Vanderbilt_Grad

I’ve had two another idea as well. Hex Bolt EB (10d6) Trigger (+1/2), Variable SFX (+1/2) [Variable SFX Must Match Follow-up Attack By Teammate (-1)], Dice in EB limited to number of dice rolled by Teammate’s attack (-1/4). 100 active points. 70 real. With this setup Hex girl fires her power off … and nothing seems to happen to the target. However when one of her teammates attacks a separate, matching, EB up to 10d6 goes off. You could add Variable Advantage to this setup too if you need too to match AP blasts or some such by teammates. This attack could also make this a continuous uncontrolled power if you want it to last through several blasts from her teammates. The downside to this setup is that it is less effective against high defense targets since her Hex and her teammates blasts will be applied separately. The advantage is that it’s an instant power & is much simpler than the Drain bookkeeping wise. … And Insaniac99 if that works for your group more power to all of you ... but personally I hate playing under GMs who operate like that. This is my personal bias but IMO the HERO system is capable of doing just about anything. Already in this thread alone we have had 4 different build suggestions. As a player it always ticks me off when the PCs have to play by the rules but GM NPCs don't. If they can hand wave why can't my PC? Also when I GM writing up powers give me as a much better idea of how balanced a particular idea is ahead of time. It can make the difference between running a memorable fight and one that is a stompfest either for or against the heroes.

Only if the life support had some kind of limitation itself could I see Healing being linked to it. Otherwise the the linked limitation would not really limit the healing power in any way. A limitation that doesn't limit the character is not worth any point.

IMO an easier way to do this would be with a limited version of Supress or Drain targed against defensive powers. The net effect of having a vulnerability is that the target takes more damage vs incoming attacks. Drain vs All Defensive Powers (2d6) Expanded Effect (+2), Powers only considered drained vs. Single SFX of Attack (-1) 60 active & 30 real.

VG Anyway I disagree here. Champsguy's point about mobility and bringing force to bear is an excellent point. In addition to that Military forces generally don't have police powers in the US and in fact are prohibited from even aiding police / local law enforcement in most circumstances. That alone would prevent them from filling the role that heroes fill the majority of the time. In my mind Super Team, PRIMUS, UNTIL, & the military each have their niches. Each one has a separate role that they concentrate on and different strengths & weaknesses. There are areas of overlap & thus potential conflict but overall their missions and purposes for being are very different. Just because one group has the theoretical *capacity* to do something doesn’t mean that they really can, will, or should. So what if the military can take out supers or if supers can take out tanks? Doesn’t really matter from my perspective. You can easily run a game where Super Heroes respond to the threats posed by Super Villains most of the time and threat posed by groups like Viper and Demon some of the time. Until & Primus focus on the groups most of the time and Super Villains some of the time. The Military can be the ‘big hammer.’ When all else fails they get the job and at this point they would be sending in the best that they could muster. Really though what armies are designed for is not peacekeeping or law enforcement … but to fight wars. And in the CU it’s pretty inevitable that superbeings will be involved in a war at some point. The military would have to be prepared for that … and to me it looks like they are according to what is in the CU. If Grond is in a war zone then they have to deal … and thus the question of whether the worldbeaters can hang with the military and vice versa is a reasonable one to ask … and doesn’t necessarily imply that the military will be taking over the ‘Super Team’ turf.

I'm simply going on what I read in CU and in one or two cases making logical conclusions. None of the things I suggested are big leaps. In all cases where I mentioned advaned tech, super-soldier programs, and the like I did state that their numbers would be small. If anything I think that you are underestimating the effects that these small changes could make.

The CU military has several important differences from our real world military. 1. They have experience with fighting superbeings starting with WW II & have had time to develop strategies and tactics specifically designed for dealing with them. Note that 100+ speed 2 soldiers are not all going to go on phases 6 & 12. Many will hold actions & stagger their fire. You can expect attacks from *someone* on just about every phase. They will also co-ordinate fire. 2. They have a super-soldier programs. They may not have tons of them but imagine special forces with near-superhuman and maybe slightly above superhuman stats. 3. They have power armor squads. Again they may not have many & the armor will probably not be as good as the heroes get but they have them & know how to use them both deployed individually in squads & supporting other troops. 4. They have a small amount of advanced tech. This isn’t ever really well defined but even a few things like ‘mind link’ based radios that can’t be jammed by ‘radio darkness’ could make a huge difference. They probably even have a few units with energy based weapons. A few ‘x-ray vision scanners,’ ‘stun guns,’ and non-lethal area attacks might even things out in the urban areas a bit. Their tanks might allow better perception too. 5. The CU military also has a small number of it’s own super being soldiers. Adding supers of their own to the mix changes things quite a bit. 6. The military probably has access to UNTIL and PRIMUS information on super beings and will generally know *exactly* what they are going against. On top of all this many super beings will have no military training and no actual combat experience with fighting military units … i.e. they will be unfamiliar with their foes full capability and not necessarily know appropriate counter-tactics or the correct opening tactics. While I agree that in urban environments the military will be at a disadvantage the heroes will not have quite as much of an edge as one might assume. However as I stated above the military does have a huge edge against most supers at night and their killing attacks (with Hero rules) statistically take out most heroes with low resistant defenses fairly quickly.

The basic question, Worldbeaters vs Military, is interesting but I don’t think that you can ignore the context of a given battle in asking it. Does the battle occur in the open? In a city? In a military base? Location will make *huge* difference in what kind of force the military can and will bring to bear and in what tactics they will use. Is one side surprised or is this a confrontation where both sides have plenty of warning? Is this a daytime or nighttime fight? Many heroes lack Nightvision and the sensory capability of the military in general. At first I thought that you were asking about the worldbeaters as in the guys from the Worldbeaters... er, Worldbeaterbeaters thread. As far as those specific guys I see things working out like this…. The vast majority of the militaries attacks will be killing attacks of various sorts, NND gas attacks, and only the occasional EB. Many will be Explosion or AP attacks. KA are super dangerous as mentioned because of the lucky stun roll effects. Given the number of attackers the odds *will* catch up with heroes who have defenses that are too low. Against the Worldbeaters gas attacks are not likely to do very much good given the prevalence of Life Support. Rifle rounds are also going to be pretty ineffective against this crew. The heavy vehicles and weapons are going to be what will decided this fight … and in a major city that could be a problem for the military. Assault (as currently written) and Prometheus as written are in pretty good shape. Both have hardened resistant defenses of 40. That will make them all but immune to many of the military’s attacks. Assault will probably have to have some of his gadget pool allotted to some sort of flight pack or other movement gear to keep up with the tanks & helicopters but that’s doable. His pool also could be *very* useful for jamming, listening to communications, and the like. Prometheus is a bit slow relatively speaking both in terms of speed and movement but at 22†of running and 20†of leaping might be OK. His 100 str will be tough on tanks. This brick’s thermo and telescopic sight have the potential to be huge especially in a nighttime fight. Professor Polaris has force walls that will be extremely effective if used properly. His personal defenses aren’t quite up to the level of Prometheus and Assault but he can take a few heavy hits if it comes to that. His spatial awareness and TK are pretty strategic assets as well in this kind of fight. Hyperman has the potential to fly with the jets or be effective vs Tanks like mentioned above but his biggest weaknesses will be lack of appropriate ranged senses (no mega senses or telescopic sight are a problem). His resistant defenses are also a bit low for this kind of battle. The 17 DCV will help but all it’s going to take is one lucky hit from a jet or LAW to take him down. Quick forays in and out of protection provided by Prof Polaris might be the way to go. Golden Hunter is invisible to sight but radar is going to be a huge problem for him. If Assault isn’t jamming then he could be toast quick. His resistant defenses are also low for this kind of combat. On the plus side he has a nice no range modifier attack & UV vision … but without telescopic senses to back them up their use is not as great as they could be. Silly Putty is going to be of *very* limited use in this fight. His major defense is Damage Reduction but odds are that a squad of ground pounders with assault rifles is going to be enough to blast him apart for good. His major role in this fight is going to be to seek cover & hide. If he is lucky he might be able to sneak around a bit and do some damage to the command structure. Typhoon can do some nice offensive whop-**s but defensively can be taken out easily by the military. Only by working with Prof Polaris will this PC be able to positively affect the outcome of this battle. Kunduna (as currently written) … I’m not really sure how she would do. At first I thought that her mind scan + ego blast could do some interesting things against the opposing command structure but then I realized that she could only do one or the other at one time the way her MP is built. Physically she is limited too in that she can either be tough [Force Field 30, 30] or use her attacks [EB & Ego Attack] but she can’t do both at once. Her Damage Reduction is large … but doesn’t work against killing attacks. So in the end she is like Typhoon. Hiding behind Prof Polaris’ force walls she can pick off soldiers and *maybe* the odd vehicle with her attacks but she isn’t going to contribute as much to this battle as you might think. The more I look at her the more I think she could benefit from a major re-write beyond what has already been suggested in that thread. Overall I think that the Worldbeaters, using proper tactics, could beat a small or maybe even a medium sized force … but are toast against a large one or even a small one if they don’t fight smart.

Skads. It's been so long that I can't really remember. It was 1986 and I seem to recall that he was an energy projector but beyond that I can't really say. Most memorable was Temper a flying guy with a Variable Special Effect energy sword. He was pretty boring in combat -a true one tactic wonder- but I had fun with his personality.

I have no idea what his recent comic book appearance was like but in the original spidey back in the 80’s he was introduced as a minion of the Kingpin. I’m pretty sure that he was a one shot villain back then. In the animated series he showed up as a scientist working on a dimensional portal generator. He was fired from his job & the Kingpin picked him up. His first successful test of the device sucked him in … and for some reason a bunch of the portal ‘spots’ stuck to his body and he gained the ability to control them. He could even open up portals without the original tech. In the series he was a quite successful thief but then got blackmailed by the Kingpin into fighting Spider Man. He and the web-crawler faced each other 3 times & Spot did well each time. Teleportation, Stretching, Missile Reflection, DCV levels, & likely Damage Reduction or FF are among his apparent powers in Champions terms.

I actually agree that concept is the most important thing … but the actual build comes pretty darn close. I’ve seen one ruin the other before and vice versa. It is a beautiful thing when both come together. On #3 … that works for me. Interesting actually. Maybe it should even be a flat -1/2 costs END power. On #2 in this version I see only one thing that would make me consider OIHID a limitation for this PC … the END Reserve. It will be empty when she first transforms & so if she is caught with her pants down in normal ID so to speak she will be in for a world of hurt even if she manages to transform. #1 fantastic! … Though it looks to me like REC and Mind Link might still be there…. Now it’s time for me to apologize. I didn’t have time to really word the ending of my last email right. I didn’t mean to imply that my word should be law here or anywhere else. Sorrry. Positive. But I will note that, were I the GM of this PC, and I’m not, I’m positive that I wouldn’t allow the visible (-1/4) disadvantage on the stats outside the EC. K already glows in hero ID due to the force field. This limitation would be redundant with the OIHID IMO. My 2 cents. Moving your Dimensional Rifts power into the MP might save you a few points too. Since EDM is a full phase action anyway it seems unlikely that K would use this along with the powers from the MP.

Shelly hit the nail on the head IMO. Start small & work your way up. Gives you a lot more maneuvering room to plot and it gives the players a while to get used to their characters. By the time you have the big opponents come into the game the heroes will feel established. A good tactic is to establish your foes too. Start small with them. Several smaller seemingly unrelated subplots might be later showen to be connected in some way. You can establish your big threats in small ways early on without having all out battles.

I really like most of the character concepts presented in this thread. However Kunduna, although cool, has some mechanics that make me wince big time. 1. I don’t like all the characteristics being bought in an EC. Would never allow this were I GM. Ditto for the Mind Link. 2. Don’t really find her OIHID limiting. Since there is no real limit on how she transforms, how long she can stay transformed, or any provisions for the GM to end her transformation I would nix the OIHID unless one of the above was a true limit. The character might need to make a Meditation skill roll to enter hero id … or an accidental change back to non-hero ID could be added to list of disadvantages … or a dependency disadvantage could be added where after a period of time (an hour a day whatever) in hero form the character started getting weaker and had to transform. I would require *something* like one or more of these in order for the player to receive the OIHID cost savings. ‘Meditative State’ just doesn’t seem limiting enough by itself to me. 3. Costs End to Activate on the Damage Resistance in the EC seems questionable at best to me. First off I assume that the DR would *always* be active in Hero ID since at 75% on top of other defenses the character is unlikely to *ever* be stunned. Technically this is doable but I don’t like it and might not allow it were I GM. The biggest problem I have with Kunduna is that in spite of the huge number of starting points she seems to be just chock full of points savings ‘tricks.’ Conceptually I don’t like that. If I give you a ton of points I want you to use limitations to fit concept not save points. It’s a shame too since the concept is so interesting.

Upon further thinking I’m not 100% sure that Cyclops can do most of his special ‘tricks’ without his visor. Without it he basically has an unfocused EB. The visor is what lets him do things like focusing the beam. One way to do this would be with a limited advantage. Buy the basic beam with Variable Advantage +3/4 or better only with OAF visor. For example: - 50 Eye Beams EB (12d6) Personal Immunity (+1/4), Variable Disadvantage -1 (-1/2) [OAF Visor, OAF Glasses, or No Conscious Control] - 45 Visor Tricks Naked Advantage: Variable Advantage +3/4 on EB (+1 & 1/2) OAF: Visor (-1) - 10 Visor Focusing Skill Levels with EB (+4) OAF: Visor (-1) The downside to this is that you loose the RKA and Missile Defection (if you want it). The upside is that the beam can have a *lot* of different settings like these for instance: - x2 KB - 1/2 End & Area Hex - 1/2 End & Armor Piercing (this might be a good substitute for his ‘focused’ blast - 1/2 End & Line of Sight Etc. And BTW I agree that the visor is an OAF in the comics. Silly but true. You would think that he would at least put something on there that would make it harder to pull off … or even wear a helmet or something that would be really hard to get off. The alternative would be to build a MP and slap a Variable Disadvantage on the whole thing as discussed above.

I agree 100% about the MP. While some of the effects he's done could be simulated by spreading & whatnot it wouldn't hurt to add an Area Cone EB and an AP EB in there too.

Just like Hero and Champions WW developed a game world with Aberrant, Adventure, and Trinity … however unlike most game worlds that only get updated when a new edition comes out and xx years have passed changing x, y, and z (or changing everything aka. sorry Solitaire you are out) … WW published updates to their base world regularly *without* new game editions. Sure if you changed things in your game that might invalidate something published later, but most games I’ve seen folks go ‘so what.’ Champions gives you the ground world at Date YY and you get to decide what happens there. Supplements may give more info on groups and individuals … but they don’t really change anything and time doesn’t really pass. Once written in a book things are pretty much set in stone. Aberrant assumes that, just like in our world, time passes and things change. When a supplement comes out a year after the core book you can generally bet that around a year has passed in the game world and that some things have changed. When publishing living updates like that they *have* to have some sort of baseline and have the ability to build on what was published before. However in the end it really isn’t any different than the Champions model in that you can change *anything* you want in a game world with either sort of publishing model. Sure if you change something big then a later book may not really make sense in your game but I’ve met few folks that really care about that sort of issue. Most gamers expect the GM to alter the world both in Champs and Aberrant … or any game for that matter. Just because a ‘published book’ says that Divis did this or Defender did that it doesn’t mean that it is so in a given GMs game. I will say that I’m not a big WoD fan, but that’s part of what really like about Aberrant. It’s not in the World of Darkness. Some of the issues you may have had with the WoD are simply not there in the Trinity universe. Here is a pertinent quotes from the core Aberrant book (just substitute “official timeline†for “Trinity timeframe†… and note the quotes around “official†below the Aberrant developers put them there not me….) : To close Aberrant *really* is different from the World of Darkness. It is well worth a look.

Sure you could. "But some of the NPCs are powerful...." Just like 350 point champions nothing forced PCs to start at the base level or stay there. Many games had PCs as powerful or moreso than the NPCs. "But the storyline had *this* happening...." And in the main Aberrant book and the APG GM/Storytellers were flat out encouraged to changes things to suit their own games. Divis Mal was pretty much the only plot device NPC though Pax came pretty close. Of course in the section devoted to customizing your own game there were suggestions for how to replace Pax with a PC.... If, in your game, the NPCs and storylines were untouchable then it was the fault of the person running the game, not the system or world itself. Generally the *only* place where cannon rules all is on the net based forums where you have to have some sort of common reference frame since there is no GM.

Be prepared for characters that are way over 350 points in some cases. I've generally found it difficult to translate my Aberrant characters over. It's not that Hero can't handle it ... it's just that the points really add up fast. Things like Warp, Weather Control, Magnetism, etc. are point monsters even at the Aberrant one dot level. Temporal Manipulation and Gravity Control don't translate over well at all. IMO you also tend to get vastly different types of gamers going for Champions vs. Aberrant. I'll also note that the link posted above is purely WoD not Aberrant and the conversions are to Hero 4th edtion not 5th ... but even so it might be a reasonable place to start.

Does it kill the old body when he leaves? If not or if the old body is revived does the old body keep the power? If the new body is transformed but your guy doesn't take over does it get to keep the power too? Does each body have the stame stats or do you say, keep the physical stats of the body you occupy? An easy way to do this mechanically would be via multiform. Or you could simply do both steps in a single large transform of the target with a lethal side effect. I would avoid mind control for this effect as it would have to be huge to work.

Once had a player who’s primary power was the ability to create a friction reducing field around his body. First game session the college age heroes heard about a brick trashing a bar and headed out to put a stop to that ASAP … hey don’t waste the beer! Anyway his other two teammates arrived on the scene first while he held on to the rear bumper of a car to gain speed so he could get to the fight. Finally he gets there. The car is passing the bar and he pushes off, zips thru the front door, and plows right into the brick … at over 40 mph. Dice are rolled. Stun and body are high … things are looking good … but then the KB roll … a natural 12! No KB done! Ouch! Frictionless boy bounces off the brick and is out cold … but he had done just enough stun and the brick slowly sank to his knees and collapsed on the floor himself! The players all cheered, as their early attacks hadn’t been doing very much vs. the enraged brick.

So far of all these I like v4 and levi's the best. V8 just doesn't do it for me. Something about the coat ... and just too much white.

An easier to deal with version of this power might look like this: Dex (+30) Full Phase Activation (-1/2), One Recoverable Charge (+/- depends), No Figured Characteristics (-1/2) Full Phase Activation is easier to deal with. If he wants Dex then he has to sacrifice an action to ‘pump up.’ The duration on the charge will determine how expensive this power becomes. 1 Turn or 1 Minutes works best for me. If the Player tries to make this 1 Hour or more then I would suggest that he just buy the Dex with no limitations. To ‘recover’ the charge the her must have the Dex boost inactive for as long as it was previously on. So if he was at Dex 50 for a turn then he would have to wait a turn at Dex 20 to re-active the power.

That little power setup makes me uncomfortable. I’m not really against folks buying characteristics as powers but let me ask you a few questions…. Do the limitations on the power really limit him? How long does the dex bump last? Gestures is a limitation that is sometimes disallowed in superheroic games … and in the case of gestures for dex only at the start of power with no time limit on the power … well that just doesn’t seem limiting to me. GM: “You see a dark wearhouse….†Player: “I activate my kata!†GM: (2 game hours later) “You are attacked. Phase 12 everybody.†Player: “Good thing my kata is still active!†IMO that’s not nearly worth the -1/2 he is getting. If you are tied up you don’t generally need +30 Dex anyway. IMO a limitation that is not limiting is not worth any points. The delayed phase is also a bit problematical without the time limits, but I can see one way to use it against him. Any sort of surprise situation will have him in Phase 12 stuck at DEX 20 with all that implies both DCV wise and in terms of when he can act. The player can pretty much write off doing anything useful in Phase 12 if he wants that extra 30 Dex. I’m still not sure that I would allow it without some sort of time limit on the Dex boost itself but it *could* be limiting in some circumstances. Also, just a note, but if this power is in any sort of framework he will not get any SPD bump from it either … but if it is a standalone and doesn’t have the ‘Doesn’t affect figured Characteristics’ limitation on it using this power will result in a speed change. You might want to look at the rules regarding speed changes in FREd. I would strongly suggest that this ‘Dex Kata’ have said limitation required if it is not in a framework. YMMV but I hope all this helps.

The Savage Dragon is a good example of a low rPD rED brick. However he has lots of Body and Regeneration to back it up.... Low resistant defenses can work. In this case with 17 DCV it should be workable. Shesh. 17! Does this guy have any non-combat skills? What is his ECV? Please don't tell me that his DEX is 50....

Typically with clairvoyance you pick a spot to scan in your first action, in your case say the library. Then on your next action you pick another point and scan it. IMO it would take about 18 actions to scan each room and both hallways. More if you want to view a room from more than one spot and look in closets, etc. With a SPD 5 character that would be about a minute or so. Personally, in general, I tend to favor MPs over ECs though, provided that you have the points and your GMs approval you can use both. The advantage of an EC is that you can use all the powers in it at once at full strength. The advantage of a MP is that you can generally have a wider variety of powers or flavors of one. And you *can* use more than just one power at a time in a MP so you don’t have to have more than one. I’ve seen characters build with separate movement MPs & attack MPs, but I thing that just having one big one is better. For instance: 92 MP: Psychic Powers (92 point pool) 12m Ego Attack (5d6) 1/2 End [62] 6u Telepathy (10d6) 1/2 End [62] 6u Clairvoyance [60] 6u Telekinesis (STR 14, Fine Manipulation) BOECV (+1) [62] 6u Teleportation (15â€, x4 Mass, x32 NCM) [60] 3u Force Field (10, 10) 0 End [30] 3u Flight (10â€) 1/2 End, Works in Water [30] 3u Mind Scan (6d6) [30] With this setup you can use one 60 point power and one 30 point power at the same time, like Ego Attack and Force Field. Or you could use Flight, Force Field, and still be able to do a 2&1/2d6 Ego Attack, though you wouldn’t be able to use the TK or Teleportation. It’s fairly easy to add new powers to a MP later, but harder to add to an EC.

A 2d6 RKA with Area Hex and +2 Stun Multiplier might do the trick. His comrads will be mostly immune to the attack but he will not be.