Sean Waters

Re: Advice needed: Multi->One Character. You obviously spend more time worrying about villain points than I do. I'd buy the big guy then have multiform accidental change when he loses half his BODY. Something like that.

Re: How to handle page number citations on 5ER

Re: Oihid

Re: concept vs. booklegal To be honest I'd be slightly less concerned about letting you get away with combining two modes of movement if they were not in the same multipower. The FAQ suggests that a teleport can move a flyer and 'preserve momentum', but I can see a game logic argument for not allowing you to do that to yourself: when you move you have to move in one way at a time. When you impose movement on someone else it doesn't switch off their own movement. I still think you should just buy position shift and 'no turn mode' for the flight - you need to cross the intervening space with the teleport anyway. Another thought (if this is 'inertialess superspeed you can't see me') would be to buy triggered invisibility (whenever you do a move through) which means that you would be getting significant combat bonuses - assuming that is what you are after - without any of this combining movement modes mularkey. You've probably got enough points in the reserve to have both on at once.

Re: concept vs. booklegal You can't turn at all with leaping, so it is moot. That is why it is so cheap though.

Re: Oihid To my mind OIHID means you have NO ACCESS to the powers unless you change to hero ID, so I don't think Superman has OIHID: he still has the powers as CK, he just is shy about using them (although he always finds a way if he needs to).. I always play OIHID as they only have the powers in hero ID, otherwise it is just part of the points you get for Secret ID. Also I would feel uncomfortable about letting non-combat powers benefit from OIHID: you will very very rarely be prevented from using non combat powers no matter what special effects your OIHID might have. Maybe if you can only use your devastating social skills when you are dressed in tights and a cape... Realistically the only (well main) time OIHID is a disadvantage is when you are ambushed in normal ID, and so it is only really the powers that would be useful in thatsituation that I'd normally allow you to buy with OIHID - i.e. stuff you might want to abort to or otherwise defend yourself with. Hugh Neilson and OddHat have it right, I feel. Now who wants 'only in Normal ID'....as a superhero I'm rubbish, but in my normal ID I'm a god....

Re: Advice needed: Multi->One Character. Can you tell me: is the compound character the whole team combining, or is this being built for a single player?

Re: Mind Control Arrow, Help with one of Steve's rulings I'd go with the continuing charges, personally. Not quite as effective as uncontrolled and continuous, but so much cheaper it makes me feel like singing. I don't see that the maintenance by continuing charge is a legality issue: Here's the bit from the FAQ: ...but charges are not '0 END', the mechanic works more like you are buying tiny END reserves, so a continuing charge is feeding END into the power for you. Hugh Neilson's point about the multipower thing is a good one - you can not maintain if you switch slots (that is in FRED).... OH IT WAS ALL GOING SO WELL...just read continuing charges and you can only use it with a constant or persistent power and MC is instant, so you'll need the +1 continuous advantage (or +1 for 0 END persistent), but the continuing charges will replace the need for uncontrolled. Looks like I won't be singing after all. Actually that is a good thing...

Re: New damage shield construction Boy are you right! It might be interesting to get a concensus, perhaps post a poll, but then it might be a long poll list. 1. Damage shield is fine leave it alone 2. I don't like having to take 'no range' and not getting a limitation 3. I don't like having to pay for continuous on top of the DS advantage 4. I don't like the way you can't use the power as you normally would in addition to the DS effect 5. I don't like the wallpaper in here (there is always one...) Anyone think of any more to add? Preferably not about the decor.

Re: Oihid Miracle Man comic. Miracle Man is like Superman plus. He is almost all-powerful. He has to say a magic word to change from normal to 'god mode' (Kimota...sort of atomic backwards) Big explosion all around him when he changes. Really dramatic. Anyway, Evelyn Cream, something like a villain, gets in a lift with Mike Moran (MM in human form) and a mother and baby combo. Mike is asked to hold the baby and then Evelyn reveals he is there to shoot Mike, which he does. Can't change or it is crispy baby... Same comic, there is a word that turns MM back into Mike Moran, forcing a reversal of OIHID. He also changes back when he says Kimota, whether he wants to or not. That doesn't happen often... OK, that isn't how it works in HERO but there has to be some disadvantage to changing, even if it is only a time delay. You can always build other effects as outlined above. Something to spend those extra points on... I do think OIHID is misused. I wouldn't allow it normally for purely offensive powers without good reason (you'll be in hero ID if you want to use them anyway so it isn't much of a disadvantage), but they are fine for defensive or part defensive powers and characteristics (including strength) so long as you define how the change takes place. It can be devastating to a group to get hit out of Hero ID by a well prepared villain - one or two might get taken down before the fight gets going. You wouldn't want it to happen all the time, but for the points saving the player has to expect a quite serious down side now and then.

Re: Enchanted Armor It is like finding a 4d6 HKA magic sword, do you only pay for the top 2d6 because a normal sword can do that anyway? The cost reflects they synergy advantages of having two useful items in one. Like a combined coat hanger and cigarette lighter. What a fantastic idea. I'd buy that for a dollar....

Re: How to handle page number citations on 5ER

Re: Activation and RSR But if you can negate a limitation for less points than you save, it is no longer a limitation, it is just a cost break. A non-limiting limitation wouldn't be worth anything, so if you negated it the points you saved would go away...

Re: Advice needed: Multi->One Character.

You can build a continuous EB No range One Hex AE, personal immunity, like a damage shield but cheaper and more effective: an 8d6 EB built this way would cost 73 points as against a DS of the same power which would cost 100. You can make it 4" radius for only 86 points. You don't need to grab anyone to damage them, just stand close. Buy lots of running. Run close to lots of opponents. Run past the tough ones several times. If you can do this in a half move you can end with a martial dodge, because you haven't made an attack roll yet...OK, eventually someone will twig and hold an action...then you abort to that dodge early... I can only think that this must be wrong, but can anyone tell me why? (OK the second version might be a LITTLE unpopular with team mates if you are not a bit careful...but you it is still darned effective and you could voluntarily limit the radius to (say) one hex radius (seven hexes)). Oh and the END cost is marginally higher, but END is cheap... Here's a thought as well - you can buy UBO for the personal immunity part of the new construct, so for just 12 more points you could exempt up to 8 people from taking damage from your attack (or 5 points for one). Can't do that with Damage Shield...

Re: Shield of Confusion So this thread is my hand.... Herein lies (some of) my confusion. You see, with damage shield, you get hurt if you punch the spike,but also if the spike grabs you. We could capitalise it and set it in the Buffyverse if that helps... If the spike grabs you, it IS doing an attack roll. If that is not attacking with the damage shield, then you CAN'T attack with the attack power that the DS is built on, which seems daft. To take a similar example, you could build a continuous EB No range One Hex AE, personal immunity...like a damage shield but cheaper and more effective (an 8d6 EB built this way would cost 73 points as against a DS of the same power which would cost 100). That wouldn't require an attack roll. If you had two of them in an EC would it be OK two attack with both of them at the same time? What if they weren't continuing....? ON THE PLUS SIDE I think I am seeing some light. I can accept that if you turn on two powers in an EC on (say) two seperate phases, and they are continuing attacks then you are not doing a multiple power attack, even if you are using both to damage the same target. Fully accept that, no conflict involved using two DSs you have already switched on. What I've been concentrating on , however, is the first phase...the one where you activate your powers. Activating a power is zero phase, so you can do it to any and all EC powers, no problem, and the two DSs are 'on' so grabbing someone deals the damage. It just seems wrong. If I buy AE Radius for my damage shield to simulate a bigger flaming aura, causing damage with a DS is not an attack action, I can circumvent in effect the rule that says that an attack ends your phase. Buy 30" of running, run past any number of targets and hurt hem all. Take no OCV or DCV penalties (it isn't an attack) and finish your run past with a martial dodge, do you are safe until next turn. OK you may say I need to grab by each target - in which case the AE radius is pointless - and we revert to the above example of a continuing personal immunity AE EB - which clearly would not require a grab roll. I may be getting way off subject, but there is something broken in here somewhere....

Re: Social "Combat' and "Duels" Strongly agree with your comments. Mind you, NPCs can't really influence PCs either...no matter how good their persuasion roll, the PC can always say. 'No, I'm not going to let you have a look at my gun'. (You might be able to do it with a skill like conversation, where the NPC is trying to subtly obtain information...maybe). This means that NPCs are at a massive disadvantage against PCs, short of using PRE attacks or powers. Whilst I appreciate that the average game is going to involve the PCs getting info from NPCs much more than the other way around, there are situations where it would be nice to have a workable mechanic for NPCs (or in some situations, PCs) influencing PCs, without some deus ex 'OK...good roll...hand the gun over' 'No, but...' 'No buts, he's got the gun' 'Hang on I'd never...' 'While you are flapping your jaw he shoots you...take 6 Body and 24 Stun...' The other problem with social interaction is the very simplicity of it...it is usually resolved with one roll, or a skill and complementary skill at best, which makes things far more uncertain. Whilst uncertainly is essential, it does have a bit of a lottery feel to it, in many cases, and a more developed system would ideally allow a bit more structure in social interaction, whilst leaving room for role playing. Any stunning ideas? One possibilty that springs to mind is making continuing opposed rolls, and counting the amount you succeed or fail by as 'damage'. You need to get your target's EGO to make them do something in a social situation. If you get (minus) EGO it has the opposite effect that you were trying for - you turned them against you. Continuing rolls will suffer penalties for repeat attempts unless you leave time between them...say at least a 5 hours. EGO 'damage' for a particular attempt 'heals' at 5 points per day....so against a strong willed or socially skilled opponent you will need to really take your time to make them do anything. That would mean that weak willed NPCs with little social skill would be easy marks, and even PC v. PC would work - one PC doesn't have to remain engaged in the situation if they don't like how it is going, but if they do, they should have to role play out the consequences (treat it as a temporary psychological limitation). In effect you would be treating social interaction as a power - a small cumulative NND (skill v skill test) mental transform.

Re: Shield of Confusion Activating an EB doesn't require an attack roll. Damaging something with it does. Activating a DS doesn't require an attack roll, damaging something with it does - a grab roll (after which it follows the rules for continuous attacks). My understanding is that a DS requires END every phase it is on whether or not it is causing damage.

Re: Shield of Confusion

Re: Advice needed: Multi->One Character. There is a big difference between vehicles and bases, which have their own inherent limitations, on the one hand and characters on the other. Like I said earlier in this thread, if the whole team wanted to combine, I'd probably allow it as everyone would be treated equally (although I can see arguments over who gets the legs, who gets the mouth etc...). If a single character wanted to build this construct I think it would be (highly) abusive to allow one player to control several characters that could share the cost of combining into a single powerful form, especially when there is a solid game mechanic to accomplish this (a MP with duplication and multiform). You couldn't get as much power out of the game legal version, but that may well be why it is written that way. Re-reading this again I have thought of a way to 'cheat': Base character has duplication (4 additional forms, must recombine when multiform activated) and a SMALL multiform to a powerful character - so it obviously won't work as you don't have the points - and a small aid to own Multiform. Each of the duplicates has an aid to aid. Dupe 1 aids Dupe 2's aid who aids dupe 3'd aid who aid's dupe 4's aid who aids base character's aid who then boosts his own multiform to horrific proportions and....well the base character's multiform would be boosted by over 100 points even if each dupe only had 3d6 aid... That is so slow and clunky I'd probably even let them get away with it...

Re: Double Knockback too pricey? Can't always apply common sense to game rules: if the first hit to do KB did KB, none of the other shots would hit at all, and there would be immense advantages to defining your autofire as several shots arriving simultaneously (a multi-barrelled gun, for example). If you are unhappy with that I'd certainly allow someone to buy a limited form of autofire (-1/4 less advantage) that says that the any shot that does KB where the autofire is against a single target stops the sequence. Alternatively you could think of autofire HA in this way: it is not the same blow each time, but a combination finishing with a powerful blow - the one that does KB (if at all). The actual order of damage rolled really is not important and (by standard rules) it is only one blow that will actually do KB anyway.

Re: How to handle page number citations on 5ER Yeah, in crayon: JULIE

Anyone got any idea why damage shield requires you to take 'no range' but not as a limitation? That just favours using powers which are already 'no range' and upsets the balance of attack powers IMO.

Re: Shield of Confusion Well, pile enough stuff on top of a molehill, and one day...anyway, using terms like 'logical syllogism' is just asking for trouble. Sometimes if it looks like a horse, sounds like a horse and the excrement is good for your garden, it IS a horse. Or a zebra. The, or a point is that FRED does tend to define things quite tightly most of the time. Linked attacks are seperately defined, and have their own rules. No problem there. The rules are very clear that you can NOT link slots in an EC to work together (top of FRED 204), but it would probably be a further syllositic fallacy to say that this goes towards proving my point. You can link powers in a slot but then you are limited to the active points of the EC, at least if you want to get a cost break. Being allowed to attack with two different slots in an EC at the same time seems to violate the spirit of ECs, which are already a cost efficient way of spending points. So you can't link EC slots, you can't use them together in a multiple power attack and yet still, somehow, it is OK to have two DSs in the same EC working together and both causing damage to a target at the same time. If it is a special case, fine. I just want to know what it is.

Re: How to handle page number citations on 5ER So we need a name, yeah? I think we should call the new book ''Julie" No one can retro-fit that one to the book title...but suggestions on a post card to...