Surgo

Kickstarter: someone mentioned in another thread that starship combat rules were punted from Star Hero to the never-complete 6e Vehicles book. I'd be willing to back such a book.

This is the idea, to avoid the aforementioned bookkeeping nightmares: (Total: 30 Active Cost, 13 Real Cost) +20 PRE (20 Active Points); Only When Enemy Attempts To Move Through Threatened Melee Area (-1), Only For Presence Attacks (-1/2) (Real Cost: 8) <b>plus</b> +1 SPD (10 Active Points); Linked (PRE; -1/2), Only for Attacks Against Intimidated Target (-1/2) (Real Cost: 5) In English: You succeed on your PRE attack, you can immediately use the extra SPD for an attack (up to once per turn, since it's one SPD). The concept: avoid messing around with the SPD chart at all, tie any extra actions to success on the presence attack.

The point of the SPD was to be able to use it as part of the "you get to act before this person" result -- the SPD would only be for taking that action.

That's viable and it might be worth buying 1 or 2 SPD limited with "only with presence attacks" or something so you can trigger the "act before X" result of the presence attack, if such a thing is possible (not sure what the build would look like or not). Similarly, the PRE could be bought limited for "only for threatened area" or something. Dude, don't go there. Trigger is as much a part of the Hero System as Presence Attacks are.

If the game mechanics ever encourage it in a situation, it really is a game mechanical problem that has been brought out by the situation. To say they aren't behaving like action heroes is really besides the point; if we already have a way for the combat to go in mind, there's no reason to have rules at all. And you really won't convince me otherwise on this point. I'm from a school that wants game mechanics to reflect as much as possible the desired outcome.

Thanks -- this is a better way to do it I think. Cheaper, a lot less clunky and not so many side effects like Power Defense. The problem to be solved here is how to stop people from walking around you without turning your combat into a tedious Mexican standoff between two people who each want to avoid taking action. By the rules of the game you can just...do that, and not even care. So to have some characters who you can't just straight up threaten an area and still move the game forward is alright.

I don't know why everyone has assumed it's not going to be purchased with character points :-( Yeah, I misdid the radius -- it should be 2m, not 4m. A triggered attack is another way to handle it. D&D turns are 6 seconds. Also, I'm not sure why this really matters. Held actions exist in D&D too; they're called "readied actions".

I went towards the power route specifically because I didn't want just anyone to have it -- specifically, it's there for really good fencers :-) Sure, and there's also tons of other stuff you can't be threatened by anymore...the 15 points of unrestricted power defense is the problem here.

That's a fine point but it's not clear how to put it into practice when it comes to avoiding fencer A, who successfully backed fencer B into a corner, from having fencer B just walk around them on their action. At least without turning the whole thing into some bizarre Mexican standoff of each party holding their action until the other party finally does something. The goal is to at least make them pay for their tactical movement.

I've seen a number of discussions in the past about zones of control, or in D&D parlance attacks of opportunity. They have generally boiled down to either: 1) using naked trigger advantages on attacks 2) limited SPD for making attacks on people who cross your zone 3) not doing it at all and holding actions I wondered if there was a better way to slot this concept into the HERO system than one of the above. I'm thinking directly of fencing duels, where having one party just walk around or run past the other party to be pretty lame: the idea being that the attacker can keep the defender locked into a position. So I thought about: instead of granting extra attacks (which results in clunky builds and large point costs), why not just make it really disadvantageous for the moving party to actually do the movement? So I came up with something like this: Zone of Control: Drain DCV 2d6, Area Of Effect Accurate (4m Radius; +1/2), Trigger (Activating the Trigger is an Action that takes no time, Trigger requires a Zero Phase Action to reset, Character does not control activation of personal Trigger; Opponent moves towards user through radius; +1/2) (40 Active Points); DCV Reduction Only Works For Attacker (-1), No Range (-1/2), Instant (only last's through attacker's next phase; -1/2). Total cost: 13 points. (Drain limitations and their values are based on those from the Feint power in HSMA.). So you won't get an automatic bonus attack like in D&D but your next attack, should you choose to take it, will stand a much greater chance of hitting. Thoughts on this idea? I considered doing it with a Change Environment radius but it wasn't quite clear to me how to make that mechanic work. This I think should do it. Trigger is a fairly catch-all mechanic.

I imagine this is going to seem like blasphemy to many of you. I was working on my Shadowrun rules adaptation and had some difficulty coming up with a way that players could quickly adapt content from books into HERO. Some concepts just didn't translate well. So to move this along, I decided to turn how HERO combat and skill rolls work from 3d6 roll-under into dicepools. As a reminder, in a dicepool like Shadowrun you roll a number of d6's equal to the size of your pool and every 5 or 6 counts as a "hit". Furthermore, you can "buy" a hit by spending 4 dice from your pool. The basics: Your dicepool size is equal to your CHAR/5, plus any skill bonuses. A basic test requires one hit. The probability: Basic skill rolls in HERO are 3d6 roll under your (CHAR/5) + any skill bonuses. At the most basic level (Characteristic of 10, skill purchased) this gives you a 50% chance of making the roll. Under a dicepool of two dice, you have a 55.5% chance of getting your one hit. Not identical, but close. What about when we have bonuses? Let's say we've bought up +4 to the roll (or 4 dice in a dicepool system). We have a 90% chance of success with the standard HERO method. With the dice pool system you can just buy a hit, so you succeed 100% of the time. What about harder checks? Let's say the check is for something hard so you take a -4 on the roll. We're back to 50% chance under the hero system. A -4 in dicepool land means removing 4 dice from the pool, so once again we're back where we started. Honestly, this isn't all that interesting. The probability curve is a little skewed but...it looks similar enough if you squint at it. So why bother? Aside from making it easier to adapt Shadowrun content, I didn't like how opposed tests were working out. Also you get more variance at higher levels of dice. My Shadowrun rules adaptation involve a lot of opposed tests. I've even extended something like the combat-as-skills rules from APG2, so combat represents opposed rolls instead of a roll against a DCV. A lot of powers have a custom advantage that succeeding on a skill roll by a certain amount gives them +5 extra character points in the power. I didn't want +1 to skill rolls to represent a raw +5 points to the power, that's a bit excessive and at high enough skill values you're just going to shift how many extra points you get by the results of that 3d6 roll. The use of dicepools means that an extra die only "counts" for 5/3 extra points in a power on average; the extra points are thus compressed down compared to vanilla HERO rolls by a factor of 3. There's still plenty of room for randomness though (and you get more variance in results with more dice, which I want). Both tests and opposed tests aren't any easier or harder (in a rough sense) by using dicepools instead of vanilla HERO rolls, but you get less impact on your powers from that extra +1. Okay, but who cares? You could just divide how much you beat the roll with by 3 and have something that looks roughly the same. Well, like I said above, using dicepools makes it easier to lift content straight out of the SR4 books. Also I think my players will just find it easier to count. I'm finishing up a long D&D campaign with them and while I have multiple engineers as players, it's at the end of a long work day and nobody's really good at math at that point. Counting hits is easy, handling opposed tests is trivial, and there's no weird addition or subtraction involved. Ultimately the only reason to do this is if you're a filthy blasphemer like me and like dice polls or rolling piles of d6s. Personally I love rolling piles of d6s. It's great fun. Or you want some more variance in your results. Aside: Test Difficulty In general, circumstances should add or remove from the dicepool instead of modifying the number of hits required. Some tasks are going to take more than one hit though. Shadowrun 4th edition recommends the following thresholds: Easy: 1 hit Average: 2 hits Hard: 3 hits Extreme: 4 hits I'd stick with that. Aside: Buying Skills Familiarity is gone. Purchasing the skill gets you the characteristic roll for it (no rolling it without the purchase). After that it's a standard +1 for however many character points the book says.

It's not the cleanest write-up yet, but here's the basics. Numbers and specific rules subject to change. Some things taken from Ends of the Matrix. Hacking powers: Hacking powers are called “programs”. They include all the “Mental” powers. They attack with OMCV, defend with DMCV and are soaked with Firewall (F), a form of Power Defense. Thus they must have the appropriate ACV and AVAD advantages (but unlike normal AVAD, they will still do BODY damage). Furthermore, they are only visible to the Matrix sight group; they must take the Invisible Power Effects advantage where necessary. All characters on a network get a Firewall of 2 for free; this represents the basic components of their personal network that defend the brain. See the “type” and “range” rules from Ends of the Matrix. The “Handshake” range replaces the normal power range for all hacking powers (a -0 limitation/advantage). If both the target and the actor have an open connection to a third party's node they are within Handshake range of each other regardless of distance in the real world. Most secure installations intentionally have low signals or use high-density blocking paint, which forces the hacker to be physically present as part of the team. Your signal range is based on your commlink; see the range table below. Connection range is considered a -1/4 limitation for powers. Furthermore, non-human-piloted software (like IC) can only act via Connection range and cannot open connections on its own. When a connection is established, any non-LOS program can be run over the connection. Effectively, every non-LOS program has an implicit range of Connection. Most programs take a full-phase action, though some take half-phase actions. Your matrix actions are limited to a SPD of 2 without being in at least cold VR (see “VR Module” below). Basic item: the commlink. It’s a computer in your head. Represented by a talent. Signal and number of simultaneous programs can be bought up for more character points. A basic commlink costs 5 points and gives you some everyman powers: Allows you to search and access the matrix. Allows you to communicate to anyone else on the matrix who is willing to accept communication (acts as Mind Link power). Allows you to see the matrix in AR (“arrows”). Sense AR, one per sense group. For equipment and powers that use arrows, characters must define which sense the arrows go to. Commlinks, and all computer installations, have a “signal” attribute. This represents the range it can reach with its powers. By default this starts at step 0. Every step up the table costs 5 character points. Signal / Range - Examples: -1 / 20 cm – Nanoware Tranceivers 0 / 3m – Metahuman Brain, RFID Tags 1 / 40m – Handheld Electronics 2 / 100m – Microdrones 3 / 400m – Average Commlinks 4 / 1km – Commercial Drones 5 / 4km – 6 / 10km – Cell Towers 7 / 40km 8 / 100km – Low Orbit Satellite Links 9 / 400km 10 / 1000km 11 / 4000km Earth Orbiting Satellites 12 / 10,000km 13* / 40,000km Hackers are particularly interested in concurrent programs. You can only use one program at a time; this limit can be increased by 1 for every 5 character points you spend. Hacking Skills: Computer, Datasearch, Electronic Warfare, Hacking. All INT based. See Ends of the Matrix for details. We don’t use Cybercombat (that’s OMCV/DMCV). It’s a lot like Magecraft, but there are only those 4 skills. You buy the programs as talents, real cost / 10. Hacking in AR: While you can hack in AR, it’s not ideal. Classically, AR is handled in the same manner as the classic “Head's Up Display” of the late twentieth century, but it technically Arrows can be handled with literally any type of sensory input. Some hackers have been known to pipe their matrix information through touch links as a web of tappings on their body or through audio playback as elaborate music in order to continue seeing the world unimpeded. This is still distracting, but at least you no longer have blind spots. Choose at character creation time which sense group you want to use for your arrows. Standard sense group rules apply, so non-sight senses aren’t targeting unless you buy it. When taking hacking actions in AR, you are at ½ OCV, ½ OMCV and limited to a SPD of 2. Hacking in VR: The next stage in perceiving the matrix is to replace all sense data from the real world with matrix Arrows. At its crudest implementation, this literally just means that Arrows are so densely packed across one's perceptions that the input from the world around cannot be seen at all. At its ideal, it represents a whole virtual world crafted for the user in which all Arrows are incorporated and contextualized. On the downside, you can’t move your real body and are virtually helpless in the real world. On the upside everything is so much faster. To do this, you need a sim module. They come in varieties from SPD +0 to SPD +3. Sim Module: (Total: 30 Active Cost, 13 Real Cost) +3 SPD (30 Active Points); Only in the Matrix (-1/2), Meat Body (Your body is paralyzed, and your normal sense are overwritten with the matrix; -1/2), IIF (Commlink; -1/4) (Real Cost: 13) Other Hacking Gear: Why not record your senses for playback later? Make a VR movie. Open your own X-rated VR movie studio. Hell, you could even have a little television window while you’re hopping around in VR so you could see out of your meatspace eyes while you’re doing your thing. Full Sum Rig: (Total: 11 Active Cost, 9 Real Cost) Eidetic Memory (5 Active Points); IIF (Commlink; -1/4) (Real Cost: 4) plus Transmit for standard senses (6 Active Points); IIF (Commlink; -1/4) (Real Cost: 5) Normally your commlink limits the frequency and amplitude of signals sent to your brain to within normal human parameters. This is a very important safety feature to prevent peoples’ brains from being fried. But sometimes you just want that extra speed and intensity that getting rid of this feature gives you. Running Hot: +1 SPD (10 Active Points); Only for Matrix Actions (-1/2), Side Effects, Side Effect occurs automatically whenever Power is used (-3 resistant Firewall; -1/2), Extra Time (half-phase to activate, -1/4) Running Hot: +1 SPD (10 Active Points, 4 Real Cost); Only for Matrix Actions (-1/2), Side Effects, Side Effect occurs automatically whenever Power is used (-3 resistant Firewall; -1/2) Programs: Black Hammer (LOS): Killing Attack - Ranged 1d6, Attack Versus Alternate Defense (Firewall; +0), Alternate Combat Value (uses OMCV against DMCV; +1/4), Invisible Power Effects (Invisible to non-Matrix senses; +1/2); Line of Sight Range (-1/2) (26 Active Points)

Thanks for the responses, all. I plan to post my ruleset (for this aspect, anyway) in this thread later tonight when it is complete. Definitely do not want to go this route. Not only is the hacker meant to be a unique role in the team, they are explicitly able to affect the real world including human brains with their hacking. So they should ideally be spending as many points on that as the street sam. Yeah, in Shadowrun the astral and the matrix are pretty much the same thing (or at least, in the best matrix rules they were). I don't think I want to go with Duplication because every brain and machine needs to simultaneously exist in both realms already, with no additional fanfare. The projection variant is interesting but maybe a bit too complicated to combine with what I'm going for with signal ranges. Neat ideas though, thanks! This seems good. The special effects of the power range is exactly what I'm looking for. And yeah I'm going for SR4 -- I want futurism rather than retro-futurism :-) Specifically I'll be adapting the rules from Ends of the Matrix: http://tgdmb.com/viewtopic.php?t=48836 Hacking itself will be done sort of like the Magecraft system from Killer-Shrike (http://killershrike.com/FantasyHERO/HighFantasyHERO/MagicSystems/magecraftSystem.aspx); the skill rolls are important to give it a "skill" flavor, I think. All devices have a signal range, and your hacking powers are mostly limited to your opponent being in signal range of you and vice versa. Since many installations you want to hack have intentionally low signal ranges, this forces the hacker to stay physically with the rest of the team when they want to use their cool powers. I think this has been a big issue with hacking systems in other games; you split the team up so as a result the hacking aspect of the game is left as mostly a sideshow. Not what I want in cyberpunk! I'll post my more complete write-up tonight, now that you all have helped me figure out how to do it.

I'm happy to have it be "just" a special effect, but I need to come up with an elegant way of saying "side effect: all your senses are overwritten by cyberspace sense; can instantaneously move to and view anything in signal range".

I'm putting together a vaguely Shadowrun-inspired ruleset for my next game, to be run when my current D&D session ends. Hacking is a key part of cyberpunk but it's important to make sure that the hacker has a reason to physically be with the team, not doing it from a protected outpost somewhere. In classic cyberpunk fashion, cyberspace is an actual place you can experience via VR. But you can also just be in the normal world and partially experience it via AR (you get "arrows" over your senses, usually sight). You get up to +3 SPD for being in VR, and while you're in AR you attack at 1/2 OMCV anywhere outside of your actual line of sight, as opposed to your normal "signal" range. But you can totally walk around hacking in AR despite that if that's your thing. The downside of VR being, of course, that you're an inert body in meatspace. The important things that need be modeled are: every brain and every device exists in both meatspace and cyberspace, but to properly attack and perform other hacking tasks in cyberspace you need to be able to see into it (or use another sense, if you're doing it only in AR, that's pretty flavorful and cool). You get AR and the sense to see arrows for just having a computer in your head. So my questions are: - How do I model getting the senses to see AR, for any of your sight groups? Preferably at minimal real cost, so anyone who wants one can have a computer in their head. Plus the 1/2 OMCV for hacking beyond your LOS. - How do I model VR? I don't like extra-dimensional movement because it seems overly pricey for what is essentially a flavor concern, and I don't want to have to add Transdimensional to everything. But it is ultimately a separate dimension in the sense that it completely overwrites all of your standard senses. It's just that that's more of a drawback than a penalty (in a metagame sense, anyway), so paying the points for XDM seems counterintuitive.