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Checking to see if there would be any interest in a Dark Champions style game, roughly 300 starting points, with a house rule of no VPP or multipowers, and limiting megascale. A once a week game for 3 hours, with 4-6 players. 

Think characters at the netflix superhero level, plus vampires and werewolf's similar to Underworld. Supers are out in the public, but its new. Supernaturals are still hiding. There would also be guns. Tech level would be close to 2020 real. I'm thinking 6th edition. I might be able to drag in 3 people. 

Edited by Zarthose
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I would be interested in playing, I have all the books for Dark Champions and actually prefer the street level over the regular Superhero campaign.  However, I have never played Champions and don't know all the rules and not sure how much people might want to put up with someone trying to learn on the ropes.  I have played other RPGs over the years, including other superhero genres, so the role playing I can do, it's just the game mechanics and the rules I'm a little unsure of.  I have several street level hero concepts that I would love to convert to a Dark Champions vigilante.  What is the day you are looking to play on?



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Hello Shadow, and Panpiper, Yesterday this was a whim, to see if anyone is interested. Today I am working on details.

Vampires/Werewolf would be each a 100 point package, plus skills, eq and base stats before the power up. Both would have to have the ability to infect others to replenish the troops, each with about 5,000 memebers to start world wide (undercover). Magic would not be a thing.


DCV,OCV would maybe average 6-7, hard max of 10. Damage classes would be a hard max of 12, Defenses I can see letting go unlimited...if you just want to be immune, spend your points that way...You still can't fly, or hit, or teleport ect. 

Banned would be multi-power and variable power pool, as I hope each hero would seam unique. Thats a lot tougher when everyone has a multi pool. Megascale would only be offered in a limited form. +3/4...scale would be 1:100. So 30 M teleport =3 km teleport. Enough to escape any intimidate danger, but you cant get to paris on a whim. Summon/Duplicates would be banned or limited...if you have 10 characters, then you have 10 actions each segment.  Multiform with a few limits....You alternate form cannot have more points value then the campaign  max( start 300, and a max of one extra form...like werewolf, or maybe 2...human/wolf/hybred. 


I would want to see fleshed out characters who could survive as characters if they had no powers (IE, at least 18 skill points in non combat stuff, maybe a drivers licence, or a doctors licence ect. 


Secret ID is worth 15 points...but only if you actually have and use your other ID, public ID is worth 10. Assume this is based on NYC, and powers are know, and have been for 5 years...its new, but public. All known powers come from a Drug "V Juice". Every 50 points in powers would get you a rank...So if you have 150 points in powers, then your a rank 3...even if you have a 300 point guy/gal. To much V Juice, and you go crazy. So rake 10 guys...they are scary, and almost certainly have some serious mental health issues. You may have no more then 150 points in powers...but a handgun does not count twords that limit. 


You get 240 points for free, and can take up to 60 more as dis. for a total of 300.


Hunted is blocked to start...If you are hunted, everyone is hunted...but only you get the points. Vigilantism is a thing, and its illegal, but not chased yet. Kill off 30 mobsters and leave the bodies in the street, and they are gonna call in the A Team ( Government sponsored Heros, all rank 5-6, plus training and eq). Beat up a wanted criminal and leave him tied up in front of the police, eh, they will likely look away. 


The pandemic is not happening in this world, though uprisings and protests are happening, the last big ones were 2 years ago. 


This would be a street level story...not saving the world, or changing the government. If you guys are Ok with it, I would include some dark tones. 


Origins would be based on V Juice, werewolf or vampire, skill based or some combo of these. If you have an idea, just float it to me. If it involves something you want keep secret, then PM me. 


There would also be some tone similar to the Boys ( amazon prime) just not at that power level. Total known number of powered people in the world would be under 2,000, most of them at rank 1-2. A full cases ( 200 doses) was stolen and sold off about 2 months ago....thats becoming a problem. 

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I was thinking of a character I had previously built that I would love to play someday which sadly does run afoul of a few of your restrictions. I am working on a (fairly major) tweak to the conception now that should fit, as long as you are ok with a character that has a 'demon' form as opposed to vampire or werewolf. Can she have her superpower be from a source 'other' than V Juice? I suppose she could have been dosed off book for some reason early in her life and her 'powers' manifested as a result. Her conception was originally more mutant in origin.


The new character is about 200 points of highly competent normal working as a passable private investigator. However she has an extra ~100 points in 'only in heroic ID' where she literally turns into a demon succubus, complete with wings. Her max offense in that form is 4d6 killing with fangs and claws. As a human looking PI, she can do 9d6 normal, sufficient to handle standard street thugs. She has some power from her demonic form while not in that guise, most especially a strength of 35 (also has a few martial maneuvers) and half her Demon form's resistant defense.


I'm attaching here the working draft drawn from that inspiration. If there are any issues or things you think could be improved, let me know. The disadvantages are not yet firm and need more inspiration. (Actually 'nothing' is firm yet really.) The original was named Anastasia Romanov in homage to the fact that the character was in turn clearly inspired by Illyana Rasputin. The new version being worked on I am naming Lilith Lefey.


Is there an 'everyman' set of skills or do we buy everything the hard way? If we want a handgun, can we buy that for dollars or does it cost character points? Lilith would not need a gun and certainly would not pay CP for one, but it would make sense for her PI conception to carry one anyway.




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Panpiper, Yes you can have a supernatural origin, I was going to add that in after some time of gameplay, but it serves no point if its your concept. I do have an issue with gliding at 3-400 MPH, its just not possible to fall sideways that fast :) . The point of restricting magascale was to eliminate the option of "I go wherever I want in seconds", so lets tone that down a bit. Your limit on your defenses is not something I agree with ( 1/4x seams to much for the penalty). I'm fine with the listed dis, and your character looks fun. Minor question, how do you transform? You have two shapes, but I don't see anyway to pay for that? How long to transform? Also, which attack gains the +2? 

Some users of V Juice have physical mutations, and many people who see you will assume you developed your appearance as a result of exposure to the juice. Others will of course respond with religious ideas. A PI will fit in nicely. 

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"I do have an issue with gliding at 3-400 MPH"


By linking the two together that way, with flight and gliding, I meant to imply that they were one and the same power that run at the same time. It's not one 'or' the other, it's both concurrently. She is not 'gliding', she is flying, but due to the fact that she has to 'flap' a heavy mass in order to gain altitude, she is less able to do so than someone with just lots of regular flight. She could move forward quickly but gain altitude only slowly. I didn't think the non-combat multiple was too much, that's only twice that of a Peregrine falcon at max speed, and she's much bigger than a falcon, but I have no issues with reducing it. Non-combat flight is pretty much a chrome feature in my experience.


"Your limit on your defenses is not something I agree with ( 1/4x seams to much for the penalty)."


I'm not sure I understand. Are you saying that her 'always' taking at least one body damage from 'any' killing attack, even so much as a kitchen knife or 22 short is not even worth a -1/4 limitation, or are you saying it should be 'more' than a -1/4 limitation?


"You have two shapes, but I don't see anyway to pay for that? How long to transform?"


Again I don't follow, you have to 'pay' to take a limitation? I had always assumed that 'only in hero ID" implied if nothing else, that the 'transformation' took a full phase, done. It works out mechanically to extra time, only to activate. I had envisioned it simply as her human body almost instantly morphing into her demon form. In this case as a special effect, it would burst her clothes as well, virtually instantaneously.


"Also, which attack gains the +2?"


I thought that could apply directly to the Fast Attack maneuver itself, which could itself apply to either the 9d6 normal or the 4d6 KA.


Is there an 'everyman' set of skills or do we buy everything the hard way? If we want a handgun, can we buy that for dollars or does it cost character points? Lilith would not need a gun and certainly would not pay CP for one, but it would make sense for her PI conception to carry one anyway.

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You get eight everyman skills of your choice, all at 8< for free. You also get 4 points of language for free...most have that in english, but its fair to say you have 2/2 English/ whatever if you grew up bilingual.


The +2 to one attack does not cover two attacks. If you pay 3/level, it will cover up to 3 different attacks. 


About the defense, I felt it was not limiting enough to be worth 1/4 the points spent on that defense. I'm not asking you to make it worse, just that I felt it was not restricting enough to be worth 1/4. I get it, she always looks bloody, but never really hurt bad. 


As to the flight, I assumed the low point cost flight was to explain how you could cover great distances...I only have an issue with the total speed. Gliding is just a way to dramatically lower the cost, and skip END...which is fine. I'm just trying to keep total speeds down to lower numbers....If you are in NYC, and you could pop off to Boston in less time then it took to walk 2 city blocks then thats a different story then if you felt more confined by time/effort to travel. Thus the exact reason I targeted megascale. I did not list the other choice as I had not yet considered it. Lets just limit the max to 100 MPH. There is zero reason to ever concider the subway, a cab or a car if you always travel faster then everything else. Quicksilver was a classic speedster, and still maxed out at 150 mph, and nobody thought of him as a "street level" hero. 


As to guns, I insist on Char points being spent on them. You may find ( and use) anything you find in game on the fly, but by the next game session, you ether gotta pay some points, or you tossed it, lost it, it broke, or felt strongly that guns are bad. Maybe you were violent in the past, and are bared from owning a gun. Or you paid the points. ( or get a prop gun, free) 


About "only in hero form", I posted a question to Steve to make sure I am reading the rules right, and I'll update you as soon as I hear back. 

If its not a disadvantage, its not worth any points is a rule I like to live by. For example, if you don't have transformation, or shapechange, how is getting 25% off a bunch of your powers a reason to give you free shapechange? I'm not saying you cant have more then one look, just that it should not be free. I remember some ruling that "Only in hero form" should take a while, or its not really a disadvantage....but since Steve is here I prefer to just ask. 

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"You also get 4 points of language for free...most have that in english, but its fair to say you have 2/2 English/ whatever if you grew up bilingual."


If I want idiomatic fluency in English (necessary or she's going to be a piss poor PI), but with an unrecognizable accent, and I want a mother tongue in a language no other entity in the universe speaks, does it still cost 4 character points? It's pure chrome. 


Do we get an 11- PS for free as well?


"About the defense, I felt it was not limiting enough to be worth 1/4 the points spent on that defense. I'm not asking you to make it worse, just that I felt it was not restricting enough to be worth 1/4. I get it, she always looks bloody, but never really hurt bad."


I played in a five year campaign with a character who had this limitation. He was on many occasions reduced to half body by attacks that would bounce off everyone else's defense.  So for example Lilith is confronted by thugs with hand guns, and gets hit several times. Then later in the day she faces the boss who turns out to be a werewolf with a 4d6 killing attack and she has 4-5 body left. That's not worth a -1/4?


"Lets just limit the max to 100 MPH."


I reduced the non-combat multiple and actually raised the  base gliding a tad and her max out of combat speed is now effectively 100 MPH.


No gun for Lilith. She's not going to pay CP for something she will never use.


""Only in hero form" should take a while, or its not really a disadvantage..."


Yes, it takes a full phase to change. That can be an eternity while bad guys are hitting on you, as not only are they hitting the unturned character, but the whole phase is used up in turning. Given that many Hero System fights are resolved in just a few phases, that is quite the limitation in and of itself. And it's not like she can do her job as a PI while walking around as a seven foot tall, winged, quasi naked demon all the time.


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Hi Opale, I hoping to try Zoom( just like it says in the OP),with 2 cameras on me, one map, and one on my face. To better help convey nuance. Text often leads to misconceptions. I tried roll d20, and found it dropped people speaking when more then 2 spoke. Zoom seams to not have this problem...and i don't want anyone getting stepped on. I am open to other options. 


Panpiper, I'm feeling this is a bit confrontational. But as this is text, I dont want to assume. You asked, and since I was unclear, I just asked Steve...lets give the man a second. 


If "Only in hero" takes 12 seconds to switch, then thats well worth a 1/4. I still don't see that your disadvantage grants you the power to change shape. 


As to the value of any disadvantage in a game, I'm sure that in your last game, your DM made it worth it. Thats a big assumption that I would run my game the same as them. Heck, I could just have a bunch of cops find you, and all shoot you with handguns...Normally zero would get though, but 10 cops each doing 1 body each could easily end you. Or I could have 2 cops with ar 15s and armor piercing bullets show up. The DM can ALWAYS kill you...Thats being a poor DM. You might die in a game I run, but you will never die because I planned it.


You do not get 11 skill for free, but I like seeing it, it proves you can actually earn a living doing something, and will help gameplay when we include your non hero life at some points. Clearly you cant sneak into the mayors office as a demon...much easier to just walk in the front door. 


Your speaking a language no one else speaks does not cost points, I dont change points for things that never come up in play. I have considered returning the points spent on longevity for just that reason...but some storylines might touch on it. This game will have vampires after all.  


I hope we can craft some fun stories together, that means this will not just be my game, but our game. .


One of my real world friends will be joining, hes building a teleporter. Thats all he said so far. 

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I have been working on the campain more and have a couple of minor house rules to add. 


Immunity to all terrestrial diseases , or poisons under life support can be bought with a 1x free disadvantage. I just find it unlikely anyone will spend 10 points on this, or that it would be worth 10 points in gameplay. 

I am hoping for a Wednesday night game maybe 3-4 hours 6-10 EST. but I can try and be flexible based on what ends up being the groups most available time slots. 


To repeat the house rules:

 Max of 12 damage classes, max of 8 speed, 50 strength, OVC/DCV max at 10, Magascale locked at a max of +3/4...or 100:1, 8 free everyman skills, 4 free points in any language, No hunted to start,  No more then 150 points in "powers", a gun does not fall in this, No super tech to start, so handcuffs are find, power draining cuffs are not. Hopefully you will make a character capable of working with a group, I am looking for street heroes/vigilantes, to work in a city style campaign. Maxim total movement by any means, 150 mph. If other things come up, I will post them. If you have an idea, put it out there. 


Shadow, I have zero problems with someone new, this is just for fun, and the rest of us can help. 

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Zarthose and I have worked things out with my Lilith/Hellbane character. We have a couple other players confirmed, but would still like to add one or two more.  @Opale, @Shadow7 are you still interested? We'd be playing Wednesday evenings Eastern Standard Time.


All the help you could want is available for helping to create characters if you want.

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  • 1 month later...
On 6/13/2020 at 7:15 PM, Zarthose said:

Damage classes would be a hard max of 12...


Does that include damage added from martial maneuvers? Someone with a strength of 50 who used a martial offensive strike would hit for 14d6, for example.


I ask because I want to work on bumping Lilith's strength to 50 from its current 45.  Right now she punches using the martial fast strike for 11d6. With a 50 strength, she'll do 12d6. The problem is with a 50 strength, with her claws she would wind up doing 4d6+1, which is technically 13 damage classes.


I do not have sufficient XP at the moment to make the full jump. What I am doing in the interim is adding a +1d6 Hand to Hand attack boost inside her OIAID which I can afford right now for 3 points (which would boost her non killing punch damage to 12d6). With two more points later, I will sell that back and just add 5 strength to Lilith outside of her OIAID.


SCREECH!!!  Never mind. I just discovered Hero Designer will let me buy a Killing Attack for my claws but with ZERO damage classes added, and it reduces the cost to 1 point only, basically allowing me to do 12DC of either normal or killing. I am going to go that route, which will allow me to bump the strength to 50 immediately without the interim +1d6 hand to hand boost.

Lilith Lefey's Dark Champions Character Sheet.pdf

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23 minutes ago, Maccabe said:

Is there still room in this game?


Pretty sure that would be a yes, though of course final word is Zarthose's.  Go ahead and get started on character ideas, so you can accelerate the process of getting you in.


We are playing using webcam on Zoom, Wednesdays from 6PM to ~10-11PM EST.

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  • 1 month later...

While I am able to Zoom pretty well anytime today up until 7:30 EST tonight to discuss and work over things as needed, (Night shift tonight) Wednesday I have open and available during the whole day and night as need be.

I presume the restrictions listed above are still accurate? (8 Everyman Skills, 4 pt for Language, DC 12 Max, 8 Speed Max, OCV/DCV up to 10, Strength up to 50, ect)?


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Yes, however game has progressed to 320 points, I need to decide if I'm just gonna match you to the team. You can pick and chose your everyman skills. 

Doc.  Highlander style immortal who also can heal people 

Lilith.  Human-demon hybrid with a 50 strength and wings, private investor

Grail. EMT with strong teleportation powers and can smell evil

Current players

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