]

Okay guys, thanks, I'll keep that in mind !

[Christopher]

8 hours ago, Gnome BODY (important!) said:

For NPCs, ignore points and focus instead on their CV, DCs, and defenses.  How they perform in combat is important.  How much they cost is irrelevant. 

While it is true that as a GM you can "fudge the Numbers", the points can still give you a clear indication of power. Especialyl for a new GM, I would not underestimate it.

[Christopher]

11 hours ago, Tryskhell said:

I want multiple levels of bunrakus, from simple grunts that fall in one hit to commanders that are just bellow them in terms of firepower. I would also like different types, from quick and agile ninjas to tanky samuraïs and deadly snipers. 

That 1st parts sounds like you want to apply a "1 hit KO" rule. I know the Hero System has one of those, but I can not find it right now. It is a common technique to avoid having to track too much with high numbers of combatants.

 

Personally I would prefer just making sheets for a whole Squad of those low level mooks. 1-2 Squads of Grunts and 1 Samurai is a lot easier to track that way.

 

11 hours ago, Tryskhell said:

My players will start with 400 points (75 complication points) characters, normal SPD between 3 and 5, up to 8 or 9 for speedsters. 

That spread of SPD is unusually wide. Even if hte 3 was for one Characters primary form, 5-9 is very extreme. The usual spread is something around: 5-7.

SPD is not only a mater of game balance, but also of "player engagement". The player of the 9 SPD guy will act 3 times as often per Turn as the 3 SPD guy, wich can cause issues.

 

11 hours ago, Tryskhell said:

I don't know how many points I should give them, tho. I would imagine something like 150 for the grunts and maybe 350 for the more powerful, but I tried making a grunt ninja and I ended up being extremely short on martial manoeuvers and equipment.

Martial Arts are about getting OCV and damage for cheap-ish. Basically they are limited Combat Values and Damage Classes.

 

How dangerous mooks are depends on how the heroes defenses (Defense, CV's, SPD and thus Abort potential) are laid out. If the heroes can just ignore them because their OCV and Damage is too low to even force the glass canon to abort, then they are missing their point. That is another reason a too wide spread can be an issue.

Maxim 34. "If you’re leaving scorch-marks, you need a bigger gun."

personal addition Maxim 34a "If you are not even leaving sorch-marks, you should have run."

 

 

Lets see what the ground rules are:

The Superheroic setting is clear.

 

What rules version are you using?

5E? 6E? The somewhat modified 6E from Champions Complete*?

The points indicate one of the 6E versions, but better to be sure.

 

*I am unsure if that is the right name. I know there has been a new-ish subversion of 6E that among othr things, abolished Mind Classes.

 

 

Robots tend toward using the "Automaton" Rules Construct with the Automaton Powers (newly seperated from Automaton Rules construct in 6E). But if you want to make it easy on yourself, you can just make them normal Character sheets without even Automaton powers. Even a simple Automaton Power like "Takes no STUN" can be a huge headache for the beginners.

 

As they are robots, they should usually fall into the "Machine" class of minds. Wich means many default version of Mental Powers would not work on them. But "Machine Class" Mental powers (Superhacking and Technopathy) would work in turn. Basically they get to "shift" their mindclass for free. But then have to live with the downsides if a Technopath or Superhacker is around. But again, you can make it easy on yourself and just say "their positronic brains are close enough to humans that those powers work".

[Ninja-Bear]

6 hours ago, Christopher said:

While it is true that as a GM you can "fudge the Numbers", the points can still give you a clear indication of power. Especialyl for a new GM, I would not underestimate it.

You would think so but no. Raw numbers are really a very rough indicator because this being Hero it depends more on where and how much you spend your points than just looking at a total number.

[Tech]

Agreed Ninja-Bear. I can make two characters at an arbitrary 300 pts and one will be wonderful for combat, the other not so much. Still, a 300 pt combat monster and a 400 pt combat monster are considerably different.

[Ninja-Bear]

Now back on point,  Tryskhell what book are you using for the rules? I ask because there might be something in it to use as a starting point.

[Tryskhell]

I have the two 6th Ed base rule books and champion powers

[Christopher]

13 hours ago, Ninja-Bear said:

Now back on point,  Tryskhell what book are you using for the rules? I ask because there might be something in it to use as a starting point.

Based on the 400 points/75 Complciations figure, I bet for one of the 1.5 version of 6E.

 

6E2 214 has example Charcters, but nothing on the "Agent" level. Only full 400 point Supers.

 

However Champions 6E 288 has a whole Minion Gallery. Among them "Agents" and "Robots". They are build on either:

• 50/25 (Street Thug only)
• 100/30 (normal Soldier only)
• 175/50 (the most common one)
• 275/50 (Ninja and Demon only)
• 400/75 (Robot only)

 

The Agent is builkt on 175/50:
" AGENT
Val Char Cost Roll notes
15 STR 5 12- Lift 200 kg; 3d6 HTH damage [1]
14 DEX 8 12-
13 CON 3 12-
10 INT 0 11- PER Roll 11-
10 EGO 0 11-
13 PRE 3 12- PRE Attack: 2½d6
5 OCV 10
5 DCV 10
3 OMCV 0
3 DMCV 0
3 SPD 10 Phases: 4, 8, 12
4 PD 2 Total: 10 PD (6 rPD)
4 ED 2 Total: 10 ED (6 rED)
6 REC 2
25 END 1
12 BODY 2
30 STUN 5 Total Characteristics Cost: 63
movement: Running: 12m
Cost Powers EnD
32 Blaster Rifle: Multipower, 52-point reserve [32]
32 Charges for entire Multipower (+¼); all OAF (-1)
2f 1) Basic Setting: Blast 8d6
OAF (-1)
2f 2) Autofre Setting: Blast 7d6
Autofre (5 shots, +½); OAF (-1), Limited Range
(60m; -¼)
Martial Arts: Brawling
Maneuver OCV DCV Notes
4 Block +2 +2 Block, Abort
4 Dodge — +5 Dodge, Affects All Attacks,
Abort
4 Punch +0 +2 5d6 Strike
3 Throw +0 +1 3d6 + v/10; Target Falls
10 Armored Uniform: Resistant Protection (6 PD/6 ED) 0
OIF (-½), Activation Roll 14- (does not protect Hit
Locations 3-5 or 6-7; -¼)
6 Helmet Radio: Radio Perception/Transmission
(Radio Group) 0
OIF (-½), Affected As Hearing Group As Well As Radio
Group (-¼)
Skills
6 +2 with Blaster Rifle Multipower
3 Combat Driving 12-
3 Concealment 11-
3 Interrogation 12-
2 KS: The Local Underworld 11-
1 KS: The Superhuman World 8-
2 PS: Agent 11-
3 Shadowing 11-
3 Stealth 12-
3 Streetwise 12-
3 WF: Small Arms, Blades
Total Powers & Skills Cost: 99
Total Cost: 162
175 matching Complications (50)
5 Distinctive Features: criminal organization’s uniform
(Easily Concealed; Noticed And Recognizable)
10 Hunted: criminal organization (Infrequently, Mo Pow, NCI,
Watching)
15 Psychological Complication: Amoral And Greedy
(Common, Strong)
20 Social Complication: Subject To Orders (Very Frequently,
Major)
Total Complications Points: 50
Experience Points: 0
"

 

Unfortuantely they increase the Powerlevels, with the Robot clocking in at a 400/75 figure:
" ROBOT
Val Char Cost Roll notes
15 STR 5 12- Lift 200 kg; 3d6 HTH damage [1]
15 DEX 10 12-
10 CON 0 11-
15 INT 5 12- PER Roll 12-
0 EGO 0 —
15 PRE 5 12- PRE Attack: 3d6
6 OCV 15
5 DCV 30
0 OMCV 0
0 DMCV 0
3 SPD 10 Phases: 4, 8, 12
8 PD 21 Total: 8 PD (8 rPD)
8 ED 21 Total: 8 ED (8 rED)
4 REC 0
0 END -4
15 BODY 5
— STUN — Total Characteristics Cost: 123
movement: Running: 12m
Cost Powers EnD
60 Built-In Weapons: Multipower, 60-point reserve
6f 1) Blaster: Blast 8d6 0
Reduced Endurance (0 END; +½)
6f 2) Laser: RKA 2½d6 0
Reduced Endurance (0 END; +½)
4f 3) Tangleweb Projector: Entangle 6d6, 6 PD/6 ED [8]
8 Charges (-½)
4f 4) Grenade Launcher: Blast 8d6 [8]
Area Of Effect (18m Radius Explosion; +½);
8 Charges (-½)
15 Robotic Form: Does Not Bleed 0
10 Robotic Form: No Hit Locations 0
45 Robotic Form: Takes No STUN 0
7 Robotic Form: Reduced Endurance (0 END; +½)
on STR 0
6 Robotic Form: Reduced Endurance (0 END; +½)
on Running 0
1 Robotic Form: Reduced Endurance (0 END; +½)
on Leaping 0
1 Robotic Form: Reduced Endurance (0 END; +½)
on Swimming 0
24 Robotic Form: Resistant (+½) for 8 PD/8 ED 0
26 Robotic Form: Life Support: Total (except for Safe Environments) 0
5 Visual Sensors: Infrared Perception (Sight Group) 0

12

Radio Sensors: HRRP (Radio Group) Talents

0

3 Absolute Time Sense
3 Bump Of Direction
5 Eidetic Memory
3 Lightning Calculator
Skills
3 Computer Programming 12-
3 Cryptography 12-
3 Electronics 12-
3 AK: Earth 12-
2 KS: Everything 11-
3 Stealth 13-
Total Powers & Skills Cost: 263
Total Cost: 386
400 matching Complications (75)
15 Enraged: Berserk if exposed to intense magnetic felds
(Uncommon), go 8-, recover 14-
25 Psychological Complication: Loyal To Master (Very
Common, Total)
10 Vulnerability: 1½ x BODY From Gravity, Magnetic, Or
Force Attacks (Common)
Total Complications Points: 50
Experience Points: 0
"

It uses the 45 point Variant of "Takes no STUN", wich means ability loss when it takes bod damage (similar to the Focus power loss rules).